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Old 05-01-2020, 02:39 PM
 
28,623 posts, read 18,677,825 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake View Post
Given the infectiousness, that the virus is in every state and nearly every county in the country, and that NYC had a 25% exposure rate over a week ago (undoubtedly higher now), you need to just plan on getting it, up until we have herd immunity. Fortunately, if you're not elderly and don't have major, underlying health conditions, odds are you'll never even know you had this bug. That's especially true in the summer, when sunlight and warmth weaken the bug meaning the viral loading is lower, and also when our immune systems are strongest.

Get on with your life and just deal with it. Unless you're old or especially unhealthy. Oh, and unlike some particularly low-IQ governors-don't mandate that nursing homes accept covid-positive patients. Test nursing home and home health care workers regularly and ideally make sure they have antibodies and are past the infectious period.

It doesn't appear to require a person be "especially unhealthy." There are troubling cases of younger persons with no identified significant health issues dying from things such as covid-19 induced blood clotting.

 
Old 05-01-2020, 03:00 PM
 
19,387 posts, read 6,475,260 times
Reputation: 12310
Quote:
Originally Posted by roodd279 View Post
This post is confusing. Rachel, if you worked for 40 years, then you cannot also be part of the "very young" group. 20% of the dead people are under age 65.


Meantime - "being asymptomatic" means you have it. you're sick. you're infected. you are contagious.
When did I say was very young? I said not elderly. People in their early 60s aren’t elderly, and if they are in good health with absolutely no medical problems, the risk is low.

I also know what asymptomatic means. Doesn’t really relate to the question I raised in the OP, one of which is whether a teeny bit of virus - such as that remaining in mail - would be something healthy people’s immune system could probably fight off. I say probably because there are risks with other things too, including regular flu. Or even getting in the car and onto the highway. All of it is a risk-benefit decision.
 
Old 05-01-2020, 03:07 PM
 
19,387 posts, read 6,475,260 times
Reputation: 12310
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake View Post
Given the infectiousness, that the virus is in every state and nearly every county in the country, and that NYC had a 25% exposure rate over a week ago (undoubtedly higher now), you need to just plan on getting it, up until we have herd immunity. Fortunately, if you're not elderly and don't have major, underlying health conditions, odds are you'll never even know you had this bug. That's especially true in the summer, when sunlight and warmth weaken the bug meaning the viral loading is lower, and also when our immune systems are strongest.

Get on with your life and just deal with it. Unless you're old or especially unhealthy. Oh, and unlike some particularly low-IQ governors-don't mandate that nursing homes accept covid-positive patients. Test nursing home and home health care workers regularly and ideally make sure they have antibodies and are past the infectious period.
Yes, and this is what I think will happen. Almost everyone will eventually get it, and the trick is to get the exposure in a small dose - rather than a direct “hit” (like someone sneezing on you.) The problem is more the old folks in nursing homes and ALFs, who don’t fare well with it at all. So if half the people have been exposed to it by summer (assuming we are not stuck at home except for one hour at the grocery store per week), then the antibodies can be harvested, and used for treatments for the elderly.

Our immediate danger 6 weeks ago was a massive and sudden spike, overwhelming hospitals. Now that that is under control, limited exposure to the virus - to healthy, non-elderly people - might be a good thing.
 
Old 05-01-2020, 03:37 PM
 
3,996 posts, read 1,852,167 times
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"Healthy and young (or even relatively young bodies) are designed to fight off bacteria and viruses, and we do so all the time –"

Implies you, yourself, are young.

"I am pretty sure the situation with the prison was that 96% of the prisoners that tested positive for the virus were asymptomatic, not that 96% of the prisoners had the virus."

That was from Robert, my response was to him.

Regarding you original Q though – no, it doesn’t work that way.


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-h...-getting-sick/



high blood pressure, obesity, or diabetes are not especially unhealthy - er, uncommon. Probably 100 million people have those problems. For you personally - if you have none of them - that's great - but if you're relying on that to keep the overall death count down - poor strategy. Lots and lots of people have the "unhealthy."
 
Old 05-01-2020, 03:38 PM
 
3,996 posts, read 1,852,167 times
Reputation: 8583
Also this one, more recent:


https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/...b62459a92da14b
 
Old 05-01-2020, 03:42 PM
 
19,387 posts, read 6,475,260 times
Reputation: 12310
Quote:
Originally Posted by roodd279 View Post
"Healthy and young (or even relatively young bodies) are designed to fight off bacteria and viruses, and we do so all the time –"

Implies you, yourself, are young.

"I am pretty sure the situation with the prison was that 96% of the prisoners that tested positive for the virus were asymptomatic, not that 96% of the prisoners had the virus."

That was from Robert, my response was to him.

Regarding you original Q though – no, it doesn’t work that way.


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-h...-getting-sick/



high blood pressure, obesity, or diabetes are not especially unhealthy - er, uncommon. Probably 100 million people have those problems. For you personally - if you have none of them - that's great - but if you're relying on that to keep the overall death count down - poor strategy. Lots and lots of people have the "unhealthy."
I didn't mean to imply that I was young, and I use "we" in the general case - as in "we are all in this together."

Also, re my original question, do you have a background in microbiology and virology? And as far as your link, you posted one that supports your position. Someone else posted something that does say that viral load may indeed be a factor - both in degree of contagiousness and degree of illness when infected.

And finally, you say that HBP, obesity, and diabetes are not especially unhealthy, as in uncommon, but in the case of this virus, they count as underlying health conditions that do impact the outcome of this infection. (That's why blacks end up worse off; they suffer from all three of those conditions to a disproportionate degree.)
 
Old 05-01-2020, 03:47 PM
 
19,387 posts, read 6,475,260 times
Reputation: 12310
Quote:
Originally Posted by roodd279 View Post
I believe BOTH your sources are liberal, and we already know the liberal position is to delay opening of businesses. So I take it with a grain of salt.

Mine is a very valid question to raise: is the (impossible) attempt to completely avoid exposure to this virus (stay at home and venture out only once a week for groceries) ultimately the right course, given how so many of the youngish people have little to no symptoms if they are infected? And is the reason for having so many people showing up as having been infected (I believe NY is up to 25% thus far) because a) they have healthy immune systems, or b) the viral load was small, or c) a combination of both?

All this still calls for the vulnerable population - elderly or immuno-compromised - to remain at home.
 
Old 05-01-2020, 04:11 PM
 
Location: USA
18,461 posts, read 9,106,258 times
Reputation: 8495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rachel976 View Post
I believe BOTH your sources are liberal, and we already know the liberal position is to delay opening of businesses. So I take it with a grain of salt.

Mine is a very valid question to raise: is the (impossible) attempt to completely avoid exposure to this virus (stay at home and venture out only once a week for groceries) ultimately the right course, given how so many of the youngish people have little to no symptoms if they are infected? And is the reason for having so many people showing up as having been infected (I believe NY is up to 25% thus far) because a) they have healthy immune systems, or b) the viral load was small, or c) a combination of both?

All this still calls for the vulnerable population - elderly or immuno-compromised - to remain at home.
The liberal position is to close down all businesses so that they can impose socialism. Good, hard working, God fearing Americans must oppose the liberal socialist agenda.
 
Old 05-01-2020, 04:15 PM
 
19,387 posts, read 6,475,260 times
Reputation: 12310
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
The liberal position is to close down all businesses so that they can impose socialism. Good, hard working, God fearing Americans must oppose the liberal socialist agenda.
Now you're getting it! Congratulations.
 
Old 05-01-2020, 05:04 PM
 
3,996 posts, read 1,852,167 times
Reputation: 8583
Wow did you take that and run the wrong direction for a touchdown.



I do not care or notice where the links came from, but I see now you meant they are from a liberal source and therefore not to be trusted. Only the opposite point should be trusted, right?



https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/b...nce-viral-load


https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...-really-means/


Both of these sources should be suitably neutral for you. But if not - there are - literally - dozens of articles from biased and unbiased sources in all directions - who agree - hoping a small dose gives you immunity is a bad strategy. And that is IF you could "somehow" gage the load. Which you can't. And everyone agrees that if you're going to get infected just once - a light load is better - but by no means definitive. This viewpoint is echoed across dozens of articles, all of which I reviewed before choosing the first two for you because i thought the headline would save you reading time without realizing that you wouldn't bother reading it because you don't trust liberals. Nice. Had you stated that liberal viewpoints need not apply, I could have saved myself an hour of research. You're welcome.


If you search hard enough, sure, you'll find a few that support your position. None of them work at the CDC though.



Wow.



Meantime - my point about HPB/Obesity etc. - was not that they are not serious conditions - but that they are not visible. LOTS and LOTS of people have these conditions. And as a result - LOTS and LOTS of people are vulnerable. There are 60 million Americans older than you - and more than half of them have those conditions. Being "unhealthy" in the COVID sense does not mean knocking on death's door. It means - you're just an average person. Average people are not healthy. Nice way to get blacks into the argument though.


NY has 25% infected because they haven't tested everyone yet. It's probably more like 50%.


Meantime - the "vulnerable" cannot stay "isolated" for a very - simple - reason. 40% of adults age 25 - 40 live with their parents.



I - personally - think everyone will catch it eventually, and lots will die. Stay locked up, don't stay locked up - you change only the timeline, not the dead count, until a vaccine comes along. I have science and biology and data on my side. None of those things will cave to politics.
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