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Old 09-14-2019, 06:36 AM
 
13,900 posts, read 9,743,620 times
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The anti-vaccine trend is part of a larger problem where no nothings think they know everything.

 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:06 AM
 
26,661 posts, read 13,656,836 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
This is from your link:
"Goldman looked at VAERS data from 1990 to 2010 for hospitalizations and deaths after vaccinations and found a statistically significant positive correlation between mortality and receipt of five to eight vaccines compared to one to four."

So why are you bringing up a different doctor and claiming it's not VAERS-related?
That part was relevant to the case as was Goldman's role in that portion of the case. Did you even look at the link? That was just one tiny piece of the evidence that led to the conclusion that vaccines played a role in JB’s death.

Dr. Douglas Miller also provided testimony if you look at the link you will see that and a tiny snippet of it was what I quoted. You assumed it was a different Miller. You might want to at least skim through the document.

This was a case where vaccines did play a role in a child’s death and people still won’t even acknowledge it. This is partially why there is no trust.
 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:10 AM
 
26,661 posts, read 13,656,836 times
Reputation: 19118
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
His decision is not supported by the statement that he does not believe vaccines cause SIDS. It's a schizophrenic conclusion.

Same experts, different case, different Special Master, different opinion.

https://www.courtlistener.com/opinio...uman-services/

Upheld on appeal:

https://www.courtlistener.com/opinio...uman-services/
This is a different case. One of the same experts but not all the same experts. Vaccines can lead to SIDS deaths in some individuals that does not mean they cause death in all. The first case I shared stands. Why are you trying to take that away from he family who vaccinated on schedule and then lost their child? Vaccines are not always safe for everyone and every circumstances. Your can’t even admit or acknowledge it when it happens and is documented. This is why there is no trust.
 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:16 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,419,263 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
That part was relevant to the case as was Goldman's role in that portion of the case. Did you even look at the link? That was just one tiny piece of the evidence that led to the conclusion that vaccines played a role in JB’s death.

Dr. Douglas Miller also provided testimony if you look at the link you will see that and a tiny snippet of it was what I quoted. You assumed it was a different Miller. You might want to at least skim through the document.

This was a case where vaccines did play a role in a child’s death and people still won’t even acknowledge it. This is partially why there is no trust.
I was replying to what I addressed. I made no assumption about any Dr. Miller.
 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:18 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,419,263 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
This is a different case. One of the same experts but not all the same experts. Vaccines can lead to SIDS deaths in some individuals that does not mean they cause death in all. The first case I shared stands. Why are you trying to take that away from he family who vaccinated on schedule and then lost their child? Vaccines are not always safe for everyone and every circumstances. Your can’t even admit or acknowledge it when it happens and is documented. This is why there is no trust.
Vaccines do not cause SIDS. One person's "expert witness" testimony does not make it so.
 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:18 AM
 
26,661 posts, read 13,656,836 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
Good grief.

There is no such thing as "vaccine induced" herd immunity. Herd immunity is produced by both vaccination and immunity due to having the disease. You know, the concept is really not that difficult. The more people in a community are immune to a disease, the fewer susceptible people there are to catch the infection, and the less likely it is for anyone to be exposed to it. I think a fifth grader could understand that.
Yet immunity one obtains through natural infection differs from immunity obtained from a vaccine. That mean difference being one is generally life long and others varies. That throws a giant wrench into the herd immunity theory when applied to vaccines vs natural infection. Maybe you could convince a fifth grader that they are the same thing but you’d be manipulating them into believing something that’s not totally true.




Quote:
Evidence that vaccines do cause autism DOESN'T EXIST.
Actually it does, particularly or note that African American boys are at an increased risk depending on the timing of the vaccine. That info was covered up for a long time but is now known.
 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:25 AM
 
26,661 posts, read 13,656,836 times
Reputation: 19118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
I was replying to what I addressed. I made no assumption about any Dr. Miller.

You posted a comment after my initial post which referenced Miller by name and a link to an “NZ Miller” noting he was a psychologist.
 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:26 AM
 
26,661 posts, read 13,656,836 times
Reputation: 19118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
Vaccines do not cause SIDS. One person's "expert witness" testimony does not make it so.

Except sometimes they do cause sids, along with other co-factors which are clearly noted in the court opinion. Vaccines played a role in this boys death. There was more then one expert witness. I’m sorry but you have to read the case in full. It’s long but at least skim through.

Sometimes there are adverse reactions to vaccines. Sometimes people really are injured. Sometimes they die. Just acknowledge it because it’s true. That would go a long way towards building trust.
 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:39 AM
 
10,195 posts, read 6,266,403 times
Reputation: 11268
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
No one claims vaccines are "perfectly reliable, perfectly safe, and perfectly effective."

The fact that they are not 100% effective is one of the reasons that herd immunity is so important.

However, the risk of a serious adverse reaction to any vaccine is tiny compared to the risk of the disease it prevents.



The threat from a vaccine preventable disease is only "potential" as long as vaccination rates are high enough to provide herd immunity. The recent outbreaks in NY are testament to what happens when a localized community has rates that are too low.



What makes you think you are not being protected by herd immunity?

Your anecdote makes no sense.



The choice of the majority in this country to vaccinate against measles is the reason measles no longer circulates in the wild in the US. The same for other vaccine preventable diseases. You do not get them, even if you do not use vaccines, because other people do use them.



Vaccines do not cause autism. It is genetic.



The vaccine cannot cause whooping cough. The organisms in it are dead.

No one has "hidden" any vaccine. The components of any vaccine containing pertussis are clearly described in the Vaccine Information Sheet given with each injection.

Please explain how polio was eradicated worldwide, even in countries with abysmal sanitation.



If you do not get the primary infection then you do not get the secondary one.



The risk of a serious adverse reaction to a vaccine is about one in a million. Deaths are so rare it is hard to count them.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4599698/

Vaccines do not cause autism.

This physician is a vaccine expert. His daughter has autism. He advocates for vaccination.



https://www.tmc.edu/news/2018/11/a-v...an-autism-dad/

Sorry, Suzy, the vaccinted herd is not protecting me, or my generation, from getting measles, mumps, ruebella, or chicken pox. Those diseases gave us lifetime natural immunity. You can also add to this group all those 1,900 people who recently had measles in this outbreak. NONE of them died, and will not need a measles vaccination.

You can also add in there is no vaccinated herd immunity for the flu. Putting aside there is no "herd" for that, it is also very ineffective. You can add Pertussis in this category as well.
 
Old 09-14-2019, 07:39 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,419,263 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
Except sometimes they do cause sids, along with other co-factors which are clearly noted in the court opinion. Vaccines played a role in this boys death. There was more then one expert witness. I’m sorry but you have to read the case in full. It’s long but at least skim through.

Sometimes there are adverse reactions to vaccines. Sometimes people really are injured. Sometimes they die. Just acknowledge it because it’s true. That would go a long way towards building trust.
Vaccines do not cause SIDS. No one is saying vaccines do not have side effects. I might remind you that when the old rotavirus vaccine was found to cause intussuception, it was PULLED FROM THE MARKET! You would be hard put to find ONE scientifically verified death from a vaccine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
You posted a comment after my initial post which referenced Miller by name and a link to an “NZ Miller” noting he was a psychologist.
Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea culpa! Neil Miller works with Goldman.
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