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Old 07-16-2019, 08:52 AM
 
Location: A Nation Possessed
25,680 posts, read 18,770,132 times
Reputation: 22524

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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
This HUUUUGE injustice, crimes against humanity as it is known today, happened. But we should just look the other way as a nation with an Oh well, it is over now. Except it isn't. Without reconciliation there can be no meaningful forward motion.
Reconciliation for what? For something that happened to people who have been dead for over a hundred years? Tell you what, dig 'em up, put a twenty dollar gold piece in each coffin and rebury them if you think it will do anything for them now.

The "forward motion" happened a hundred and fifty some-odd years ago when over 500,000 WHITE folks decided slavery was wrong and gave their lives ending it. So, yeah. It is over. They won. They died. Slavery ended. I know that is a news flash for you, but it did happen. So instead of spitting on their graves, have some gratitude. There is nobody alive right now that lived as a slave in the United States. So there is nothing to apologize for, unless you want to apologize to the half million union soldiers who were slaughtered on the battlefield to free blacks. But I think it is time to move on.

 
Old 07-16-2019, 08:55 AM
 
3,354 posts, read 1,182,470 times
Reputation: 2278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
Give an example of racial profiling where every variable except race is equal, leaving race as the sole determinant in a proven null hypothesis. By all means.

In housing and lending, give an example where all relevant financial measures, including credit score, work history, income, savings, debt-to-income ratio and collateral are all held equal and the only difference between applicants is race, yet still results ina provable null hypothesis on race discrimination. By all means.

I was being allegorical, not literal. Don't be the guy who goes down the pedantic fallacy route.

The reconciliation you speak of is rent seeking. Some form of compensatory "payment" is being sought, as if this will be some panacea that cures all historical ills. Whether it be in some manner of preferential treatment (see: "Affirmative Action"), special recognition (see: "Black/Hispanice History Month") or actual rent (see: "government assistance programs that are based specifically on race and exclude white people"), there is compensation being sought. White guilt becomes institutionalized and monetized as some form of perpetual apologetic bureaucracy. Be intellectually honest about that which you seek.
Rent in ghettos, same as reservations. They aren't getting anything of value in exchange. That would be impossible.
 
Old 07-16-2019, 08:56 AM
 
Location: East Lansing, MI
28,353 posts, read 16,366,782 times
Reputation: 10467
"Marianne Williamson asks...."


Who? Never heard of her.
 
Old 07-16-2019, 08:59 AM
 
78,324 posts, read 60,517,579 times
Reputation: 49616
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
I'll give you point #1. Not the other. I still stand by my statement. If we did this we would not have needed #1.
The problem is that if you oppress a group for a long period of time they do not have the accumulated wealth, family history of education etc.

As such, even if you had a completely colorblind society today the inequity of the starting points would still be unequal. Black families would still be on average more likely to be starting out in poverty.

The failure to recognize that wouldn't just get you called "unwoken" but racist these days. Keeping in mind that the word racist is broadly and swung around more than Ron Jeremy's 3rd leg.

This is the entire core argument behind reparations and other things as well and if we're being honest it's certainly got a least some degree of merit. (I'm talking about the phenomenon in general)
 
Old 07-16-2019, 09:00 AM
 
5,101 posts, read 2,046,599 times
Reputation: 2319
Should the Mongols apologize for what their ancestors leaded by Genghis Khan did a long time ago?

Btw, just imagine what if blacks asked to descendent of Jewish merchants to apologize for the slave-ships?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRrfnGvSJDw

Then, if Egpytians were blacks, will they apologize to Jewish people for slavery?
 
Old 07-16-2019, 09:01 AM
 
3,354 posts, read 1,182,470 times
Reputation: 2278
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
It's all simply people. If you want to divide, have at it.
No, it's not simply anything except for those who would rather conveniently tuck the issues away, keep them out of sight.
 
Old 07-16-2019, 09:06 AM
 
79,913 posts, read 44,161,983 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
The problem is that if you oppress a group for a long period of time they do not have the accumulated wealth, family history of education etc.

As such, even if you had a completely colorblind society today the inequity of the starting points would still be unequal. Black families would still be on average more likely to be starting out in poverty.
We can argue that the starting points were not equal but that doesn't excuse that even in my lifetime blacks weren't even allowed to drink from the same water fountain and we still to this day have done little about our two tiered justice system.

Quote:
The failure to recognize that wouldn't just get you called "unwoken" but racist these days. Keeping in mind that the word racist is broadly and swung around more than Ron Jeremy's 3rd leg.

This is the entire core argument behind reparations and other things as well and if we're being honest it's certainly got a least some degree of merit. (I'm talking about the phenomenon in general)
I said from the beginning that there was a merit to it. I do not really support how it is presented here and stated why. If you wish to see things not based in color you have to do so. As I stated, if a child of an illegal is not responsible for the sins of the parent, neither is someone about something a great, great, great, great grandfather did.

We are still responsible for the continued inequalities.
 
Old 07-16-2019, 09:07 AM
 
Location: Florida
33,547 posts, read 18,140,185 times
Reputation: 15524
Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
This HUUUUGE injustice, crimes against humanity as it is known today, happened. But we should just look the other way as a nation with an Oh well, it is over now. Except it isn't. Without reconciliation there can be no meaningful forward motion.
God will judge if I am a racist. I have always treated black people with kindness and respect. I have no white guilt. I never oppressed any black person, yet I had a black person oppress me at a position I held and it was unjust . I never thought about it in race terms before but since the left wants to divide us in colors I was oppressed by a black person. I used to think of it as just a person.
 
Old 07-16-2019, 09:08 AM
 
79,913 posts, read 44,161,983 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by aileesic View Post
No, it's not simply anything except for those who would rather conveniently tuck the issues away, keep them out of sight.
What makes an Australian different than you? Where they live? Taken to it's conclusion, you are arguing your next door neighbor is different than you.

It's all simply human beings.
 
Old 07-16-2019, 09:10 AM
 
3,354 posts, read 1,182,470 times
Reputation: 2278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hrw-500 View Post
Should the Mongols apologize for what their ancestors leaded by Genghis Khan did a long time ago?

Btw, just imagine what if blacks asked to descendent of Jewish merchants to apologize for the slave-ships?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRrfnGvSJDw

Then, if Egpytians were blacks, will they apologize to Jewish people for slavery?
I really don't care to apologize to anyone for anything, and don't want anyone apologizing to me. But blacks and whites have been at it for quite a while now. Everyone else in the world has already divided up into their own people and cultures. I would like both sides to admit their wrongs and then go their own way.
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