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While I know there is a push for Medicare for all.
Though what about mandating socialized universal access to toilets/hand washing facilities first? And that cities need to provide them to anyone who need to use them based on zoning codes.
I don’t understand why while there are legislators passing many ridiculous and often unnecessary and sometimes harmful nanny state regulations these days, including requiring allowed access to restroom of choice of gender identity. And excessive expensive regulations on building restrooms(yet there is often no mandate of having them at all) when much of the populace is restroom challenged themselves and routinely facing a restroom deficiency crisis whenever nature calls. Which is a real health emergency yet politicians turn the other way?
Interesting and disgusting that zoning regulations in most areas still dosen't require cities or towns to consider the inevitable restroom needs for all those buildings where people live, work, and play particularly visitors, and people who's jobs involve being mostly on the road i.e couriers. When they approve development or even "redevelopment." Today the population is often at the mercy of private business owners whether they will have goodwill to "share" their facilities with you(which 50/50 they probably won't as then they would have to open them for other hoards of tourists and vagrants or risk being accused of preferential treatment). Though there is nothing as bad as the experience like trying to find a bathroom out and about when you have an emergency and second guessing which building would let you use it. Or worse, patronizing a tiny old corner restaurant that serves drinks but does not have on site toilet/hand washing facilities, and whose workers are clueless of where to direct patrons to an accessible/available one nearby. Since there are virtually no true public facilities except in municipal government owned buildings and parks which are not by any means everywhere.
I totally agree with this website** https://americanrestroom.org/.
Having read on some forums that cities are becoming literal toilets just makes my blood boil these days. Bans on plastic bags in these sized cities has also made things much worse for those who are restroom deficient not just the massive homeless population there. With the invent of self cleaning public toilets these days there is no excuse one cannot be installed on every city block. And funded by neighboring buildings and businesses. A even for a small fee of 25c it’s better than nothing. Alas the ban on pay toilets back in the 1970s had lead to the closure of many of the “public” toilets that once existed.
San Francisco officials have declared the recent test run of keeping the city’s Pit Stop public toilets open all night a success — and at about $28.50 per flush, it ought to be.
Interesting I guess there are too many things going on these forums particularly with Trumps impeachment that people overlook this issue. Anyone who been in a city would know this is a major public health issue whether its their time to go or walking past piles of smelly human waste.**
There is really just no*excuse*for ignore everyone's inevitable call of nature. Its an issue that had been mothballed for a long time and continue to get worse. If there is a will there is a way. The cost would definitely be a fraction of Medicare for all.*
The issue is we have many expensive requirements(most recently requiring faciltiies for those with uncertain gender identification)* for those(public agency or private) who choose provide clean toilet facilities yet almost no requirement for governments nor anyone else to provide it. Obviously those who are unwilling or unable to spend that cost would just give up and provide nothing instead.* I was shocked that prior to 2004 restroom facilities*arn't even required in California (the big legislate everything state) not even restaurants unless the building is larger than 20,000 sq ft. Or pretty much the size of a large supermarket or Walmart/Target. Thus very few buildings fall under the legal requirement pre 2004. Thus it is hard to believe but actually legal to build a McDonalds in CA without a bathroom prior to 2004 and there are actually quite a number of such Mcdonalds in existence even today.* After 2004 there started to have minimum toilet facilities for food consumption facilities. While its a good start there is still a long way to go in resolving the toilet deficiency crisis.*
Also cutbacks as well as security concerns had lead to the shutdown of many public toilet facilities especially near transit stations where many people would need a toilet. SF's BART being a large nasty example where toilets in all underground subways stations had been shut down.
Apparently I learned there was a ban on "pay toilets" enacted back in the 1970s backfired due to the cost to operate toilets increasing while they lose revenue sources. They also became informal shelters for the homeless. Thus leaving to their shutdown. Thus its not free toilets for all as intended but no toilets for anyone.*
There are plenty of ways to control costs, i.e encouraging people to pay for use of standalone facilities/automated cleaning toilets* while allowing those desperate to work around the payment. 70% the users would likely just pay the nominal fee. Requiring brick and motar business especially those who have limited to nonexistent onsite toilet faciities to share the burden of the costs and have signs directing patrons to the nearest such facility and allow a toilet credit for those who purchase $5 worth or any drinks. And they should be located strategically in city blocks where there is a serious building bathroom deficiency. Where impractical or not cost effective to provide a public restroom or sanselittes. There should be a map to the nearest facility where patrons of a business can use should there be a no onsite restroom sign or if restrooms on site are busy or out of order.*
Transit agencies should be required to channel the funding they saved not serving closed in station restrooms to fund alternative public restrooms on the surface as well. Thus while it may be costly there are always ways to make things work as long as there is a will. Just depend on what politicians and business owners prioritize on. I doubt its an unreasonable health department standard to post signs directing patrons to the nearest facilities they can use if onsite facilities are not available.
Last edited by citizensadvocate; 12-19-2019 at 07:56 PM..
While I know there is a push for Medicare for all.
Though what about mandating socialized universal access to toilets/hand washing facilities first? And that cities need to provide them to anyone who need to use them based on zoning codes.
Then why not just give universal housing? The housing does not have to be luxurious one bedrooms, it can be college dormitory style or even Navy ship berthing style. Meaning 30 bunk beds, close to each other, with three toilets, sinks, and three showers for each 30 persons.
Essentially just make more and more shelters. Give people the option of staying there if they want to save money.
Interesting question, but if public access were to be mandated, how do you propose businesses, schools, and other organizations protect themselves from the homeless/addicts/mentally ill effectively moving into those facilities or making them unsafe for clients/customers/students/members etc?
Good question https://americanrestroom.org/?s=restroom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanisette
Its a good start
automatic doors are programmed to open 15 minutes after closure to discourage the homeless from camping inside.
Originally pay toilets were able to pay for themselves as well as discourage vagrants and vandals from camping inside by having attendance and a cost to use. but since the ban on pay toilets in the 1970s many toilet facilities cost to operate gone up due to lack of money for attendents and maintenance and lack of means to prevent vagrants and vandals from camping inside and causing expensive destruction, thus many public toilets as well as privately operated toilets meant to serve the public closed down since thus leading to the public health toilet deficiency crisis ever since.
Overregulation on toilet facilities and raising costs over the years causes toilets to become even more scarce for everyone. Yet politicians seem to focus whether protected class can access toilets provided even though they don't guarantee that any citizens can access them. It has become a point that its legal to just not have one but illegal to provide one that don't meet tens of thousands of dollars of code. Thus its a no brainer former happens.
One thing can improve without a massive expense or planning is to have the health department post in every business the closest location of existing restrooms on a easy to read map where customers can see. And where staff can direct people to use if asked. Nowadays many corner stores/restaurants have no room for restroom facilities of their own and have to depend on the landlords main building for restrooms but for security reasons landlords often do not grant access to their main building for the corner store's clients/customers. I do realize its not truely not fair and its technically unconstitutional for any business to have to act and pay to act as a restroom for the general off the street public or for customers of other businesses with nonexistent(many older buildings are grandfathered in and towncenters are filled with older buildings) or broken bathrooms(which happens a lot in places with a single occupancy toilet). Its an expensive goodwill unless the person also becomes a customer which means spending a lot for a bathroom use. Cities should also post signs on street corners of the closest restroom open to all city inhabitants without condition(I know that roadsigns in Baja California often have road signs showing where public bathrooms are on a highway, something I never see in the US with exception of the few rest areas, one of the rare truely public restrooms one can access without fee or condition. Sometimes while there may be restrooms that are open to general public nearby but due to poor signage people with an emergency couldn't find its existence in haste. If there nearest restroom happens to be privately owned(i.e a large shopping center) but not easily avoided the city should offer just compensation to the center's owners.
Cities should not approve more projects without considering the consequences of having such a project and serving the existing needs of residents and non residents alike. And consider the occupants restroom access needs when approving a project. Businesses and transit agencies within a region should bare the cost of providing toilets and handwashing facilties in the interest of public health, either onsite or offsite through the city or an agency that provides sanitary facilities. Especially ones like BART/Muni who shut down much of their exisiting facilities that once served thousands of their riders/drivers/operators/staff a day, as well as stores/restaurants like the McDonalds I mentioned without bathrooms. Those businesses should especially bare the costs at least what they saved by not having an onsite restroom facility to maintain. Businesses that provide adequate restroom facilities more than minimal requirements for their all their occupants can pay a good amount less.
I also propose that businesses that don't offer health insurance for their employees should bare the cost of subsidiing public healthcare for their employees. Businesses that do provide health care can have a deduction on paying costs to subsidize public hospitals.
Please note I am not against all government, its just bad government and bad and misguided overregulation I dislike, while turning a blind eye on real issues.
Gross and dangerous. We have separate facilities for the two genders wherever privates can be exposed for a reason. No one that isn't on the Far Left, and statistically childless, would advocate for a law that would allow a man with male genitalia to use a female restroom.
There are two genders. Everything else is mental illness that society is not required to coddle. Those who you people strong arm will wait silently to push back. Those that you do not have leverage over will not come to your insane view and hilariously written propaganda at any point in time. You should come to grips with both of the above realities.
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Today the population is often at the mercy of private business owners whether they will have goodwill to "share" their facilities with you(which 50/50 they probably won't as then they would have to open them for other hoards of tourists and vagrants or risk being accused of preferential treatment).
Why is "share" in quotes? What part of "private business" don't you understand? Restaurant restrooms, for example, are privately owned. They aren't public restrooms. You may get lucky, but to plan to use them without being a patron is silly and childish.
Gross and dangerous. We have separate facilities for the two genders wherever privates can be exposed for a reason. No one that isn't on the Far Left, and statistically childless, would advocate for a law that would allow a man with male genitalia to use a female restroom.
There are two genders. Everything else is mental illness that society is not required to coddle. Those who you people strong arm will wait silently to push back. Those that you do not have leverage over will not come to your insane view and hilariously written propaganda at any point in time. You should come to grips with both of the above realities.
Why is "share" in quotes? What part of "private business" don't you understand? Restaurant restrooms, for example, are privately owned. They aren't public restrooms. You may get lucky, but to plan to use them without being a patron is silly and childish.
I think you haven't read my posts correctly haven't you? I meant municipalities should had been the one who incorporated sanitary needs of people brought by their zoning and approval of construction and operating permits of businesses and other venues. In other words it shouldn't be another private businesses/restaurants with toilets job to deal with people who are desperate for toilets due to the city's neglect to consider people's toilet needs when they hold activities, zone or permit for development, especially if many businesses including restaurants and fast food continues to be operated without adequate onsite facilities. Also no strip shopping center should ever be built without a centralized toilet facility that is accessible to all patrons as long as a business is open at least paying patrons who have a pass, its fair to charge non customers for its use. Cities should make signs leading to nearest handwashing and toilets mandatory on every block and available in any business particularly ones that don't have onsite toilet/handwashing facilities(or only have one toilet) which an offsite alternative must be provided to the patrons. Businesses operating without toilet access for all building patrons should make arrangements with the city to arrange and cover the cost of alternative toilet access.
Nowadays people out and about(including the poor toiletless Mcdonalds patron I mentioned) only have two choices, hope they make it to a open business nearby who would have good heart and the facilities to let them answer the call of nature or go behind a bush or dumpster. Anyone who had that experience which is pretty much 100% of the population would agree how excruciating such an experience is, there is normally no city-owned facility, and buildings surrounding you are either offices, apartments, or corner stores unlikely to have a toilet or one that they let you use. There may be a fancy restaurant down the block but you would need to get in line to make an expensive purchase often a drink, even then it may be a single occupancy restroom. That McDonalds you see might find seem salvation at first as you may think it would definetly have a restroom you can use but it doesn't. I totally agree it shouldn't be acceptable that the Mcdonalds customer should have to run to a nearby five star restaurant two blocks away to ask whether they have toilet and allow them to use it nor should the five star restaurant be forced to contend with the hoards of McDonald's customers searching for a restroom they should have provided. The McDonalds should have an sign map to the nearest restroom patrons can use whether its an automatic cleaning public toilet or a business toilet in which McDonalds have an agreement to share the cost for patron's restroom access.
I noticed the situation is not unlike the health care situation, I believe there should be a public option for those who chooses to use it and a private option as well. Rather than one or the other. i.e basic public toilet or automatic cleaning toilet for 25c or a nice private toilet for 50c but free for paying customers though its likely you will pay more than 50c in that case.
Last edited by citizensadvocate; 12-20-2019 at 03:06 PM..
Why the need when one can walk into a library and take a dump on the floor?
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