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Old 12-30-2019, 11:08 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas & San Diego
6,913 posts, read 3,377,987 times
Reputation: 8629

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
No travis, trickle down does not work, it never has and it never will. Here's one of the results of Trump's great 'trickle down' tax bill:
Quote:
The 400 richest U.S. families now pay a lower overall tax rate than the middle-class, the first time that's happened in 100 years, according to economists Emmanuel Saez and Gabriel Zucman. Factoring in federal, state and local taxes, those ultra-wealthy households pay a total rate of about 23% — that compares with just over 24% for the bottom half of households. The U.S. now "looks like the tax system of a plutocracy," Saez and Zucman say.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/america...-middle-class/
Need to find a better article to support your position, that study does not prove anything about trickle down and is highly controversial. That study is laughably flawed to get those results - as has been stated several times in the economics forum. The quick and dirty version is that to get to those numbers they counted items such as health insurance even if paid by Medicare or company as a tax on the poor and considered things such as tax credits and deductions as benefits for the poor instead of counting them as reducing taxes. And by only using the top 400, they picked those that only pay capital gains. Even liberal economists did not agree with their approach.

BTW - These are the French economists that proposed Warrens 2% tax on the wealthy as a way to tax them - they have a socialist view point and are trying to get attention - the original paper was published in 2014.

Last edited by ddeemo; 12-30-2019 at 11:26 PM..
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Old 12-31-2019, 05:35 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,019 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13711
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
The data is old, and only refers to food stamps but you cherry picked it here's what you "forgot" to tell us
Post a newer Maxwell study, then. The Maxwell Poll data posted at the link includes: Public Housing, Medicaid, Food Stamps, Unemployment, Disability, and Welfare. The NPR study confirms the MP Unemployment data, and the Pew Research data confirms the MP Food Stamps data.

You're just butthurt because all the studies of individuals prove that Democrats, by far, are the vast majority of those on public assistance.

Quote:
Of these, about one-in-five (22%) of Democrats say they had received food stamps compared with 10% of Republicans. About 17% of political independents say they have received food stamps.

So twice as many democrats received food stamps as Republicans but oops! you forgot the independents. So actually fewer democrats received food stamps than Republicans and Independents - see cherry picking cuts both ways.
You are only stressing the point that Republicans are FAR less dependent on Food Stamps than Democrats and Independents.

Republicans: 10% have received Food Stamps
Democrats and Independents: 22% and 17% (respectively) have received Food Stamps

See how that works?

Last edited by InformedConsent; 12-31-2019 at 05:53 AM..
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Old 12-31-2019, 06:26 AM
 
Location: OH->FL->NJ
17,005 posts, read 12,592,213 times
Reputation: 8924
It will be interesting to see the shift in "donor states" statistics this year.
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Old 12-31-2019, 09:21 AM
 
21,989 posts, read 15,713,056 times
Reputation: 12943
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Post a newer Maxwell study, then. The Maxwell Poll data posted at the link includes: Public Housing, Medicaid, Food Stamps, Unemployment, Disability, and Welfare. The NPR study confirms the MP Unemployment data, and the Pew Research data confirms the MP Food Stamps data.

You're just butthurt because all the studies of individuals prove that Democrats, by far, are the vast majority of those on public assistance.

You are only stressing the point that Republicans are FAR less dependent on Food Stamps than Democrats and Independents.

Republicans: 10% have received Food Stamps
Democrats and Independents: 22% and 17% (respectively) have received Food Stamps

See how that works?
It is not anyone else’s job to help you refute your own assertion. A study from fifteen years ago means nothing and taking it further that it has to be a “Maxwell” study is sillier still. Farmers, coal miners, Kentucky, West Virginia, the South, all living off the taxpayer and as has been shown endless times, blue states are paying for all the federally dependent red states. Applaud the SALT limit all you want, in my blue state the impact is minimal. But at some point, there will be a reckoning. Red “taker” states will be put on notice and their poor financial standing will be publicized and they will he told no more buckets of money from blue states. They need to learn to live within their means and do without if they can’t afford something.
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Old 12-31-2019, 09:34 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,019 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13711
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
It is not anyone else’s job to help you refute your own assertion.
I'm not refuting it. Given the fact that both NPR and Pew Research confirm the stats, I consider it to be accurate.

Quote:
A study from fifteen years ago means nothing
The study isn't from 15 years ago. You're obviously math-challenged so no wonder you are having trouble comprehending numerical facts.
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Old 12-31-2019, 09:38 AM
 
21,989 posts, read 15,713,056 times
Reputation: 12943
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
I'm not refuting it. Given the fact that both NPR and Pew Research confirm the stats, I consider it to be accurate.

The study isn't from 15 years ago. You're obviously math-challenged so no wonder you are having trouble comprehending numerical facts.
It doesn’t require math, I can read. But go ahead and ignore all the money going to red states and paid by blue states. Obviously it’s something that is hard to admit.
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Old 12-31-2019, 09:50 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,019 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13711
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
It is not anyone else’s job to help you refute your own assertion.
I'm not refuting it. Given the fact that both NPR and Pew Research confirm the stats, I consider it to be accurate.

Quote:
A study from fifteen years ago means nothing
The study isn't from 15 years ago. You're obviously math-challenged so no wonder you are having trouble comprehending numerical facts.

From November, 2012 (Hint: NOT 15 years ago):

Pew Research Data

Dems and Independents are FAR more dependent on public assistance, including Food Stamps, than Republicans.
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Old 12-31-2019, 09:57 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,019 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13711
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
It doesn’t require math, I can read. But go ahead and ignore all the money going to red states and paid by blue states. Obviously it’s something that is hard to admit.
Read and learn:

Intergovernmental Spending, by State Political Demographics

Blue states take more per capita than red or purple states.
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:20 AM
 
21,989 posts, read 15,713,056 times
Reputation: 12943
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Read and learn:

Intergovernmental Spending, by State Political Demographics

Blue states take more per capita than red or purple states.
Source and date? I could type that up in three minutes
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:55 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,019 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13711
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
Source and date? I could type that up in three minutes
Quote:
"If, instead of comparing federal funds to state budgets, we look at how much the federal government spends in intergovernmental grants per resident of a state, the results are turned on their heads.

Against a national average of $1,935 in intergovernmental spending per American, red states receive just $1,879. Blue states get considerably more, at $2,124 per resident. Purple states see the least of their money returned to them per capita, at just $1,770. Measured in this way, the blue states are getting quite a bit more than the red or purple.

Are Red States Tax Takers And Blue States Tax Makers?
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