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How difficult is it for you to understand "anachronism?"
The amusing thing is that had you lived then, you'd be a slave owner or supported slavery, so don't try to act all high and mighty as though you're superior, because you're not.
Slavery today would be shameful, but then so is demanding that people in the distant past conform to current societal mores and values, when those people are long dead and gone.
I for one am not talking about people in the distant past, long dead and gone, conforming to today's standards. I'm talking about people of today, right this minute, saying people "in the distant past" did not really support and uphold racism and slavery when the historical facts show that they did, in direct opposition to their loudly stated and publicized founding principles of all people being created equal and being free in the United States. I am also talking about people of today, right this minute, excusing and/or denying, deflecting, and trying to politicize the fact that racism and slavery (yes slavery, it comes in many forms) are still supported -- literally -- by many today right here in these United States.
Except Democrats are filled with nothing but criticism.
If you want a country to improve (and why wouldn't you?), look for places where it can do better. And don't refuse to acknowledge problems, past and present.
The amusing thing is that had you lived then, you'd be a slave owner or supported slavery, so don't try to act all high and mighty as though you're superior, because you're not.
I can trace both sides of the family back to 1500 or so and none of them supported slavery or were slave owners of any sort........
Most people, of course, would not be. It was only those who made their living in that fashion....or the related industries.
You act as if Slavery was not frowned upon by Western Civilization, in thought if not in deed, for almost 1,000 years! That's a long time.
" Louis X of France, who had abolished slavery within the Kingdom of France in 1315. He passed a law which would have abolished colonial slavery in 1542, although this law was not passed in the largest colonial states, and it was not enforced as a result."
Doing the usual dance of "it's all the same" and "they all did it" doesn't pass muster with the USA allowing its disenfranchisement within law until the 1960's (the Civil Rights and Voting Rights acts) and, in fact, having many citizens today who still basically support the ideals (like that woman who ran for city council recents, etc.)...
Ignorance was an excuse at some point - as was tradition and force. But relatively enlightened people have been busy trying to abolish this thinking for many centuries.
Acting as it is some ancient bygone era is not accurate.
3000 years of the Institution of Slavery and all we have to talk about is the last 150 years of it. In not wanting to discuss the ancients and how it all became as it was, is the reason most folks have no understanding and from what I get, they don't want to understand it, but point fingers instead.
Debtors' prison, of the ancients, many sold themselves into slavery in order to have their tax debts paid ... then later it morphed, into those who were barbaric in nature, kidnapped people and sold them into slavery ... then the African Lords ... this discussion just gets crazier from there.
Oh the stigma of it all ...
Truth be told there isn't one person a live today that does not have an ancestor who at one time served as a slave in service to a master. That's it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun
True, but Americans, and whites, and Christians specifically, were the worst slavers in history, and Reparations must be paid
Thomas Jefferson signed the Treaty of Tripoli, in effort to save and free the British that had been captured, which interesting enough is the only document signed that states the u.s. is not a Christian nation.
There is a long (3000 year) history of slavery that encompasses every one. Who is paying reparations for whom? I'd say the bill [from the 16th to the 19th century,] should be given to the African Lords for creating the slave trade market and only if one can prove that the Europeans knew at the time of the trading, that those people had been kidnapped, and were not apart of the traditional Institution of Slavery ... would then a case could be made.
Yeah, sure dude, conservatives say that. And, of course the only salvation for a guilty feeling White or Christian is to join the Democrat party
I don't feel guilty about slavery. I feel morally outraged that people are trying to say it wasn't so awful and that the suffering of those people are of no consequence because many of their descendants are doing OK.
I can trace both sides of the family back to 1500 or so and none of them supported slavery or were slave owners of any sort........
Most people, of course, would not be. It was only those who made their living in that fashion....or the related industries.
You act as if Slavery was not frowned upon by Western Civilization, in thought if not in deed, for almost 1,000 years! That's a long time.
" Louis X of France, who had abolished slavery within the Kingdom of France in 1315. He passed a law which would have abolished colonial slavery in 1542, although this law was not passed in the largest colonial states, and it was not enforced as a result."
Doing the usual dance of "it's all the same" and "they all did it" doesn't pass muster with the USA allowing its disenfranchisement within law until the 1960's (the Civil Rights and Voting Rights acts) and, in fact, having many citizens today who still basically support the ideals (like that woman who ran for city council recents, etc.)...
Ignorance was an excuse at some point - as was tradition and force. But relatively enlightened people have been busy trying to abolish this thinking for many centuries.
Acting as it is some ancient bygone era is not accurate.
Quote:
You act as if Slavery was not frowned upon by Western Civilization, in thought if not in deed, for almost 1,000 years!
It was frowned upon long before the Western Civilization was even thought about as the world was thought to be flat. If we look at the Biblical authors who wrote, where as, they entered into a Covenant with God ... ablib but in essence ... they would abide by man's law and make family member of the people in whose tax debts they had purchased. And if we think debtors' prison isn't back ... think again. The difference for modern society, no one can pay your taxes for you and buy you out of debt in exchange for labor. A person gets upside down in their taxes, they go to the pokey and serve their time. I think this is the reason for the Sovereign Citizens Movement, which is expanding across continents.
Quote:
Acting as it is some ancient bygone era is not accurate.
If people do not know their history, what do they say happens?
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell
Truth be told there isn't one person a live today that does not have an ancestor who at one time served as a slave in service to a master. That's it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tamiznluv
My Nana was a "slave". She was an indentured servant. She freely "sold herself" in order to come to The United States.
Give me a break. If anyone should pay, it's the Portuguese who first sold slaves.
Given the way things are now, I think it's time to give up the reparation schtick. More freeloading.
Your comment made me look up the Germans as they are my ancestors ...
"Because of the cost of passage—which exceeded half a year’s income for a typical British immigrant and a full year’s income for a typical German immigrant—only a small portion of European migrants could afford to pay for their passage to the Americas (Grubb 1985a). They did so by signing contracts, or “indentures,” committing themselves to work for a fixed number of years in the future—their labor being their only viable asset—with British merchants, who then sold these contracts to colonists after their ship reached America. Indentured servitude was introduced by the Virginia Company in 1619 and appears to have arisen from a combination of the terms of two other types of labor contract widely used in England at the time: service in husbandry and apprenticeship (Galenson 1981)."
The slave trade didn't begin in what is now the United States until 1619. The first Black slaves were actually brought to the mainland in 1526 with Lucas Vazquez de Ayllon to do the work of building a colony in what is present-day Georgetown, South Carolina.
Portuguese slave traders worked the west coast of Africa probably as early as the 14th century. When the Spaniards came across to the Americas, they also enslaved native peoples and forced them to mine gold.
Slavery in the United States would have been almost a negligible footnote in history if it had not been for the arrival here of White men. Fact.
Here is a paragraph from the article and part I put in bold:
Quote:
Slavery was not introduced to “America” by whites at Jamestown. The Native American tribes here had a long history of enslaving each other and once blacks arrived, they enslaved them too.Some American blacks owned slaves. In some parts of the south, a greater percentage of free blacks owned slaves than whites. Only a small percentage of whites owned slaves. Slavery was not unique to America; it has existed throughout the world since before recorded history. In 1619, although slavery had been banned in Europe, it flourished in Africa.
Native Americans have had inter-tribal and intra-tribal conflicts for centuries and this includes slavery and rape. So, why do we cherry pick the year 1619? Is it the earliest year that we have documentation for the specifics on colonial era slavery?
Virginia Company of London, 1619, wake some people up, cause they owe me some money. It was a turning point in history, it seems, so may be that is why they pick it.
"Just as there were free black populations in Spanish and Portuguese colonies, there were some free black people in Virginia before the laws codified race-based slavery in the late 17th century; for example, Anthony Johnson owned land in the 1650s. Earlier this year, Virginia Governor Ralph Northam referred to the long history of racism in the U.S. as dating back 400 years to “the first indentured servants from Africa” landing at Point Comfort in an interview with CBS This Morning. But co-host Gayle King quickly added that their servitude is “also known as slavery,” and many observers agreed that “indentured servant” was in this case merely a euphemism for slavery."(my bold)
The slave trade didn't begin in what is now the United States until 1619. The first Black slaves were actually brought to the mainland in 1526 with Lucas Vazquez de Ayllon to do the work of building a colony in what is present-day Georgetown, South Carolina.
Portuguese slave traders worked the west coast of Africa probably as early as the 14th century. When the Spaniards came across to the Americas, they also enslaved native peoples and forced them to mine gold.
Slavery in the United States would have been almost a negligible footnote in history if it had not been for the arrival here of White men. Fact.
" Spain, Portugal, the Netherlands, England and France, were the main triangular trading countries."
and yet the u.s. is the one with the issue.
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In not wanting to discuss the ancients and how it all became as it was, is the reason most folks have no understanding and from what I get, they don't want to understand it, but point fingers instead. 
. And, of course the only salvation for a guilty feeling White or Christian is to join the Democrat party
If anyone should pay, it's the Portuguese who first sold slaves. 
It was a turning point in history, it seems, so may be that is why they pick it. 