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Law enforcement officers really do not have any way to effectively restrain suspects that can ensure safety for both parties. This is assuming someone needs restraining.
If you have any grappling martial arts training, or wrestling, or full contact collision sport like Aussie Rules you have to work up to certain skill level before going full contact. If not, then someone risks injury. It is simply the nature of the action.
Now as a police, if someone is resisting, and police need to restrain, the same principle applies. You cannot gently bring someone down. You cannot gently pin someone down. This is not the movies. Effective technique requires force.
As for tools, LEO carry guns, taser, and possible some kind of bludgeon like a retractable baton. All those are only designed to hurt people. If someone resists you, and you pull one out of your utility belt, someone is bound to get hurt.
So in the case of Eric Garner, George Floyd, and even Michael Brown, while death is unnecessary, the inherent risk is always there. You can only tempt fate so many times before something happens. Thousands if not hundreds of thousands of arrests occur every year. Many times the police have to subdue the suspect.
Eric Garner as we can all see has obvious respiratory/cardiovascular issues, as did George Floyd.
Perhaps more could have been done for Mr Floyd, but in the heat of the moment, everything is happening so fast. The officers just not competent enough. From the article just posted, there was not even that much force applied to cause strangulation.
Law enforcement officers really do not have any way to effectively restrain suspects that can ensure safety for both parties. This is assuming someone needs restraining.
If you have any grappling martial arts training, or wrestling, or full contact collision sport like Aussie Rules you have to work up to certain skill level before going full contact. If not, then someone risks injury. It is simply the nature of the action.
Now as a police, if someone is resisting, and police need to restrain, the same principle applies. You cannot gently bring someone down. You cannot gently pin someone down. This is not the movies. Effective technique requires force.
As for tools, LEO carry guns, taser, and possible some kind of bludgeon like a retractable baton. All those are only designed to hurt people. If someone resists you, and you pull one out of your utility belt, someone is bound to get hurt.
So in the case of Eric Garner, George Floyd, and even Michael Brown, while death is unnecessary, the inherent risk is always there. You can only tempt fate so many times before something happens. Thousands if not hundreds of thousands of arrests occur every year. Many times the police have to subdue the suspect.
Eric Garner as we can all see has obvious respiratory/cardiovascular issues, as did George Floyd.
Perhaps more could have been done for Mr Floyd, but in the heat of the moment, everything is happening so fast. The officers just not competent enough. From the article just posted, there was not even that much force applied to cause strangulation.
If you resist, you SHOULD BE HURT until you comply. The batons the police are currently using are not heavy enough to do the damage required to subdue a criminal.
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68,330 posts, read 54,411,082 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133
Law enforcement officers really do not have any way to effectively restrain suspects that can ensure safety for both parties. This is assuming someone needs restraining.
If you have any grappling martial arts training, or wrestling, or full contact collision sport like Aussie Rules you have to work up to certain skill level before going full contact. If not, then someone risks injury. It is simply the nature of the action.
Now as a police, if someone is resisting, and police need to restrain, the same principle applies. You cannot gently bring someone down. You cannot gently pin someone down. This is not the movies. Effective technique requires force.
As for tools, LEO carry guns, taser, and possible some kind of bludgeon like a retractable baton. All those are only designed to hurt people. If someone resists you, and you pull one out of your utility belt, someone is bound to get hurt.
So in the case of Eric Garner, George Floyd, and even Michael Brown, while death is unnecessary, the inherent risk is always there. You can only tempt fate so many times before something happens. Thousands if not hundreds of thousands of arrests occur every year. Many times the police have to subdue the suspect.
Eric Garner as we can all see has obvious respiratory/cardiovascular issues, as did George Floyd.
Perhaps more could have been done for Mr Floyd, but in the heat of the moment, everything is happening so fast. The officers just not competent enough. From the article just posted, there was not even that much force applied to cause strangulation.
Law enforcement officers really do not have any way to effectively restrain suspects that can ensure safety for both parties. This is assuming someone needs restraining.
If you have any grappling martial arts training, or wrestling, or full contact collision sport like Aussie Rules you have to work up to certain skill level before going full contact. If not, then someone risks injury. It is simply the nature of the action.
Now as a police, if someone is resisting, and police need to restrain, the same principle applies. You cannot gently bring someone down. You cannot gently pin someone down. This is not the movies. Effective technique requires force.
As for tools, LEO carry guns, taser, and possible some kind of bludgeon like a retractable baton. All those are only designed to hurt people. If someone resists you, and you pull one out of your utility belt, someone is bound to get hurt.
So in the case of Eric Garner, George Floyd, and even Michael Brown, while death is unnecessary, the inherent risk is always there. You can only tempt fate so many times before something happens. Thousands if not hundreds of thousands of arrests occur every year. Many times the police have to subdue the suspect.
Eric Garner as we can all see has obvious respiratory/cardiovascular issues, as did George Floyd.
Perhaps more could have been done for Mr Floyd, but in the heat of the moment, everything is happening so fast. The officers just not competent enough. From the article just posted, there was not even that much force applied to cause strangulation.
I am a cop. I have a background in high school wrestling. I also hold a brown belt in Brazilian Jiujitsu (google Gracie).
Anyway, there are a lot things that can go wrong when you grapple with a combative subject on the street. I am going to name a few
1) you have to protect your firearm at all time
2) there maybe a second subject near by
3) the ground is hard
4) the subject maybe on drugs and has high pain tolerance
5) the subject may have pre-existing medical condition
Thing with Floyd was it wasn't heat of the moment. The cop sat on his neck for 14 minutes, including I think it was four minutes after he stopped doing anything and was most likely already dead. That's not heat of the moment. Part of why I find Floyd so much more disturbing than Garner. Garner was more heat of the moment. Garner was also more directly death by excessive force but heat of the moment. There's a reason NYPD banned the use of those choke holds in the '90s. Misapplied, as it was in the case of Garner, they can be fatal. The outrage with Pantaleo is more in that it took five years to take disciplinary action. That's not entirely on NYPD as they stepped out to allow the federal inquiry to run its course and, well, the feds sat on it and did nothing for four years but then they still dicked around for over a year after that as well. Ultimately, I think they came to the right decision in Garner but it should have been resolved in a matter of months and not years.
Law enforcement officers really do not have any way to effectively restrain suspects that can ensure safety for both parties. This is assuming someone needs restraining.
If you have any grappling martial arts training, or wrestling, or full contact collision sport like Aussie Rules you have to work up to certain skill level before going full contact. If not, then someone risks injury. It is simply the nature of the action.
Now as a police, if someone is resisting, and police need to restrain, the same principle applies. You cannot gently bring someone down. You cannot gently pin someone down. This is not the movies. Effective technique requires force.
As for tools, LEO carry guns, taser, and possible some kind of bludgeon like a retractable baton. All those are only designed to hurt people. If someone resists you, and you pull one out of your utility belt, someone is bound to get hurt.
So in the case of Eric Garner, George Floyd, and even Michael Brown, while death is unnecessary, the inherent risk is always there. You can only tempt fate so many times before something happens. Thousands if not hundreds of thousands of arrests occur every year. Many times the police have to subdue the suspect.
Eric Garner as we can all see has obvious respiratory/cardiovascular issues, as did George Floyd.
Perhaps more could have been done for Mr Floyd, but in the heat of the moment, everything is happening so fast. The officers just not competent enough. From the article just posted, there was not even that much force applied to cause strangulation.
He was already handcuffed. Can't see how he would have been much of a threat after that. Why would a cop have to kneel on somebody's neck for 8-9 minutes while they're saying they can't breathe? That's inhumane. You can't spin it any other way.
He was already handcuffed. Can't see how he would have been much of a threat after that. Why would a cop have to kneel on somebody's neck for 8-9 minutes while they're saying they can't breathe? That's inhumane. You can't spin it any other way.
I agree.
That cop in Minnesota really ****ed it up for 1 million hard working cops in the country. People have to realize that the vast majority of cops are good people. Every day there are millions of encounters between citizen and police, but how many of the encounters end up like this?
Are there room for improvement? Yes, there are always room for inprovement, but let's not start a war. Nobody is winning in a war.
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27,186 posts, read 13,477,157 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133
Law enforcement officers really do not have any way to effectively restrain suspects that can ensure safety for both parties. This is assuming someone needs restraining.
If you have any grappling martial arts training, or wrestling, or full contact collision sport like Aussie Rules you have to work up to certain skill level before going full contact. If not, then someone risks injury. It is simply the nature of the action.
Now as a police, if someone is resisting, and police need to restrain, the same principle applies. You cannot gently bring someone down. You cannot gently pin someone down. This is not the movies. Effective technique requires force.
As for tools, LEO carry guns, taser, and possible some kind of bludgeon like a retractable baton. All those are only designed to hurt people. If someone resists you, and you pull one out of your utility belt, someone is bound to get hurt.
So in the case of Eric Garner, George Floyd, and even Michael Brown, while death is unnecessary, the inherent risk is always there. You can only tempt fate so many times before something happens. Thousands if not hundreds of thousands of arrests occur every year. Many times the police have to subdue the suspect.
Eric Garner as we can all see has obvious respiratory/cardiovascular issues, as did George Floyd.
Perhaps more could have been done for Mr Floyd, but in the heat of the moment, everything is happening so fast. The officers just not competent enough. From the article just posted, there was not even that much force applied to cause strangulation.
It's far safer if it doesn't involve a chokehold or neck restraint and this includes kneeling on suspects, whith many police forces around the world have banned such techniques.
The correct procedure is only to take someone to the ground as a last resort, and in such circumstances to return them to a recovery, knelling, sitting or standing position as soon as they are cuffed.
Airways should be free from any force or obstruction, and breathing properly monitored.
If a suspect claims he can not breathe then he should be put in a recovery position.
Last edited by Brave New World; 05-31-2020 at 02:26 PM..
Law enforcement officers really do not have any way to effectively restrain suspects that can ensure safety for both parties. This is assuming someone needs restraining.
If you have any grappling martial arts training, or wrestling, or full contact collision sport like Aussie Rules you have to work up to certain skill level before going full contact. If not, then someone risks injury. It is simply the nature of the action.
Now as a police, if someone is resisting, and police need to restrain, the same principle applies. You cannot gently bring someone down. You cannot gently pin someone down. This is not the movies. Effective technique requires force.
As for tools, LEO carry guns, taser, and possible some kind of bludgeon like a retractable baton. All those are only designed to hurt people. If someone resists you, and you pull one out of your utility belt, someone is bound to get hurt.
So in the case of Eric Garner, George Floyd, and even Michael Brown, while death is unnecessary, the inherent risk is always there. You can only tempt fate so many times before something happens. Thousands if not hundreds of thousands of arrests occur every year. Many times the police have to subdue the suspect.
Eric Garner as we can all see has obvious respiratory/cardiovascular issues, as did George Floyd.
Perhaps more could have been done for Mr Floyd, but in the heat of the moment, everything is happening so fast. The officers just not competent enough. From the article just posted, there was not even that much force applied to cause strangulation.
Why not put him in the back of the squad car?
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