NYT says "Airplanes took aim and brought down the WTC" (Baghdad, deaths)

[Hyperthetic]

Originally Posted by Lycanmaster

Don't forget about the five dancing Israelis as well

Trump dares not bring that up.

[Lycanmaster]

Originally Posted by Hyperthetic

Trump dares not bring that up.

If he values his life or those of his family members, yeah.

[Grlzrl]

Originally Posted by QuakerBaker

I think this is a good position.

You do not want to say "Muslims" did it, because that is about a billion people with the vast majority never wanting something like this to happen.

However, we often make errors in the opposite way when trying to avoid an error and they did when they said "airplanes."

Humans make mistakes. They should have simply said "Al Qaeda terrorists," which doesn't encompass the majority of Muslims, but isn't watered down PC either.

Maybe just say 'Some Muslims..." Or 'Some Radical Islamic terrorists'....

[Finn_Jarber]

Originally Posted by TEPLimey

For a group of people who regularly bash "libs" as "snowflakes," this has to be the most snowflakiest of threads I have ever seen.

Its one of the worst I have ever seen.

I think they miss the Obama years, when they felt justified to pour out this kind of fakeness on daily bases.

[buddy5]

That's the New York Times' version of ''Some people did something.''

[TEPLimey]

Trump has done a good job of turning a group of self-proclaimed independent rugged individuals into a bunch of whinging victims who can only be saved by Trump's particular brand of naked populism, I'll give him that.

[AHenriques1147]

Originally Posted by craigiri

Hmm, I take exception to that. Isn't Indonesia the largest Muslim country in the world?

And what about it? Everyone points to Indonesia as if it's some bastion of prosperity, minority and women's liberation. It's not. (Well, maybe as far as "Muslim majority" nations go... which isn't saying much). In fact, the NY Times recently ran an article about Islam become increasingly hardline in the country as well, shifting toward more "Arab" forms of Islam. This is exactly what's happening in Europe, too.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/15/w...ion-islam.html

Originally Posted by craigiri

Look, I feel that ALL fundie religions are nuts.....including any of my own (Jewish, Catholic, etc.).....and certainly Islam needs a reformation........

I don't think you understand how Islam isn't just going to magically go through a reformation. The European reformation of Christianity grew from very specific circumstances and cannot be divorced from time and place and cultural characteristics. Islam isn't just going to "reform" in the same way... and we really don't have the time to wait for it anymore.

The best strategy for the west is to reduce the influx of Muslims and resist Islamification. Rinse the influence of Islam right out of the existing populace and secularize/assimilate everyone who is here before letting more in. It's sort of like not allowing hundreds of millions of Nazis into your societies. Illiberal ideologies like Islam should similarly be kept at bay to the extent possible. This will require an end to the idea of cultural and religious relativism. Repeat the process so that Islamic politics don't end up accommodating growing blocs of Islamic constituents. The more Islamic a society, the more dangerous for progressive values. That's a fact of the modern world. And liberals need to swallow that jagged pill, as much as it hurts.

Already a grossly disproportionate amount of resources in the west are spent moderating the feelings of this minority religion and its adherents. Inluding a grossly disproportionate amount of policing, as Muslims commit acts of terror at rates 20-25X their representation in the general populace. It's absolutely hilarious watching Muslim values collide with LGBT groups in places like England, for example, where certain towns now have a critical mass of Muslim residents who can flex their "religious values" muscles in a land that has otherwise cleansed itself of religious influence. Until the new religion in town has come around to **** everything up again.


BTW, you know how Christianity "reformed?" People had the balls to call it out. To make fun of it. To blaspheme and to leave the religion. To write against it.

Islamapologists, clueless liberals, cultural relativists and (perhaps well intentioned but ultimately pollyannish) general excuse makers like you with your nonsense "Islamaphobia" words (no such thing, btw, anymore than there is such thing as "Republicanphobia")....actually thwart reformation of the religion.

Originally Posted by craigiri

BUT, as far as this thread goes....

1. Let's not pretend that Trump and the Right don't love the Saudis and aren't happy with them buying 100's of billions in weaponry and being given nuke technology.
In the USA, money talks and it does not matter whose money it is.

Honestly, screw the Saudis. The entire middle east and North Africa - except Israel - is an absolute festering boil on humanity's collective ass. Nothing has been contributed to the betterment of mankind in that region since about... oh... 1200AD. That region should be cut off from the world, as it only produces extremist religion, terrorists, and oil.

Originally Posted by craigiri

2. My real take - and this may be brutal to many - is that Islamaphobics (like many phobics) are most upset that some DARE fight back against the hegemony of the USA. How dare they? Don't they know we have accurate GPS?

Take those two together and most of it makes sense.

Give me a break. Islam is a supremacist religion at its core. It's also expansionist and imperial, as history has borne out (indeed, Muslim colonization and imperial period lasted way longer than the European one).

Muslims are upset that they have been promised to rule the world under a universal Ummah, and have seen that goal slip away as the west ascended after thwarting Islam's imperial rape and pillage of the entire world. They had a really good go in the expansion years after Mohammed and his band of merry men conquered and colonized large parts of the world. Now they're all secretly pining for the caliphate again.


Again, without the west (lead by the US) hunger for oil the Middle East would be an absolute wasteland. 1billion people whose full potential is retarded by a religion that at its most liberal is about as progressive as evangelical conservative sects in America.

Originally Posted by craigiri

The really strange thing is this. Muslims both I and some members of my family (some are Islamophobes!) have dealt with on a personal level are not only great people, but in many ways "superior" (intelligence, work ethic, family) to many of other (or no) religion.

There's no accounting for otherwise smart people who choose to believe in nonsense "Johnny come lately" religions such as Islam.

Same thing with Mormons (who in their small numbers are arguably more productive and innovative than the entire Muslim population of the world combined - and certainly more so than the Middle East outside of Israel).... I can't explain it. I just know it's garbage, and it's high time people stop being afraid to confront these dumb religions. Islam in particular.


But anyway, if Muslims were indeed "superior" to everyone else in their ethics and family lives and academia, their nations wouldn't rank at the bottom of most every human development and freedom index. And the godless nations of Europe wouldn't be the most productive and free and fair places for minorities to live.

Originally Posted by craigiri

Islam has that to some degree also....but at the same time most are not evangelists.

They aren't Muslim evangelists in the US because the numbers are small. But don't pretend that there isn't Muslim evangelism in the Muslim world... and beyond.

I constantly get targeted ads (because I read up on and study religion) from Islamic organizations seeking to spread and build mosques around the world, and begging for money to do it.

[jazzarama]

Originally Posted by craigiri

Here is a very basic question.

Will Trump admit there are more Al-Queda and ISIS in Iraq and Syria and Afghanistan than ever before?

Of course not. Find me the tweet. I'm sure it says he defeated them...that is why this happened this week.....

https://www.airforcetimes.com/flashp...-iraqi-island/

Billions of dollars to "deny them vegetation". Sounds like Agent Orange again!

What in the world does your irrelevant very basic irrelevant have to do with the NYTimes tweet ? Nothing. A diversion to Trump won't work on me.

Airplanes 'took aim at' Pearl Harbor in 1941. Airplanes 'took aim at' Baghdad in 2003. It's a stupid phrase the writers and editors must have spent hours working on to avoid words like Islam, Muslim, Al-Qaeda, terrorist. [btw, they deleted that tweet.]

[AHenriques1147]

Originally Posted by jazzarama

What in the world does your very basic question irrelevant question have to do with the NYTimes tweet ? Nothing. A diversion to Trump won't work on me.

Airplanes 'took aim at' Pearl Harbor in 1941. Airplanes 'took aim at' Baghdad in 2003. It's a stupid phrase the writers and editors must have spent hours working on to avoid words like Islam, Muslim, Al-Qaeda, terrorist. [btw, they deleted that tweet.]

Same way "Trucks" spontaneously and deliberately run over people in Christmas markets in northern Europe or beach towns in southern France.

They're scared because this is a religion that hits back with force if it feels aggrieved ... AND dummy white liberals associate Islam with brown and black people who they need to protect with their benevolent whiteness. So it's a two-fer.

[Checkmarkblue]

Originally Posted by Checkmarkblue

The big problem with the progressive, woke, social justice left and intersectional types is that they don't understand the turbulent history of Islam. When the left looks at Islam, the left only accepts the history of Islam during the abbasid period which began during the overthrow of the umayyad dynasty and lasted until the sacking of Bahgdad by the Mongol forces of ghengiz khan descendents. The left wants the Islam of the abbasid period which had rights for women, women can go to school, and homosexuality was not criminalized or penalized, and religious tolerance for minority sects like Christian, Jews and non Abrahamic faiths. This is the Islam that the Left academia in the Anglo Saxon world wants. But sadly that variant of sunni Islam allowed the Islamic Arab world to decline. When liberal and secular Baghdad fell, Arabs lost power which shifted west, first with the Turks, than with the western Europeans.

Whabbi and radical Muslims do not approve of homosexuality and feminism. And also do not approve of equity for opposed persons except for themselves. If the left wants to bring back a more secular liberal variant of sunni Islam. The left must force Islam into another schism in which Muslims and women have equal or greater rights than straight men and which homosexuality is not penalized.

Islam did not hijack the planes, it was radical Islam that did. Sadly woke types don't want to paint a negative brush or distinguish or distinction between Islam and radical Islam.

You have to remember that in the Anglo Saxon modern day academics. If anyone critics Islamic faith. You will be labeled a racist due to the fact that Islam is a religion of brown and black people. And historically the west has oppressed Islam with the crusades, reconquista, colonization and neocolonization.

Who ever repped me in my above post. Thank you.