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Old 09-25-2019, 01:11 PM
 
2 posts, read 488 times
Reputation: 14

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I’ve often wondered why most of the climate change articles I’ve seen in the media and most of the online discussions in forums like this one
make a big point of expressing anger towards conservatives and/or science “deniers”.

This does not make any logical sense to me for three reasons.

First of all. The left wing absolutely and monolithically DOMINATES the narrative on this issue! With maybe the exception of Fox news and
right wing radio. Almost ANY media reporting on climate change is pretty much going to be the liberal narrative.
Before I go any further, allow me to define what I consider the left wing narrative and the right wing narrative:

Left wing narrative: It’s real, it’s manmade and it’s dangerous. The science does not lie. We only have X number of years left to act before it’s
too late.

Right wing narrative: Anywhere from believing it’s a hoax to being skeptical of the severity or man’s influence. Believing science is subject to
bais, corruption, groupthink and hubris and is not infallible.

So. The left wing narrative pretty much dominates. Look at any climate change reporting in print or TV. On the internet, skeptical websites in
Google, on YouTube or Wikipedia are often either hard to find or have a disclaimer next to them proclaiming them to be biased or false.
You pretty much have to actively seek out skeptical sources of info and you pretty can’t avoid left wing leaning sources of info on this subject.

Then, we can get into the educational system. Both primary and higher education. This is almost entirely the left wing narrative.

So, now that we’ve established how much the left dominates the narrative on this topic, it seems kind of silly to expend all of this anger
railing against conservatives and “deniers” when they have a very small voice and influence.


The second major reason is there is no political will, even among the true believers! Look at the riots in France last year and the chilly reception to the Green New Deal, even among democrats! When the rubber hits the road, no one wants to ACTUALLY make drastic changes to our way of life. Taxes go up in France
and they nearly burn the entire city down! Celebrities and world leaders who lecture us on this issue continue to jet around the world and do not limit
their lifestyle in the slightest. The notion that we will give up the conveniences of modern life is a fiction. We all like to virtue signal about how
much we care and how green we are but nobody wants to give up airline travel or central heating!

The last major reason is the biggest! China! They have at least TWICE the CO2 output that we do and they are increasing while ours is slightly declining.
You could take every single conservative and science “denier” and have them fully onboard. The US could magically stop emitting CO2 tomorrow and it
would not make much difference! This is the number one reason why this argument is so illogical to me. Why is all of this energy spent getting angry at
conservatives and deniers when, if you REALLY cared about the issue, you’d learn Chinese and protest their energy use!


This is what drives me crazy about how this issue is discussed. It’s painted as these greedy conservatives and science deniers who are standing in the
way of saving the planet!
Meanwhile, if you have even a small amount of common sense you’d quickly realize that:

1. Conservatives really don’t have a big voice in this issue.
2. There is no political will to make hard changes, even among the true believers.
3. China uses twice the CO2 we do and they want to keep growing their society and influence.

Why? I think the left is basically intolerant of any views other than their own and can’t stand it that there is a group of people who challenge or are not
in 100% lockstep with their narrative. So they lash out in anger.

When, if they REALLY cared about the environment and the threats of climate change that they purport to believe in, they would be directing their efforts
towards changing the political will to make hard changes (maybe even by example) and directing their anger towards the Chinese!
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Old 09-25-2019, 01:17 PM
 
30,087 posts, read 18,701,618 times
Reputation: 20908
Quote:
Originally Posted by blacklabsarebest View Post
I’ve often wondered why most of the climate change articles I’ve seen in the media and most of the online discussions in forums like this one
make a big point of expressing anger towards conservatives and/or science “deniers”.

This does not make any logical sense to me for three reasons.

First of all. The left wing absolutely and monolithically DOMINATES the narrative on this issue! With maybe the exception of Fox news and
right wing radio. Almost ANY media reporting on climate change is pretty much going to be the liberal narrative.
Before I go any further, allow me to define what I consider the left wing narrative and the right wing narrative:

Left wing narrative: It’s real, it’s manmade and it’s dangerous. The science does not lie. We only have X number of years left to act before it’s
too late.

Right wing narrative: Anywhere from believing it’s a hoax to being skeptical of the severity or man’s influence. Believing science is subject to
bais, corruption, groupthink and hubris and is not infallible.

So. The left wing narrative pretty much dominates. Look at any climate change reporting in print or TV. On the internet, skeptical websites in
Google, on YouTube or Wikipedia are often either hard to find or have a disclaimer next to them proclaiming them to be biased or false.
You pretty much have to actively seek out skeptical sources of info and you pretty can’t avoid left wing leaning sources of info on this subject.

Then, we can get into the educational system. Both primary and higher education. This is almost entirely the left wing narrative.

So, now that we’ve established how much the left dominates the narrative on this topic, it seems kind of silly to expend all of this anger
railing against conservatives and “deniers” when they have a very small voice and influence.


The second major reason is there is no political will, even among the true believers! Look at the riots in France last year and the chilly reception to the Green New Deal, even among democrats! When the rubber hits the road, no one wants to ACTUALLY make drastic changes to our way of life. Taxes go up in France
and they nearly burn the entire city down! Celebrities and world leaders who lecture us on this issue continue to jet around the world and do not limit
their lifestyle in the slightest. The notion that we will give up the conveniences of modern life is a fiction. We all like to virtue signal about how
much we care and how green we are but nobody wants to give up airline travel or central heating!

The last major reason is the biggest! China! They have at least TWICE the CO2 output that we do and they are increasing while ours is slightly declining.
You could take every single conservative and science “denier” and have them fully onboard. The US could magically stop emitting CO2 tomorrow and it
would not make much difference! This is the number one reason why this argument is so illogical to me. Why is all of this energy spent getting angry at
conservatives and deniers when, if you REALLY cared about the issue, you’d learn Chinese and protest their energy use!


This is what drives me crazy about how this issue is discussed. It’s painted as these greedy conservatives and science deniers who are standing in the
way of saving the planet!
Meanwhile, if you have even a small amount of common sense you’d quickly realize that:

1. Conservatives really don’t have a big voice in this issue.
2. There is no political will to make hard changes, even among the true believers.
3. China uses twice the CO2 we do and they want to keep growing their society and influence.

Why? I think the left is basically intolerant of any views other than their own and can’t stand it that there is a group of people who challenge or are not
in 100% lockstep with their narrative. So they lash out in anger.

When, if they REALLY cared about the environment and the threats of climate change that they purport to believe in, they would be directing their efforts
towards changing the political will to make hard changes (maybe even by example) and directing their anger towards the Chinese!


"Why? I think the left is basically intolerant of any views other than their own and can’t stand it that there is a group of people who challenge or are not
in 100% lockstep with their narrative. So they lash out in anger. "


The above is exactly right. The left has become an extremist totalitarian movement which cannot and will not tolerate any views that do not agree with their agenda. The left is now what they purport to hate- a fascist movement that opposes free speech and individual liberty. Liberalism is a greater threat to American than was Japan and Germany in ww2, as they have voices in our government which are set upon destroying the nation.
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Old 09-25-2019, 02:34 PM
 
4,021 posts, read 1,805,185 times
Reputation: 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by blacklabsarebest View Post
This is what drives me crazy about how this issue is discussed. It’s painted as these greedy conservatives and science deniers who are standing in the
way of saving the planet!
Meanwhile, if you have even a small amount of common sense you’d quickly realize that:

1. Conservatives really don’t have a big voice in this issue.
2. There is no political will to make hard changes, even among the true believers.
3. China uses twice the CO2 we do and they want to keep growing their society and influence.
Really good post....!
You're spot on in so many ways.....but they a) won't agree, and b) won't stop the attack.
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Old 09-25-2019, 03:25 PM
 
45,251 posts, read 26,498,346 times
Reputation: 25006
Why are those who are skeptical of the science or the notion that politicians should tax and control the citizenry in attempts to achieve some climate ideal, labled as deniers?
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Old 09-25-2019, 03:37 PM
 
2 posts, read 488 times
Reputation: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
Why are those who are skeptical of the science or the notion that politicians should tax and control the citizenry in attempts to achieve some climate ideal, labled as deniers?

I never understood that either! There are even scientists who are labeled deniers if they don't 100% fall in line with the alarmist camp. Look at how they treat someone like Judith Curry!
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Old 09-25-2019, 07:05 PM
 
Location: USA
18,505 posts, read 9,183,958 times
Reputation: 8536
It’s comforting to believe that AGW can be solved by simply getting those evil Republicans out of the way.

It’s not so comforting to believe reality: that we have no economical solution to AGW.
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Old 09-25-2019, 07:07 PM
 
7,827 posts, read 3,389,587 times
Reputation: 5141
The way the left presents the argument with such vitriol only turns people away from their claims and arguments.
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Old 09-25-2019, 07:11 PM
 
3,346 posts, read 1,272,239 times
Reputation: 3174
It doesn’t matter what the Left or Right believes, it only matters what the scientific community that studies and researches this topic think.

I don’t see any peer-reviewed research agreeing with the denier viewpoints.

There is no research that says global warming is good for us and is completely natural.
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Old 09-25-2019, 07:12 PM
 
2,974 posts, read 1,987,448 times
Reputation: 3337
Quote:
Originally Posted by blacklabsarebest View Post
I never understood that either! There are even scientists who are labeled deniers if they don't 100% fall in line with the alarmist camp. Look at how they treat someone like Judith Curry!

...a real scientist knows there is no such thing as this, 'settled science' argument spouted by the global warming crowd...science, by it's very nature is never settled...ask Copernicus, Galileo or a medical doctor form a hundred years ago where 'blood letting' was an accepted scientific fact in curing many ailments...


...whenever you here the 'settled science' argument, laugh at them, then just walk away...
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Old 09-25-2019, 07:13 PM
 
Location: USA
18,505 posts, read 9,183,958 times
Reputation: 8536
Quote:
Originally Posted by justus978 View Post
...a real scientist knows there is no such thing as this, 'settled science' argument spouted by the global warming crowd...science, by it's very nature is never settled...ask Copernicus, Galileo or a medical doctor form a hundred years ago where 'blood letting' was an accepted scientific fact in curing many ailments...


...whenever you here the 'settled science' argument, laugh at them, then just walk away...
And yet it moves.
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