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Old 12-11-2019, 08:48 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,469,715 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Doctors can and do choose to either not accept Medicare patients or limit the number they have to protect themselves from Medicare reimbursement rates that are too low.
Of course. And any further HC reform should preserve our option/choice as Americans.
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:51 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,731,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Yes, they do. Many things aren't covered in Canada... mental health care, prescriptions, dental, vision, hearing, etc.

That's why 2/3 of Canadians buy/earn private supplemental insurance policies.
Most people ( or their spouses) have paid Medicare payroll taxes for 40-50 years by the time they are eligible for Medicare. These payroll taxes primarily fund Medicare Part A- hospitalization. Furthermore, your payroll taxes have been primarily used to pay benefits of prior generations. Your benefits substantially depend on the payroll taxes paid by younger generations.

In the US, outpatient mental healthcare, like physical healthcare falls under Medicare Part B. The annual premium for Part B ranges from $1740- $5904 based on AGI and is deducted from Social Security benefit. General revenues, not payroll taxes, subsidize the majority of the cost of Medicare Part B.

Part B has an annual deductible requires a 20% copay of Medicare reimbursement rates.

In the US Medicare scheme, the reimbursement rate for outpatient mental health services has been declining over the past 20 years. As a result, the number of mental health practitioners who will NOT accept Medicare reimbursement has substantially increased.

Medicare Part D- medications, requires a private insurer plan, the cost of which is partially subsidized out of general revenues, not payroll taxes.

Medicare does not cover dental, vision or hearing.

Those who can afford it buy a supplimental plan that help pay for that which Medicare does not or choose a Medicare Advantage Plan.

In contrast, the intent of Bernie’s M4A scheme seeks to cover everything, including ambulances, without limit or co-pays and banning private insurance. If he got the nomination and won, the whole deal is DOA in Congress, no matter Party holding the majority.
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:54 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,469,715 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
I don't get that either. For many seniors, Medicare premiums, copays, and/or supplemental insurance to cover what Medicare doesn't is a major monthly expense.
But still a huge bargain! Privately insuring seniors would be cost prohibitive for most all seniors. Heck they already spend an average of over $11K a year per. Over 80 and/or approaching end of life coverage and you might need a $M or more in assets/money to get coverage.
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:57 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,469,715 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FirebirdCamaro1220 View Post
Dental and vision are different from health insurance, you know this, you're just being dishonest
Simple refractions and dental cleanings OK. But much of eye and dental crosses over with general medical concerns and encounters. And many times it take a lot of medical coding and finagling to get these covered.
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:59 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,731,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruzincat View Post
And, who is going to pay to go to Med School?
Medicare subsidizes the cost of residencies, including compensation of residents, in teaching hospitals.

Upon a consistent 10 year track record of of paying student loans, the Federal Government forgives the outstanding student federal loan balance of those who are employed by the federal, state, county local governments and 502(c) 3 corporations which includes most hospitals. This includes medical school debt as well as other degrees related or unrelated to employment.
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:59 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,469,715 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
They ARE on private insurance. What do you think supplemental policies are? They're private insurance.
Sure. But as a secondary their inherent risks/losses are much better controlled.
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Old 12-11-2019, 09:05 AM
 
8,138 posts, read 3,674,077 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
Good points!

Us long time office docs are very well aware of all this.

Right now it seems that CMS really does understand what it costs us to provide medical care. So we already for a long time have received a 'medical minimum wage' from Medicare. Since around the late 1980's. There have been minimal 'raises' at times along the way. But not enough to so easily keep up with say general office work overheads and COL. So many docs have long since folded and become employees of hospitals or have joined larger groups to share more costs.

Single payer is like a sword of Damocles over the docs' heads, so by and large they will resist single payer simply on that negative future reimbursement potential.

So most docs still take Medicare patients and that helps pay the bills. But the docs also want choices. Choices for themselves as docs and as patients. And 'we the patients' should also demand to have choices, especially those of us with the means. IMO choices have to be part of an overall American HC plan.

Simply lowering Medicare to age 50-55 would solve a whole bunch of cost problems on the patient side. Hillary's plan as I recall. HC risks and costs go up very quickly as we age into our 50's. So not only would that age group benefit - if they wanted to do Medicare, this plan would also take huge risks and losses off of about any of the private plans. And those premiums should drop significantly for the broad middle class. Middle class HC related OOP spending is one of our major national concerns.

This change with Medicare could be done with minimal disruption, politicking and time. HC reforms over the years have been much easier through incrementalism. vs say the ACA.
Well, that would be the insurance companies dream, to insure only healthy people that need very little HC, wouldn't it. And to unload all the liabilities to medicare.
The problem is, they (the private insurance) are not going to drop the premiums. Since that would lead to less money to be made.
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Old 12-11-2019, 09:12 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,007 posts, read 44,813,405 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serger View Post
Did you read the word "supplemental". Try to put 65+ year olds on private insurance, report back.
Supplemental IS private insurance. Tell me WHY, when seniors have Medicare, do they need to BUY private supplemental insurance?
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Old 12-11-2019, 09:15 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,469,715 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serger View Post
Well, that would be the insurance companies dream, to insure only healthy people that need very little HC, wouldn't it. And to unload all the liabilities to medicare.
The problem is, they (the private insurance) are not going to drop the premiums. Since that would lead to less money to be made.
Remember with ACA there are inherent limits of profits based on something like 80% of premiums going towards claims. No doubt there are ways on both sides to skirt or pad this.

But in medicine, as risks drop, premiums should. The accountants and actuary will have to recompute.
In the end it is much simpler, easier and cheaper to insure a million 20 somethings than a million 60 somethings. And then at a much more reasonable rate, where the 20 somethings aren't funding all those with pre-existing or the uninsurables, they will in effect finally get in with coverage under a different 'Mandate'.
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Old 12-11-2019, 09:16 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,007 posts, read 44,813,405 times
Reputation: 13704
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
Good points!

Us long time office docs are very well aware of all this.

Right now it seems that CMS really does understand what it costs us to provide medical care. So we already for a long time have received a 'medical minimum wage' from Medicare. Since around the late 1980's. There have been minimal 'raises' at times along the way. But not enough to so easily keep up with say general office work overheads and COL. So many docs have long since folded and become employees of hospitals or have joined larger groups to share more costs.

Single payer is like a sword of Damocles over the docs' heads, so by and large they will resist single payer simply on that negative future reimbursement potential.

So most docs still take Medicare patients and that helps pay the bills. But the docs also want choices. Choices for themselves as docs and as patients. And 'we the patients' should also demand to have choices, especially those of us with the means. IMO choices have to be part of an overall American HC plan.

Simply lowering Medicare to age 50-55 would solve a whole bunch of cost problems on the patient side. Hillary's plan as I recall. HC risks and costs go up very quickly as we age into our 50's. So not only would that age group benefit - if they wanted to do Medicare, this plan would also take huge risks and losses off of about any of the private plans. And those premiums should drop significantly for the broad middle class. Middle class HC related OOP spending is one of our major national concerns.

This change with Medicare could be done with minimal disruption, politicking and time. HC reforms over the years have been much easier through incrementalism. vs say the ACA.
Regarding the bold, exactly. M4A advocates fail to understand that.
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