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If we can train our kids to be conformist enough, maybe we can get Scandinavian style system. Kids all seem to like the same things now... so who knows.
Scandinavians are snooty about their conformity and proud to not stand out or make waves. I think they are a bit naïve. If that is their culture and they are happy, that is fine but they should not feel smug about it. Anyone born and raised in a socialist, even partial socialist culture may not be able to understand the American spirit, but maybe they could try to have some respect for why some of us are willing to sacrifice and fight so hard to retain it. I mean, look who we elected as prez. We ain't messing around.
IMO Eastern Europeans who suffered under communism tend to have a higher regard for America, our people and and our system, than Scandinavians do.
They don’t break the law, they follow rules. They show respect for each other and authority. They have charity in their hearts and make sacrifices for their communities.
Charitable giving is actually low in Nordic countries, since the "charity" is done through taxation.
Have you been there or just pulling some statistic from the net and quoting it here.
I have been there to both Oslo and Helsinki and paid the amounts for pizza and beer that I quoted. Maybe if I had gone to a small cheap restaurant and I could have it for $7.
Make a trip there and see for yourself.
I go every year, and just visited for Christmas. No snow...... I like the way they charge for the beer: two seconds and its all done. No need to ask for the check.
That's what I'd like to know. Every time someone mentions the Scandinavian model, conservatives claim "that would never work here, we have a diverse population".
The US is the only major country without universal healthcare. What is so unique about our population that makes it unworkable here when it works well in every other country?
Well I would agree in theory.
But you are now reducing this inane debate down to one issue- universal healthcare, which I suspect, along with free college, is really the crux of this obsession with Scandinavia (I notice nobody ever mentions Italy, which also has universal healthcare ).
The US actually has government-sponsored healthcare- in part. SSI, Medicare, Medicaid, VA, and Obamacare are all government run.
Diversity would have little to do with a universal plan. The opposition to that comes with a justified fear that with government involvement, you would have inefficiencies, bureaucratic inertia, and corruption.
These are well-founded fears and that is where you want to direct your arguments. Not towards Scandinavia.
But you are now reducing this inane debate down to one issue- universal healthcare, which I suspect, along with free college, is really the crux of this obsession with Scandinavia (I notice nobody ever mentions Italy, which also has universal healthcare ).
The US actually has government-sponsored healthcare- in part. SSI, Medicare, Medicaid, VA, and Obamacare are all government run.
Diversity would have little to do with a universal plan. The opposition to that comes with a justified fear that with government involvement, you would have inefficiencies, bureaucratic inertia, and corruption.
These are well-founded fears and that is where you want to direct your arguments. Not towards Scandinavia.
Yes, healthcare and education are the main two elements of EU-style socialism that I think we could benefit from.
The OP started this thread with "The first way they (liberals) lie is by ignoring the obvious differences between small homogeneous countries of 5-10 million people and a large diverse country of 340 million people with all sorts of competing interests"
I want to know what this homogeneity or lack thereof has to do with providing universal healthcare or state-sponsored college education. One response was that some races are more successful financially and educationally than others, and the other respondent implied that white people have higher moral character. As offensive as these remarks are, neither addressed what any of this has to do with providing a higher level of social services.
There could be an argument here relating to income inequality, because the "Haves" would pay more so that the "Have nots" can get healthcare. But certain members of this forum chose to conflate that with ethnic diversity, for some reason.
For anyone interested in Scandinavian economics, I recommend Rand Paul's recent book The Case Against Socialism. He has 10 chapters in there about various topics related to Scandinavia.
Scandinavia never did really embrace socialism. There was a brief time in the early 1990s where Sweden adopted a policy of diverting corporate profits to unions. That was a form of socialism. But they dumped it in the mid 1990s as they did not prefer the socialist model.
They are 'social democracies,' not 'democratic socialism.' In some ways they are to the right of the US. For example, Sweden has long had school vouchers, which is almost entirely a policy promoted by the right in the US.
Scandinavia is a capitalist block with a strong social safety net. Sounds good to me.
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