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Old 06-10-2020, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
24,597 posts, read 9,437,319 times
Reputation: 22935

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Race pandering, window dressing, semantics, and empty gestures.

As if a confederate symbol or name is oppressing someone from success.
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Old 06-10-2020, 10:34 AM
 
5,978 posts, read 2,232,627 times
Reputation: 4612
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
Race pandering, window dressing, semantics, and empty gestures.

As if a confederate symbol or name is oppressing someone from success.
So good everyone agrees it can go and no feeling will be harmed.
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Old 06-10-2020, 10:39 AM
 
72,971 posts, read 62,554,457 times
Reputation: 21871
Quote:
Originally Posted by bellhead View Post
Racism being pushed into the history books, the men these bases are named after all violated their oath to the constitution & led armed troops in an uprising. The collapse of confederate history is almost complete, monuments & statues to these traitors who fought to enslave millions of their fellow Americans are being removed & regulated to museums where they belong. Instead of being honored by having images & their names honored by naming parks, monuments, & military bases after them. It's long overdue.
They should have never gone up in the first. However, considering WHY they were going up in the first place, well, it gives a good insight.

1) Hatred towards the north. Many in the south were resentful towards the north. They saw the north as having destroyed their southern way of life, having destroyed their economy, their land.

2) Hatred towards Blacks. The southern way of life up to the Civil War was based on slavery. Those palatial plantations, the economy of the south, the social order, it was made possible by slavery. The vast majority of Blacks who fought in the Civil War fought for the Union. Many resented Blacks because they were now free. When slavery was ended by force, there was a big effort to preserve what many felt was lost. This is where Jim Crow came in. Those Jim Crow laws were based on the old slavery social order, with Blacks at the very bottom.

In the end, those Confederate statues were about assuaging wounded pride, hatred towards northerners, hatred towards Blacks. In general, those were monuments to the Lost Cause. The South wanted to be its own country so it could keep on with slavery and the slave holding way of life. The South lost their way of life, and sought to preserve what was left of it. Jim Crow and the rapid growth of Confederate monuments was the South's way of preserving what losing the war took. North beat us in war? We'll fly Confederate flags in quiet protest. Blacks are free people and citizens now? We'll put them under a quasi-dictactorship known as Jim Crow.

Those statues should have never gone up. There are so many other Americans, including southerners, who are more deserving of accolades and honor.
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Old 06-10-2020, 10:40 AM
 
72,971 posts, read 62,554,457 times
Reputation: 21871
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
Race pandering, window dressing, semantics, and empty gestures.

As if a confederate symbol or name is oppressing someone from success.
If you disagree with the removal of Confederate statues/renaming military bases, the least you could do is to quit bringing in these whataboutisms.
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Old 06-10-2020, 10:43 AM
 
72,971 posts, read 62,554,457 times
Reputation: 21871
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot1 View Post
Just stop with the over the top, butt hurt, virtue signaling and grow up. Didn't your parents teach you that names couldn't hurt you? So dwell on trivia and minutia to make yourself "FEEL" better. This stuff won't stop, and at some point they will go after YOU.
How about you stop with your straw man statements. How about you have the courage and honor to refute me, and prove me wrong. You've proven you disagree with what I have to say. Now prove what I've said is dishonest or historically wrong. If you can't do that, then at least have the courage to admit that you don't like what I've said.
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Old 06-10-2020, 10:47 AM
 
Location: Morrison, CO
34,229 posts, read 18,561,496 times
Reputation: 25797
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daryl_G View Post
So good everyone agrees it can go and no feeling will be harmed.
Nice way to try to justify it, but it's not about your FEELINGS nor anyone else's. It is about the long term health of our society and remembering our past history with visible examples, not crap tucked away in a museums or libraries.

Soon not only will the Colonial Betsy Ross Flag be accused as being a symbol of Racism but so will our current American Flag. That's next. Actually, that's already happening See where this is all going?
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Old 06-10-2020, 10:58 AM
 
72,971 posts, read 62,554,457 times
Reputation: 21871
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot1 View Post
Nice way to try to justify it, but it's not about your FEELINGS nor anyone else's. It is about the long term health of our society and remembering our past history with visible examples, not crap tucked away in a museums or libraries.

Soon not only will the Colonial Betsy Ross Flag be accused as being a symbol of Racism but so will our current American Flag. That's next. Actually, that's already happening See where this is all going?
The long term health of American society? American society has been divided and rife with problems from the very beginning. This nation almost imploded before getting to its centennial over the issue of slavery. The fact that America has lasted this long in spite of all of the internal problems is amazing. The fact is, Lee chose to fight for the army that was waging war against America, after he had sworn to protect America. And the Confederates were committed to tearing America apart because they wanted to keep slavery. That Robert E. Lee wasn't convicted and sentenced to death for treason is a miscarriage of justice. What happens to most traitors? They get locked up for life or they get the death penalty.

The South's society was not a healthy one, for a very long time. It was a society that went forth and long to promote the Lost Cause of the Confederacy. It wrote lies in its own textbooks to assuage its own bruised pride.

American society has never really been that healthy, not for everyone. For some, American society was worse than for others.
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Old 06-10-2020, 10:59 AM
 
15,064 posts, read 6,167,490 times
Reputation: 5124
Good. Losers don’t get prizes.
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Old 06-10-2020, 11:05 AM
 
7,300 posts, read 3,394,400 times
Reputation: 4812
Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner View Post
Good. Traitors do not deserve any accolades. Name them for those who weren't traitors.
By definition, there were no traitors in the Civil War. If there were, it was the Federalists were were attempting to remake the nation. One can't describe those trying to preserve the status quo as "traitors" by any stretch of the definition of the word, and no matter what one's view of the politics are.
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Old 06-10-2020, 11:07 AM
 
Location: In the reddest part of the bluest state
5,752 posts, read 2,779,493 times
Reputation: 4925
Why they were named for traitors is a mystery in the first place.
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