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Old 01-14-2020, 08:08 PM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,709 posts, read 30,581,041 times
Reputation: 9985

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Quote:
Originally Posted by USMC1984 View Post
I was a Marine in the 80s and even an MP for awhile...we were NEVER taught that! Not in boot camp, nor in the MPs.
I was and I know the IDF does step two most often rather than step three. Hence their high injury rate and extremely low kill rate.


https://www.timesofisrael.com/in-gaz...-for-the-legs/


That being said, the Military is extremely better trained in using arms than any LEO. While we may fire a weapon multiple times in a day there are LEO's who never done so outside of the range. As to this thread, I'm going to end my part in it with the following link:

Why Don't Police Aim for the Arms or Legs?

https://www.thebalancecareers.com/wh...or-legs-974607
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Old 01-14-2020, 08:13 PM
 
Location: NW Nevada
18,126 posts, read 15,517,461 times
Reputation: 17109
Quote:
Originally Posted by USMC1984 View Post
This thread has run it's course.
I tend to agree. Theres not much that's really to interesting in the way of discussion happening. Rules of lethal force have been beaten to death and the what ifs are becoming tiresome.
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Old 01-14-2020, 08:14 PM
 
7,520 posts, read 2,778,597 times
Reputation: 3940
Quote:
Originally Posted by NVplumber View Post
I tend to agree. Theres not much that's really to interesting in the way of discussion happening. Rules of lethal force have been beaten to death and the what ifs are becoming tiresome.
No kidding.
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Old 01-15-2020, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Cali
14,021 posts, read 4,428,800 times
Reputation: 8136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
This thread has really gone on for to long. From a military perspective we at one time used to do the three shot method. First shot was the air, if that didn't stop the person then the second shot was at the ground or below the knee, if that didn't stop the person then the third shot was into the chest. Time and time again, the first two shots nearly never worked with verbal warnings included. For year after year, for decade after decade; Nearly never. Thus now it's a verbal warning followed by a chest shot.
Served 2 tours in Iraq with the 10th Mountain. I am also an LEO for 10 years.

It's already hard as it is to shoot a moving target who is trying to kill you. But now you are trying to shoot a smaller target (the leg) the size of your palm and is constanly moving? Now try to do that with a sidearm like a Glock instead of a more accurate weapon like an M4 rifle equipped with optics


Good luck
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Old 01-15-2020, 11:28 AM
 
Location: Cali
14,021 posts, read 4,428,800 times
Reputation: 8136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
I was and I know the IDF does step two most often rather than step three. Hence their high injury rate and extremely low kill rate.


https://www.timesofisrael.com/in-gaz...-for-the-legs/


That being said, the Military is extremely better trained in using arms than any LEO. While we may fire a weapon multiple times in a day there are LEO's who never done so outside of the range. As to this thread, I'm going to end my part in it with the following link:

Why Don't Police Aim for the Arms or Legs?

https://www.thebalancecareers.com/wh...or-legs-974607
Read the article. The IDF were shooting live rounds at rioters and protesters.

Since when american police allow to fire live rounds at rioters and protesters?
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Old 01-15-2020, 11:44 AM
 
13,709 posts, read 5,461,431 times
Reputation: 8425
Quote:
Originally Posted by USMC1984 View Post
I was a Marine in the 80s and even an MP for awhile...we were NEVER taught that! Not in boot camp, nor in the MPs.
/agree

Navy Law Enforcement school - we were never taught anything but double tap, center of mass minimum.

Augmented Security Force training under USMC command - we were never taught anything but double tap minimum, center of mass.

Reaction Security Force training under USMC command - we were never taught anything but double tap minimum, center of mass.

CQC, Shipboard Combat, and every other tactical scenario training under both Navy and USMC command - we were never taught anything but double tap minimum, center of mass.

CCW training, civilian - triple tap, starting at waist (and apparently armed forces and many LE agencies are going this way).

I have never been instructed to fire warning shots or aim for anything but center of mass, by any firearms tactics instructor or school, not once, ever. That is AF, Navy, Marines, civilian police, federal and state guidelines, etc. Nowhere, not once...ever.
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Old 01-15-2020, 12:06 PM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,709 posts, read 30,581,041 times
Reputation: 9985
Quote:
Originally Posted by Du Ma View Post
Read the article. The IDF were shooting live rounds at rioters and protesters.

Since when american police allow to fire live rounds at rioters and protesters?
The IDF only fires at people throwing a projectile or carrying a weapon of some type. They don't fire at people going for a stroll.
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Old 01-15-2020, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Cali
14,021 posts, read 4,428,800 times
Reputation: 8136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
The IDF only fires at people throwing a projectile or carrying a weapon of some type. They don't fire at people going for a stroll.
So you are telling us IDF were shooting live rounds & aiming for the legs at combatants armed with RPG and AK47?

Not a bunch of protesters/rioters armed with rocks and whatever projectiles they can get their hands on.....LIKE EVERY RIOTER OR PROTESTER ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD?
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Old 01-15-2020, 12:12 PM
 
Location: Florida
76,871 posts, read 47,170,347 times
Reputation: 14725
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
CCW training, civilian - triple tap, starting at waist (and apparently armed forces and many LE agencies are going this way).
I dont know where you took your CCW class, but they don't typically teach you to tap anyone anywhere. What they do teach you basic firearm safety and that having a CCW licence does NOT make one a police officer.
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Old 01-15-2020, 12:33 PM
 
19,641 posts, read 9,962,959 times
Reputation: 13001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
I dont know where you took your CCW class, but they don't typically teach you to tap anyone anywhere. What they do teach you basic firearm safety and that having a CCW licence does NOT make one a police officer.
In CCW class, all we had to do was hit a life size target.
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