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I understand a lot of people can't stand Trump. I also believe there are plenty of reasons to dislike the man and can see why he inspires such contempt. Saying he is an obnoxious, narcissistic egomaniac who is a highly flawed individual would be understatement. For this and a few other reasons I simply couldn't pull the trigger in voting for him. Couldn't pull the trigger in voting for Hillary either btw.
Having said all that, I have to admit that from a strictly policy point of view I've been pleasantly surprised by the job Trump has done. Whether anything he has accomplished as president has been done more for altruistic reasons like genuine concern and care for his fellow Americans rather than for the glorification of his massive ego is up for debate, but it's hard to make an objective case that his economic policies and non interventionist foreign policies (with regard to expanding foreign wars) have been harmful to the country. Reasonable people can disagree with that assessment but the argument that Trump's entire presidency is simply an effort to "enrich himself and his family" seems illogical given that his brand had taken a massive hit that it wouldn't have otherwise sustained had he never sought and eventually won the 2016 election. The onslaught of vitriolic media attacks against him the second he became a serious threat to win in 2016 have only grown in intensity ever since which leads to my question...
What if the "Trumpkins" as they are derisively called are correct and their "conspiracy theories" that a soft coup led by high level "deep state" officials and leftovers from the Obama administration feeding anti-Trump lies and disinformation to a hostile and complicit left wing mainstream media was perpetrated against a duly elected president...i.e. Trump? What if...heaven forbid...the counter intelligence investigation and all the subsequent and non stop investigations since of Trump and anyone associated with his campaign and presidency turn out to be duds? What if it turns out that people like General Flynn and others like him who have basically been bankrupted trying to defend themselves and have had in some cases stellar reputations ruined turn out to be innocent? Flynn eventually pled guilty to lying to the FBI but growing evidence seems to indicate the evidence for that charge is extremely flimsy and was possibly coerced when he was threatened by the SCO that they would go after his son. What about Carter Page's ruined reputation? Manafort who admittedly committed serious crimes but years old ones completely unrelated to Russian collusion that otherwise probably would have been overlooked if he actually had legit evidence to compose against Trump.
Given the damage and ruined lives all these investigations have left in their wake not to mention the incredible divisiveness they have caused to an already divided nation, what do you think should happen to the perpetrators of this deep state coup if in fact the "unthinkable" (i.e. high level deep staters with the help of the mainstream media attempted an illegal and seditious 3rd world Banana Republic style coup against a duly elected president) actually turns out to be true?
One thing I'll say is that there are a good number of conspiracy theories that turn out to have some level of truth behind them. Often it takes decades to find out though.
I understand a lot of people can't stand Trump. I also believe there are plenty of reasons to dislike the man and can see why he inspires such contempt. Saying he is an obnoxious, narcissistic egomaniac who is a highly flawed individual would be understatement. For this and a few other reasons I simply couldn't pull the trigger in voting for him. Couldn't pull the trigger in voting for Hillary either btw.
Having said all that, I have to admit that from a strictly policy point of view I've been pleasantly surprised by the job Trump has done. Whether anything he has accomplished as president has been done more for altruistic reasons like genuine concern and care for his fellow Americans rather than for the glorification of his massive ego is up for debate, but it's hard to make an objective case that his economic policies and non interventionist foreign policies (with regard to expanding foreign wars) have been harmful to the country. Reasonable people can disagree with that assessment but the argument that Trump's entire presidency is simply an effort to "enrich himself and his family" seems illogical given that his brand had taken a massive hit that it wouldn't have otherwise sustained had he never sought and eventually won the 2016 election. The onslaught of vitriolic media attacks against him the second he became a serious threat to win in 2016 have only grown in intensity ever since which leads to my question...
What if the "Trumpkins" as they are derisively called are correct and their "conspiracy theories" that a soft coup led by high level "deep state" officials and leftovers from the Obama administration feeding anti-Trump lies and disinformation to a hostile and complicit left wing mainstream media was perpetrated against a duly elected president...i.e. Trump? What if...heaven forbid...the counter intelligence investigation and all the subsequent and non stop investigations since of Trump and anyone associated with his campaign and presidency turn out to be duds? What if it turns out that people like General Flynn and others like him who have basically been bankrupted trying to defend themselves and have had in some cases stellar reputations ruined turn out to be innocent? Flynn eventually pled guilty to lying to the FBI but growing evidence seems to indicate the evidence for that charge is extremely flimsy and was possibly coerced when he was threatened by the SCO that they would go after his son. What about Carter Page's ruined reputation? Manafort who admittedly committed serious crimes but years old ones completely unrelated to Russian collusion that otherwise probably would have been overlooked if he actually had legit evidence to compose against Trump.
Given the damage and ruined lives all these investigations have left in their wake not to mention the incredible divisiveness they have caused to an already divided nation, what do you think should happen to the perpetrators of this deep state coup if in fact the "unthinkable" (i.e. high level deep staters with the help of the mainstream media attempted an illegal and seditious 3rd world Banana Republic style coup against a duly elected president) actually turns out to be true?
Is it really that hard to understand that Trump is such a crappy person that everyone who has a chance to crap on him, if for no other reason than to just f*** him over, takes it?
He's empirically a POS. His funeral is going to have 10 people show up outside of the immediate family.
That’s why he drug Pence into the Ukraine deal. He wants Republican senators to be staring down the choice of a Pelosi presidency, which they would obviously never vote for. But Pence, maybe.
Trump’s got plenty of issues just looking at his own tweets, appearances, and information released by the White House. No need for a conspiracy.
Status:
"Smartened up and walked away!"
(set 24 days ago)
11,775 posts, read 5,789,903 times
Reputation: 14198
Quote:
Originally Posted by 205
I understand a lot of people can't stand Trump. I also believe there are plenty of reasons to dislike the man and can see why he inspires such contempt. Saying he is an obnoxious, narcissistic egomaniac who is a highly flawed individual would be understatement. For this and a few other reasons I simply couldn't pull the trigger in voting for him. Couldn't pull the trigger in voting for Hillary either btw.
Having said all that, I have to admit that from a strictly policy point of view I've been pleasantly surprised by the job Trump has done. Whether anything he has accomplished as president has been done more for altruistic reasons like genuine concern and care for his fellow Americans rather than for the glorification of his massive ego is up for debate, but it's hard to make an objective case that his economic policies and non interventionist foreign policies (with regard to expanding foreign wars) have been harmful to the country. Reasonable people can disagree with that assessment but the argument that Trump's entire presidency is simply an effort to "enrich himself and his family" seems illogical given that his brand had taken a massive hit that it wouldn't have otherwise sustained had he never sought and eventually won the 2016 election. The onslaught of vitriolic media attacks against him the second he became a serious threat to win in 2016 have only grown in intensity ever since which leads to my question...
What if the "Trumpkins" as they are derisively called are correct and their "conspiracy theories" that a soft coup led by high level "deep state" officials and leftovers from the Obama administration feeding anti-Trump lies and disinformation to a hostile and complicit left wing mainstream media was perpetrated against a duly elected president...i.e. Trump? What if...heaven forbid...the counter intelligence investigation and all the subsequent and non stop investigations since of Trump and anyone associated with his campaign and presidency turn out to be duds? What if it turns out that people like General Flynn and others like him who have basically been bankrupted trying to defend themselves and have had in some cases stellar reputations ruined turn out to be innocent? Flynn eventually pled guilty to lying to the FBI but growing evidence seems to indicate the evidence for that charge is extremely flimsy and was possibly coerced when he was threatened by the SCO that they would go after his son. What about Carter Page's ruined reputation? Manafort who admittedly committed serious crimes but years old ones completely unrelated to Russian collusion that otherwise probably would have been overlooked if he actually had legit evidence to compose against Trump.
Given the damage and ruined lives all these investigations have left in their wake not to mention the incredible divisiveness they have caused to an already divided nation, what do you think should happen to the perpetrators of this deep state coup if in fact the "unthinkable" (i.e. high level deep staters with the help of the mainstream media attempted an illegal and seditious 3rd world Banana Republic style coup against a duly elected president) actually turns out to be true?
Nothing will happen to them. I voted for Trump but am not always happy with what he does or says. But like Hillary - anyone involved in the witch hunts will get a pass. Look at the millions of dollars wasted on these investigations.
I understand a lot of people can't stand Trump. I also believe there are plenty of reasons to dislike the man and can see why he inspires such contempt. Saying he is an obnoxious, narcissistic egomaniac who is a highly flawed individual would be understatement. For this and a few other reasons I simply couldn't pull the trigger in voting for him. Couldn't pull the trigger in voting for Hillary either btw.
Having said all that, I have to admit that from a strictly policy point of view I've been pleasantly surprised by the job Trump has done. Whether anything he has accomplished as president has been done more for altruistic reasons like genuine concern and care for his fellow Americans rather than for the glorification of his massive ego is up for debate, but it's hard to make an objective case that his economic policies and non interventionist foreign policies (with regard to expanding foreign wars) have been harmful to the country. Reasonable people can disagree with that assessment but the argument that Trump's entire presidency is simply an effort to "enrich himself and his family" seems illogical given that his brand had taken a massive hit that it wouldn't have otherwise sustained had he never sought and eventually won the 2016 election. The onslaught of vitriolic media attacks against him the second he became a serious threat to win in 2016 have only grown in intensity ever since which leads to my question...
What if the "Trumpkins" as they are derisively called are correct and their "conspiracy theories" that a soft coup led by high level "deep state" officials and leftovers from the Obama administration feeding anti-Trump lies and disinformation to a hostile and complicit left wing mainstream media was perpetrated against a duly elected president...i.e. Trump? What if...heaven forbid...the counter intelligence investigation and all the subsequent and non stop investigations since of Trump and anyone associated with his campaign and presidency turn out to be duds? What if it turns out that people like General Flynn and others like him who have basically been bankrupted trying to defend themselves and have had in some cases stellar reputations ruined turn out to be innocent? Flynn eventually pled guilty to lying to the FBI but growing evidence seems to indicate the evidence for that charge is extremely flimsy and was possibly coerced when he was threatened by the SCO that they would go after his son. What about Carter Page's ruined reputation? Manafort who admittedly committed serious crimes but years old ones completely unrelated to Russian collusion that otherwise probably would have been overlooked if he actually had legit evidence to compose against Trump.
Given the damage and ruined lives all these investigations have left in their wake not to mention the incredible divisiveness they have caused to an already divided nation, what do you think should happen to the perpetrators of this deep state coup if in fact the "unthinkable" (i.e. high level deep staters with the help of the mainstream media attempted an illegal and seditious 3rd world Banana Republic style coup against a duly elected president) actually turns out to be true?
It's all fair game as far as the Left is concerned.
To them, there is literally no means that aren't justified by their ends.
Interesting any thing out of the Oval Office no matter how obvious is a conspiracy theory
I have to admit I would roll my eyes early in his presidency when Trump started his "fake news" schtick. Just seemed too convenient and I thought the accusation of his campaign colluding with Russia was possible. While I thought Trump was incredibly arrogant and a narcissistic egomaniac, I reserved judgment because I didn't have this intense hatred for the man and wasn't totally invested in his downfall like so many here seem to be. I had problems with Trump but I still needed to see the proof of collusion so I waited for the proof that seemed inevitable and forthcoming soon according to the media before judging.
The turning point for me though came with the whole "Trump called white supremacists and neo nazis fine people" narrative from Charlottesville. That particular media narrative was so blatantly and brazenly dishonest given that an actual transcript and recording of his comments existed and still does that completely debunks that narrative and in fact shows he said the exact opposite. If Trump's detractors in the media are willing to so aggressively and shamelessly push such a false and easily disprovable narrative and even double down on and continue to perpetuate that false narrative even two years later despite clear evidence it wasn't true then common sense suggests they may be brazen in their lies about other things especially something as potentially damaging to Trump as his campaign colluding with Putin to interfere in the 2016 election.
Furthermore, it also became increasingly clear despite months of hysteria from the mainstream media about Trump being a Russian asset that the evidence was shaky at best and ridiculous at worst. many serious allegations seemed to fall flat that I began to question all the media narratives I was being fed. I then heard a counter argument or "conspiracy theory" as Trump haters like to call anything or anyone who questions or is suspicious of the official Trump Russia collusion story. Further digging led me to very compelling stories about abuse and illegal use of the NSA database to spy on suspected political adversaries of the previous administration. Illegal "unmaskings", a counter intelligence investigation started under incredibly shady pretenses, circumstantial but compelling evidence of attempts to entrap Papadopoulos and other Trump associates. Then there is the Steele dossier used by the FBI to get a FISA warrant to spy on Trump. The FBI swore under oath to the info in it being verified despite much of it being false and unverified thereby committing fraud on the court. Then all the criminal leaks of classified info damaging to Trump from the intelligence community to the media in order to be reported to gaslight the American public with "evidence" that Trump is guilty of "treason".
Last but not least the intelligence community's insistence on fighting tooth and nail any and all transparency into their investigative activities regarding both Trump and Hillary leading up to and after the 2016 election. Every attempt to look into how the Russia investigation started and what the legal predicate for starting it was is met by feigned outrage by high level deep state officials and their water carriers in the mainstream media. How dare anyone question or look into how we conducted our investigation to see if everything was done on the up and up and any attempt to find what was the legal predicate to start the investigation is none of our business according to the deep state and now the mainstream media. Anyone questioning any of their behavior is "doing Putin's bidding". It's so obvious the deep state and the anti-Trumpers in the mainstream media are so desperate to take down Trump by any means necessary that they have to be hiding crimes and illegal activity of their own. No other reason for their desperate, hyperbolic schrill rhetoric and seeming desperation to get Trump impeached makes sense otherwise.
Nothing will happen to them. I voted for Trump but am not always happy with what he does or says. But like Hillary - anyone involved in the witch hunts will get a pass. Look at the millions of dollars wasted on these investigations.
millions wasted?
How about billions wasted on California's failed bullet train project
millions of Federal dollars wasted on how to correct the homeless crisis in San Francisco, Seattle and L.A.
---They now have designated streets in L.A. to park and sleep because they allowed rent prices to rise too fast? What kind of quality of life is that. Now there's tent cities in public parks. when will people really rise up? That's local leaders fault, not the Pres. Ever since Gray Davis, California has had problems.
Illinois couldn't even pay its Lottery Winners a couple years back because of irresponsible spending.
The real problem are the leaders and their fiscal spending policies. They are killing the country's large cities with failed policies. States are ripping off the U.S. govt.
I am not a conservative, not a Trump fan, and not today's democrat.
But I think we can all agree that spending is way out of control and it seems nobody truly cares or has a solution. They just talk about raising taxes for the billionaires and corporations making $10B+ but paying zero tax which I can agree with. So, I guess I can accept some small socialist initiatives.
However, simply raising taxes and still spending like a dumbass isn't going to fix the problem. Get some competent logical thinking mayors, governors and state treasury secretaries who have proven they can do their job right.
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