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Old 06-13-2019, 11:58 AM
 
20,187 posts, read 23,850,642 times
Reputation: 9283

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie53 View Post
It is not a real person because I said so or that you dispute it, but because it simply isn't.

Checkmate.
It isn't a game... A fetus is a person whether you like it or not.... There is no such thing as a half-person or a fake-person

 
Old 06-13-2019, 11:59 AM
 
62,938 posts, read 29,126,415 times
Reputation: 18575
Quote:
Originally Posted by nng View Post
I totally agree with you. all those unwanted babies won't pay for themselves. Republicans are so foolish and so self righteous when it comes to abortion.
I mean, if necessary, would so called pro-lifers be okay with having their taxes raised to 50 to 60 percent to pay for millions of unwanted babies? I don't think so. I support keeping abortion legal because a women should have a right to control her own body, and as a society I don't think we can handle the millions of unwanted babies that would surely be born if this nation banned abortion completely. I mean, look what happened in Romania when ceausescu banned abortion completely. Thousands of children wound up in the states' care, languishing in awful conditions. I don't want that to happen here.
She had the right to control her own body before she engaged in unprotected sex or didn't use birth control properly. After that it isn't just her body involved if she gets pregnant. By the way, I'm not opposed to abortion under certain circumstances.

Last edited by Oldglory; 06-13-2019 at 12:33 PM..
 
Old 06-13-2019, 12:00 PM
 
12,883 posts, read 13,984,298 times
Reputation: 18451
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilnewbie View Post
If people just look the other way when the Nazis killed the Jews... Or maybe the police would not answer anymore attempted murders then it will be okay with everyone's conscience....
Over 90% of abortions occur in the first trimester. Are you really comparing non-viable fetuses who were never aware of their existence or anything else to living people killed in genocide?

Of course you are. This is why it is impossible to argue with a pro-lifer. You see non-viable fetuses as equal to the living, breathing, fully functioning women they grow inside and rely on until they become viable and until they are born. You see abortion as "murder" even though it has occurred probably since the beginning of humanity, was legal at common law, and was never considered actual murder in the US. And even though in many states a fetus cannot be a person who can be legally murdered unless it was born and drew a breath - aka until it became a person. All this tell you that throughout history a fetus has generally not been considered to be a person the same way a born, living human is.

But sure, they are totally equal because your feelings say so.
 
Old 06-13-2019, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,630,499 times
Reputation: 9676
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMS02760 View Post
The pro life crowd could care less about these children after they are born. They are then someone else's concern.
Many pro-lifers advocate the government require poor parents to give up their own flesh and blood to adoption to parents who can afford to take of them.
 
Old 06-13-2019, 12:05 PM
 
20,187 posts, read 23,850,642 times
Reputation: 9283
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
Over 90% of abortions occur in the first trimester. Are you really comparing non-viable fetuses who were never aware of their existence or anything else to living people killed in genocide?

Of course you are. This is why it is impossible to argue with a pro-lifer. You see non-viable fetuses as equal to the living, breathing, fully functioning women they grow inside and rely on until they become viable and until they are born. You see abortion as "murder" even though it has occurred probably since the beginning of humanity, was legal at common law, and was never considered actual murder in the US. And even though in many states a fetus cannot be a person who can be legally murdered unless it was born and drew a breath - aka until it became a person.

But sure, they are totally equal because your feelings say so.
Just because it isn't viable before the first trimester, doesn't make it less of a person... A child is not a full functioning but they are not any less of a person... Just because it has occurred for a long time or the lack of the ability to draw breath doesn't make it less of a person... You are coming up with reasons to make a person not a real person anymore...
I understand, it would be pretty terrible that you are killing people as long as the law designate as not real people... But it's still a person.... It's not about feelings... Its because I recognize the future of this person and this person is here now.... What we choose to do with this person is the topic of conversation....
 
Old 06-13-2019, 12:05 PM
 
4,288 posts, read 2,058,815 times
Reputation: 2815
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewjdeg View Post
That's ridiculous though. What about people that take necessary precautions and still end up pregnant by accident? Making them put the baby up for adoption is extreme.
That was addressed in my final point. But the overwhelming majority of pregnancies can be avoided with precautions.
“Finally I am willing to pay the taxes to help when the parents cannot afford it.”
 
Old 06-13-2019, 12:06 PM
 
12,883 posts, read 13,984,298 times
Reputation: 18451
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilnewbie View Post
Just because it isn't viable before the first trimester, doesn't make it less of a person... A child is not a full functioning but they are not any less of a person... Just because it has occurred for a long time or the lack of the ability to draw breath doesn't make it less of a person... You are coming up with reasons to make a person not a real person anymore... But it's still a person.... It's not about feelings... Its because I recognize the future of this person and this person is here now.... What we choose to do with this person is the topic of conversation....
This is purely your opinion.

"Person" has legal meaning. It has to be defined or anything could be a person for the purposes of any law that has "person" in it.
 
Old 06-13-2019, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,630,499 times
Reputation: 9676
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilnewbie View Post
It isn't a game... A fetus is a person whether you like it or not.... There is no such thing as a half-person or a fake-person
The voters of Mississippi and Colorado, who voted against the personhood amendment, would disagree with you. And the outcome of the votes weren't even close.
 
Old 06-13-2019, 12:08 PM
 
20,187 posts, read 23,850,642 times
Reputation: 9283
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
This is purely your opinion.

"Person" has legal meaning. It has to be defined or anything could be a person.
Of course it has a legal opinion, that makes feel better about this person ? The law can saw whatever it want... It used to say that females and non-whites were property too and there was a lot of logical arguments for it... A fetus is still a person... And abortion is killing a person...
 
Old 06-13-2019, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Ohio
15,700 posts, read 17,042,433 times
Reputation: 22091
Quote:
Originally Posted by PHL10 View Post
No one is forcing anything.

You shouldn't be legally allowed to kill people. Just because I don't want someone murdered, doesn't mean that I now am financially obligated to support them. This pro-abortion argument that keeps being trotted out is just not logical.
A fetus is not a person. It is not a someone. It is not logical to think a fetus is a person.

If a fetus is a person, a someone, why don't father's pay fetal support? Why aren't father's responsible for half of its medical bills?
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