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Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 1 day ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,163 posts, read 13,449,232 times
Reputation: 19459
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgiaTransplant
Poland and other bases are ‘rotational’. You move a Brigade or more in, train for some period, move out. You can stop doing it very easily. You can claim they are actually at Bragg or Riley or wherever and just ‘temporarily deployed’ to Europe.
Most troops in Germany have been ‘stationed’-moved, usually with family, bringing a need for schools and medical centers and morale facilities. Pulling out is painful. You can’t claim they are not there.
The total number of troops may not even change. Their status and the resources needed to sustain them is very different.
I think the idea might be to open a base in Poland, something Trump has considered in the past, as the Polish have said they would contribute money towards a US base in Poland.
Germany also now has an upper limit or cap of 25,000 US personnel, so the planned closure and transfer of units such as the 100th Refuelling Wing to Ramstein and USAF 352nd Special Operations Wing to Spangdahlem, and the subsequent closure of Mildenhall in the UK may now be scrapped.
Some USAF units may also be moved, and Trump may look favourable at countries that meet the agreed 2% GDP Defence Target.
This of course may rely on Trump being re-elected, although the Dems might also welcome the cuts as they will also be looing to make cuts and have also criticised those in NATO who do not meet the 2% Target, indeed Obama was a vocal critic when he was President.
Quote:
Originally Posted by New York Times
“The reason we have troops overseas in Germany is not to protect Germans, everything we have is for our benefit,” said Frederick B. Hodges, a retired lieutenant general and a former top U.S. Army commander in Europe. “The decision doesn’t seem attached to any kind of strategy.”
A cap of 25,000 troops could force an even greater cut in forces in Germany. Troops frequently rotate into the country for exercises, drills and training, said General Hodges, now based in Frankfurt, as a scholar with the Center for European Policy Analysis. If no more than 25,000 are allowed, the number permanently stationed in the country might have to be cut deeper to accommodate those rotations.
Let the German's protect themselves. America is not the World police. When our allies % of GDP exceeds our for national defense, we can talk, otherwise, step up and protect yourselves.
I served my time in Germany. At that time, there was still a slight need for that many troops to be stationed in Germany. We don't need that many troops there anymore.
WWII is over. The Cold War is over. The Berlin Wall came down. After I got out, the cuts in the number of troops in Germany was huge. My entire base is no longer active. People who were on that base have taken vacations back to Mainz, and have driven by the base. It's a ghost town. You can't go on it. There's no people living and working on it. Same with a few other bases in the area that I used to patrol as an MP - ghost towns. That's a lot of troops that were not replaced in that area, let alone all the other areas across Germany.
I've seen video of other bases that I've been to, for training usually, and they, too are ghost towns, or the Germans have taken back that area and are using it for housing. (Some of it for refugees.)
I don't see why Germany should be complaining, if they are. About half of them didn't want us there in the first place. Not all of them hated our presence, though. I made a LOT of German friends when I lived there.
Anyway, just because they aren't in Germany doesn't mean that they aren't still deployed - it's just elsewhere, in an area that makes more sense.
I think Britain might cooperate with Europe to an extent on the sidelines but may also try and establish some kind of Five Eyes (Anglosphere) defence pact to replace NATO, should it's demise continue.
Trump will be re-elected and yes hopefully that will end NATO.
Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 1 day ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,163 posts, read 13,449,232 times
Reputation: 19459
Quote:
Originally Posted by HJ99
Well Trump did promise Putin to weaken NATO in exchange for support of Putin's troll bots for the upcoming election.
Putin will be very pleased.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBC News
US President Donald Trump has approved a plan to withdraw 9,500 American troops from bases in Germany by September, US media say.
Mr Trump, who has long complained that European members of Nato should spend more on their own defence, reportedly wants US troop levels capped at 25,000.
Troops would either be redeployed elsewhere or return home, US media report, citing a government official.
Tensions between the US and its Nato allies have increased under Mr Trump.
The president has said that Europe's North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (Nato) members should no longer be relying so heavily on the US to shoulder the costs of maintaining the alliance.
On Friday, Mr Trump directed the Pentagon to permanently remove almost a third of the country's troops currently based in Germany, the Wall Street Journal reported, citing an unnamed administration official.
Well Trump did promise Putin to weaken NATO in exchange for support of Putin's troll bots for the upcoming election.
And Obama promised Putin he'd have more flexibility after the election on a hot mic, and then reneged on the European Missile Defense system previously guaranteed by Bush. All to please Putin and Russia. We should be pulling troops out of Europe and putting them in Asia, closer to our real enemy CHINA.
Current polls show Biden slightly ahead, although there is still a long election campaign ahead.
The issue of NATO meeting the 2% is something that has political consensus in the US.
Don't trust the polls, they will turn out even more inaccurate than the last time....this is due to the bias in the polls combined with the fact most Trump voters won't respond to polls.
Americans are tired of foreign wars. It's more not wanting to get involved further in the Middle East but what actually is the goal of NATO considering the Soviet Union threat gone?
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