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Old 10-02-2019, 08:35 PM
 
18,544 posts, read 7,288,258 times
Reputation: 11348

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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonync View Post
this from trump’s press conference today:

It was a simple question:

(what did you want from zelensky?)

asked with respect by one of the most decent and fair reporters in washington.


This is the crux of the matter!

Trump didn’t answer the question

1- it’s now obvious to even trump that asking for a favor from zelensky is illegal
it is 100% legal. And the most routine thing in the world. Anyone who thinks it's illegal for the President to ask another head of state for a favor is deranged.

Last edited by hbdwihdh378y9; 10-02-2019 at 08:50 PM..

 
Old 10-02-2019, 08:46 PM
 
18,544 posts, read 7,288,258 times
Reputation: 11348
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbythegreat View Post
Bill Clinton actually committed crimes, obstruction of justice and perjury, as of yet Trump hasn't been shown to have committed any crime.
Or even alleged to have committed any crime.
 
Old 10-02-2019, 08:48 PM
 
18,544 posts, read 7,288,258 times
Reputation: 11348
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
Wrong.

The Mueller report documented at least a dozen instances of obstruction of justice.
It recited some facts. It did not say that any of them violated any statute. You have taken those facts and -- ignorant of the applicable law -- turned them into crimes. They weren't.
 
Old 10-02-2019, 08:51 PM
 
Location: Florida
23,795 posts, read 13,176,846 times
Reputation: 19952
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbythegreat View Post
Bill Clinton actually committed crimes, obstruction of justice and perjury, as of yet Trump hasn't been shown to have committed any crime.

I mean that's just objectively the facts.
Actually, objectively those are not the facts. They are opinions, otherwise known in Trumplandia as 'alternative facts.'
 
Old 10-02-2019, 08:51 PM
 
51,583 posts, read 25,570,349 times
Reputation: 37781
Looks like Pence is involved as he traveled to Ukraine after Trump's phone call.

One of Pence's staff members was in on the call, Pence received a transcript of the call in question, and later memos on the call before he traveled to Ukraine to discuss withholding military aid.

As he did with Flynn, I suspect Pence will claim he knew nothing about all this.

Or maybe he'll confess. Who knows?

Last edited by GotHereQuickAsICould; 10-02-2019 at 09:08 PM..
 
Old 10-02-2019, 08:57 PM
 
8,860 posts, read 2,489,452 times
Reputation: 4644
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigma777 View Post
Actually, objectively those are not the facts. They are opinions, otherwise known in Trumplandia as 'alternative facts.'
No, you're wrong kiddo, it's objectively a fact that Bill Clinton committed perjury and obstruction of justice. It's also objectively a fact that Trump has yet to be shown to have committed a crime.

It's okay if you are ignorant as to these objective facts, it's okay if you are merely too biased to admit to them. Neither of those conditions will change anything though. The facts are the facts.

Feel free to excuse Bill Clinton's crimes as many others often do, but denying they happened at all makes you look a bit ridiculous
 
Old 10-02-2019, 09:06 PM
 
51,583 posts, read 25,570,349 times
Reputation: 37781
Quote:
Originally Posted by hbdwihdh378y9 View Post
It recited some facts. It did not say that any of them violated any statute. You have taken those facts and -- ignorant of the applicable law -- turned them into crimes. They weren't.
You are misinformed.

Obstruction of justice is a crime.

18 U.S.C. § 1503 defines "obstruction of justice" as an act that "corruptly or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, influences, obstructs, or impedes, or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede, the due administration of justice."

More info here.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/obstruction_of_justice

The Mueller report laid out the evidence for at least 10 (might have been 12, I read it some time ago), instances of obstruction of justice.

Barr was clear that Trump would not be charged with these or any other crimes as there was a DOJ memo/policy about the DOJ not indicting a sitting President. The report was clear that Congress, not the courts, was the appropriate body to pursue these crimes.
 
Old 10-02-2019, 09:21 PM
 
Location: Texas
9,189 posts, read 7,563,263 times
Reputation: 7801
"You talkin to me?"
 
Old 10-02-2019, 09:23 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
36,883 posts, read 18,863,013 times
Reputation: 14738
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister 7 View Post
Now Trump is a child rapist?

Just like The Guardian is a legit source. The article posted sounded almost as ridiculous as your post(s). Almost.
He and Epstein were codefendants in a lawsuit by a girl who was 13 at the time the rape took place. Have you forgotten already?

Which awards have your news sources won, out of curiosity...?
 
Old 10-02-2019, 09:23 PM
 
18,544 posts, read 7,288,258 times
Reputation: 11348
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
You are misinformed.

Obstruction of justice is a crime.

18 U.S.C. § 1503 defines "obstruction of justice" as an act that "corruptly or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, influences, obstructs, or impedes, or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede, the due administration of justice."

More info here.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/obstruction_of_justice

The Mueller report laid out the evidence for at least 10 (might have been 12, I read it some time ago), instances of obstruction of justice.

Barr was clear that Trump would not be charged with these or any other crimes as there was a DOJ memo/policy about the DOJ not indicting a sitting President. The report was clear that Congress, not the courts, was the appropriate body to pursue these crimes.
You don't understand the law.

Quote:
18 U.S.C. § 1503 defines "obstruction of justice" as an act that "corruptly or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication, influences, obstructs, or impedes, or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede, the due administration of justice."
That is false. It doesn't define "obstruction of justice" at all. Read it yourself:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1503

The thing about Mueller and the DOJ policy is false. Mueller repeatedly stated and testified that that did not come into play because he did not make a determination as to whether any of those "episodes" constituted an obstruction crime.
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