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Old 06-24-2019, 07:33 AM
 
15,068 posts, read 6,110,466 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnesthesiaMD View Post
What were the laws when those people “came without papers for a better life”?

Immigration laws were necessary after tax payer funded social services were implemented.

Clearly, it would be unsustainable to allow unlimited amounts of poverty stricken people into a country that provides welfare, food stamps, section 8 housing, Medicaid, social security, etc, etc, etc.

It was different at a time when, you came here and were forced to support yourself. If you didn’t work, you starved, were homeless, you went without tax payer funded medical care.

And dont take this as an argument against these programs. It is not. It is an argument against bankrupting the United States with an open border policy that allows the world’s poor people to flood the country and be eligible for all kinds of money paid by the current citizens.
Immigration laws were only set up largely enforced against non-whites after killing out and enslaving non-whites. Whites had came in droves and then had access to government welfare programs for decades while non-whites were excluded. It was fine when whites were the ones flooding the borders and soaking up handouts.

We never had and never will have an open border policy. No one is advocating that here. It is just funny that when the origins of the immigrants changed and African-Americans gain access entry that all of a sudden government welfare programs and immigration are such big issues. It’s simply who has access. That is all.
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Old 06-24-2019, 07:33 AM
 
Location: Cali
14,043 posts, read 4,449,730 times
Reputation: 8172
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineDeCoeur View Post
What handouts? There are no handouts to be given. I simply don’t object to African-Americans receiving compensation long due their ancestors and even grandparents and parents for centuries of mistreatment. Why should I object to this country’s attempt to do the right thing?

If you want Oprah’s mailing address, seek her out. Don’t be lazy.

BTW, I never said my parents are non-native English speakers. You made that up and keep repeating it.
Well, you said your parents are nonwhites immigrants so i'd assume they are non-native English speakers. That is my fault.

But it's confirmed by you that your parents are NONWHITE IMMIGRANTS who have achieved the AMERICAN DREAM in short amount of time. Therefore, AA can also do the same if not faster because they are native US citizens for generations. Reparation and victimhood are not needed
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Old 06-24-2019, 07:36 AM
 
Location: Cali
14,043 posts, read 4,449,730 times
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Also, it is handouts when you don't earn it. Let me ask my coworkers if they have been brutally treated by working for no pay at our job.
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Old 06-24-2019, 07:36 AM
 
15,068 posts, read 6,110,466 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Du Ma View Post
Well, you said your parents are no whites immigrants so i'd assume they are non-native English speakers. That is my fault.

But it's confirmed by you that your parents are NONWHITE IMMIGRANTS who have achieved the AMERICAN DREAM in short amount of time. Therefore, AA can also do the same if not faster because they are native US citizens for generations. Reparation and victimhood are not needed
It is about doing paying a debt rightfully owed. Acknowledging wrong and doing what should be done to rectify them is not a problem for some of us. Let them decide whether or not to accept the compensation. The country would have still taken a step in the right direction.
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Old 06-24-2019, 07:40 AM
 
15,068 posts, read 6,110,466 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Du Ma View Post
Also, it is handouts when you don't earn it. Let me ask my coworkers if they have been brutally treated by working for no pay at our job.
At least you admit it. So since the ancestors of AAs did not receive just compensation for their labor, the compensation should go to their estate and be distributed to their descendants. That’s what we do in this country. Same for those who suffered under Jim Crow although more of them are alive. It’s not that difficult.
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Old 06-24-2019, 07:48 AM
 
Location: NJ/NY
18,415 posts, read 15,125,594 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineDeCoeur View Post
Immigration laws were only set up largely enforced against non-whites after killing out and enslaving non-whites. Whites had came in droves and then had access to government welfare programs for decades while non-whites were excluded. It was fine when whites were the ones flooding the borders and soaking up handouts.

We never had and never will have an open border policy. No one is advocating that here. It is just funny that when the origins of the immigrants changed and African-Americans gain access entry that all of a sudden government welfare programs and immigration are such big issues. It’s simply who has access. That is all.
You are revising history. These government programs started in the 1930s until the present. When all these “white people” that you are talking about, came, these programs did not exist. People were allowed to die in the street. Life was cheap. Hell, people died in construction accidents, and their bodies were hauled off while people gathered around to beg for the newly opened job. If you were poor and sick, you had to hope some religious oriented hospital would take you in as a charity patient, but many just ended up dying. If you were starving, again, you had to beg for charity. Same with if you were homeless. The government wasn’t involved, and neither was the tax payer.

If you want to go back to that, sure, let them all in. Otherwise, we need limitations. If you are not advocating open borders, what are you advocating? It seems to me like you think that anyone who can make it to our country has a right to citizenship. Isn’t that “open borders”. Who shouldn’t be allowed to come in your opinion? Who should be kicked out? If we only kick out the “bad people” that isn’t nearly enough. It is simple economics.
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Old 06-24-2019, 07:58 AM
 
15,068 posts, read 6,110,466 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnesthesiaMD View Post
You are revising history. These government programs started in the 1930s until the present. When all these “white people” that you are talking about, came, these programs did not exist. People were allowed to die in the street. Life was cheap. Hell, people died in construction accidents, and their bodies were hauled off while people gathered around to beg for the newly opened job. If you were poor and sick, you had to hope some religious oriented hospital would take you in as a charity patient, but many just ended up dying. If you were starving, again, you had to beg for charity. Same with if you were homeless. The government wasn’t involved, and neither was the tax payer.

If you want to go back to that, sure, let them all in. Otherwise, we need limitations. If you are not advocating open borders, what are you advocating? It seems to me like you think that anyone who can make it to our country has a right to citizenship. Isn’t that “open borders”. Who shouldn’t be allowed to come in your opinion? Who should be kicked out? If we only kick out the “bad people” that isn’t nearly enough. It is simple economics.
Not at all. Government programs did start in the 1930s and were largely inaccessible to non-whites until the 1960s. How are you not aware of that?

How Today’s White Middle Class Was Made Possible By Welfare - In These Times

Now you decide to ask. Immigration laws should be enforced but not conveniently and in a biased manner. I will leave it at that for now because that’s a huge discussion.
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Old 06-24-2019, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Cali
14,043 posts, read 4,449,730 times
Reputation: 8172
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineDeCoeur View Post
It is about doing paying a debt rightfully owed. Acknowledging wrong and doing what should be done to rectify them is not a problem for some of us. Let them decide whether or not to accept the compensation. The country would have still taken a step in the right direction.
Well, it is my problem when it is coming from my tax money.

I am not going to acknowledge anything, or make any apology, or pay anyone anything because my ancestors did not own black slaves.
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Old 06-24-2019, 08:05 AM
 
15,068 posts, read 6,110,466 times
Reputation: 5121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Du Ma View Post
Well, it is my problem when it is coming from my tax money.

I am not going to acknowledge anything, or make any apology, or pay anyone anything because my ancestors did not own black slaves.
Good for you...and I am not opposed to the attempt to rectify the situation by ensuring the debt is paid.
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Old 06-24-2019, 08:07 AM
 
23,739 posts, read 14,858,155 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thriftylefty View Post





For some black people these hardships are not a big deal. I first got the black treatment from my white kindergarten teacher. So I have made the necessary adjustments early in life. Later I would be frisked in public at the local grocery store. "Just checking you boy." If my experiences are from growing up in an; educated, church going,boy scout, respectable black Midwestern family, I shudder to think about parts of the south where there is no law for black people.

These white people I have encountered are ignorant pawns of a much larger system of institutionalized racism. They have internalized and act upon every negative piece of disinformation about black people they are taught. Clearly the legacy of slavery is not what it did to black people, its what it did to white people.



And most will never see what it did to them.

My neighbor and I had a conversation about Jim Crow. We are the same age, grew up 50 miles apart.

While I was learning everything i could about the rotten system, she never saw anything strange. It was not odd that blacks had separate water fountains, sat at the back of the bus, and in the balcony at the movies. She saw nothing strange about separate but unequal schools. The blacks in my state got the old hand me down textbooks when the white schools got new ones. The whites got the best teachers, and on and on. To this day, she accepts all that behavior as perfectly normal. And does not see that the system that kept AA down also kept her in her place.
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