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Old 02-09-2020, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Retired in VT; previously MD & NJ
14,267 posts, read 6,947,966 times
Reputation: 17878

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
Will you let me and others opt out? will you allow a free market in health care absent the govt interventions that make it so costly?
If yes, I will forget what the schemes have already taken from me and not look for a penny more.

What about the coercion you require to fund the schemes? Dont pretend you have morality on your side.
We once had a free market health insurance system. That didn't work so well. That is why so many are searching for a better solution.

With all the different ideas that have been proposed and tried over the years, and all the opposition to each idea at the time, we end up with a compromise each time that partially works for some people. We need to do better.

I have paid into Social Security and Medicare all my working life. I get $$$ back from Social Security that pays a good chunk of my living expenses in retirement. Then I have my own savings to take care of the rest. It doesn't bother me that lower wage people paid in less and get a better ROI than I do... they still don't get more $$$ per month than a higher contributor. IT WORKS and we no longer have stories like the old lady who was living in a chicken coop in somebody's backyard. Yes that was a real story.

Medicare works too. I won't go into the details.
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Old 02-09-2020, 01:44 PM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,598,192 times
Reputation: 22232
Quote:
Originally Posted by ansible90 View Post
We once had a free market health insurance system. That didn't work so well. That is why so many are searching for a better solution.

With all the different ideas that have been proposed and tried over the years, and all the opposition to each idea at the time, we end up with a compromise each time that partially works for some people. We need to do better.

I have paid into Social Security and Medicare all my working life. I get $$$ back from Social Security that pays a good chunk of my living expenses in retirement. Then I have my own savings to take care of the rest. It doesn't bother me that lower wage people paid in less and get a better ROI than I do... they still don't get more $$$ per month than a higher contributor. IT WORKS and we no longer have stories like the old lady who was living in a chicken coop in somebody's backyard. Yes that was a real story.

Medicare works too. I won't go into the details.
My free market healthcare and insurance works like a champ.
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Old 02-09-2020, 01:46 PM
 
45,201 posts, read 26,417,923 times
Reputation: 24964
Quote:
Originally Posted by ansible90 View Post
We once had a free market health insurance system. That didn't work so well. That is why so many are searching for a better solution.

With all the different ideas that have been proposed and tried over the years, and all the opposition to each idea at the time, we end up with a compromise each time that partially works for some people. We need to do better.

I have paid into Social Security and Medicare all my working life. I get $$$ back from Social Security that pays a good chunk of my living expenses in retirement. Then I have my own savings to take care of the rest. It doesn't bother me that lower wage people paid in less and get a better ROI than I do... they still don't get more $$$ per month than a higher contributor. IT WORKS and we no longer have stories like the old lady who was living in a chicken coop in somebody's backyard. Yes that was a real story.

Medicare works too. I won't go into the details.
Dishonest leftist deflects
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Old 02-09-2020, 01:52 PM
 
8,104 posts, read 3,957,018 times
Reputation: 3070
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
I have already paid into the system far more than what I will ever receive. The immorality was done to me. Why shouldn’t I take some back what belongs to me to begin with?

Those whose net benefit exceeds their net contribution should refuse Social Security because accepting it would be immoral.
Using that logic, those who put money into a 401K, upon retirement should only get back what they put into it. Especially when the government is propping it up with tax payers dollars. Trillions in Government QE and the Fed Printing Press going nonstop.

Taking more than that is immoral.

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Old 02-09-2020, 01:54 PM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,555,493 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by ansible90 View Post
We once had a free market health insurance system. That didn't work so well. That is why so many are searching for a better solution.

With all the different ideas that have been proposed and tried over the years, and all the opposition to each idea at the time, we end up with a compromise each time that partially works for some people. We need to do better.

I have paid into Social Security and Medicare all my working life. I get $$$ back from Social Security that pays a good chunk of my living expenses in retirement. Then I have my own savings to take care of the rest. It doesn't bother me that lower wage people paid in less and get a better ROI than I do... they still don't get more $$$ per month than a higher contributor. IT WORKS and we no longer have stories like the old lady who was living in a chicken coop in somebody's backyard. Yes that was a real story.

Medicare works too. I won't go into the details.
Works? If it works for you, it literally means it doesn’t for other people.
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Old 02-09-2020, 01:55 PM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,598,192 times
Reputation: 22232
Quote:
Originally Posted by J746NEW View Post
Using that logic, those who put money into a 401K, upon retirement should only get back what they put into it. Especially when the government is propping it up with tax payers dollars. Trillions in Government QE and the Fed Printing Press going nonstop.

Taking more than that is immoral.



Really?
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Old 02-09-2020, 01:55 PM
 
8,104 posts, read 3,957,018 times
Reputation: 3070
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Capitalist, "I want to work hard to succeed."

Socialist, "I want the government to give me other people's labor."
Well, the fruits of ones labor is mostly going to the top wealthiest.
We need to back to the pioneer days where labor received 100% of the fruits of their labor.

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Old 02-09-2020, 01:57 PM
 
8,104 posts, read 3,957,018 times
Reputation: 3070
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
Will you let me and others opt out? will you allow a free market in health care i.e absent the govt interventions that make it so costly?
If yes, I will forget what the schemes have already taken from me and not look for a penny more.

What about the coercion you require to fund the schemes? Dont pretend you have morality on your side.
The lobbyists, not government are to blame for the high healthcare cost. They pay the government to protect their racket.
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Old 02-09-2020, 01:57 PM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,598,192 times
Reputation: 22232
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
Works? If it works for you, it literally means it doesn’t for other people.
When the labor/property/money of people is taken by threat of force and given to others, the recipients will almost always view it as justified.
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Old 02-09-2020, 02:00 PM
 
8,104 posts, read 3,957,018 times
Reputation: 3070
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post


Really?
Yes, when the government gives free money to prop up the finance sector.
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