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How did they do it though? I don't see what actions will stop these type of shootings. Even here in Fort Wayne which is hardly a hotbed of crime, the (almost always) thug on thug shootings are infrequently solved and happen I won't say often but not like rarely. What we don't have much of here is random victim crime much at all though one super upsetting case last year of a black HS coach/youth mentor shot by a black savage (who got away with it btw). He was random.
On camera no less. No fear of capture apparently. I'd like to think the guy they shot was a child molestor at least, but probably not, probably just a drug/gang related "beef".
Yes, I know, it is insane. And the boldness of these criminals is astounding. They have no fear of being locked up because they will get out shortly thereafter. These problems are big. I'm not saying that a Giuliani-type can solve every problem in society--like whatever soil a hardened psychopath grows in--but at least they establish some semblance of order so that other things, like programs, businesses, good schools, etc. can start to come in and help. Without order, I can't see anything good happening. Because what I see now, is anyone who can flee an urban crime zone, will flee. Then all you have left is crime, and their helpless victims. It's very sad.
Actual police presence has nothing to do with increase/decrease in crime.
Politicians signaling surrender to mobs is the problem. The police are employees who take orders, not autonomous security robots. When a violent mob is wreaking havoc in some downtown USA location, it's because they have been allowed to by the people who give the police their orders. When gangs are running about creating dystopian hellscapes, it's because the people who give police their orders have decided to let those hellscapes happen.
You could have 10x the number of police with 10x the budget, and if the people issuing the police their orders abandon safety in the name of political convenience, you get lawlessness and insanity. The initiators of force out there know the politicians have surrendered and have told the cops to play nice or not even play at all. Further, they know the politicians will crack down hard on any private citizen operating under any sort of legit self-defense paradigm. So you get these random free-for-all PVP scenarios all across the country.
Funding doesn't have a thing to do with it. Political will is the problem.
What he said. Police can only do what those above them allow. And we all can see where that's heading.
Why I say we are losing the "war". Doesn't look like the momentum is decelerating any.
A lot of these shootings are drive-by's, or they're like domestic disputes. A fight at a party or a club or something. The police really can't stop them. At best they can arrest them afterwards.
Again.....
Nobody is suggesting that police can stop all murders.
But do you think de-funding the police, resulting in less officers with even less training is going to make the situation you describe better or worse?
It wouldn't be so bad if the people were allowed to defend themselves properly. When the criminals have been told (essentially, not actually) that they are allowed to do whatever they want, and the only people who will be prosecuted are anyone foolish enough to defend themselves...well, where was this stuff supposed to go?
Nobody is suggesting that police can stop all murderers.
But we're witnessing before our own eyes what happens when you decrease police presence.
Still waiting for someone to explain the rationale behind de-funding the police.
How is it going to make things better?
How will it improve the quality of policing?
How are "social workers" supposed to deescalate an "unarmed" 6'4, 300lb meth head?
The rationale is to bring about anarchy and the dismantling of systems. They paint it with a veneer of 'helping communities' only to appeal to people older than 30.
I'm kind of old school about protest movements--and perhaps you are too. I thought that a protest was about something---for something. Like a good cause...civil rights. Like improving things. So we expect a rationale.
However, when you look into the intellectual underpinnings of today's protest movements, they come from post-modern theory. Deconstruction. They are all about dismantling things, solely for the sake of dismantling them. They are nihilistic at their core. That's why whatever word salad they spout about how defunding police will help people--it makes no sense to a normal person. They want to dismantle the police so they can dismantle civil society, because it is inherently flawed due to it's power structures. Theirs is a bizarre nihilistic goal, that frankly I don't think many of their adherents have fully thought through.
With the pandemic, many businesses have been hurt. When people riot, loot, rob these businesses they hurt them even more. Some of these stores will never reopen.
Take the Atlanta Wendys for example. Has anybody thought about what percentage of customers were Black? Or what percentage of the employees were Black? Even if they do rebuild you are talking about months of lost wages to the community that needs the money the most. It isn't only that; but some insurers can drop out of the market and make it impossible to build.
When our police shoot or injure anybody there is an investigation launched. The very people that protest, riot, burn, mug or kill do not want to be investigated. They do not want to be caught or have to pay for their crimes. So there is a double standard at play. We want; but we don't want to pay is the name of the game.
But we're witnessing before our own eyes what happens when you decrease police presence.
Can you prove that the upswing in violence is caused by a reduction in police? Crime-rates vary from year to year, sometimes dramatically. Is that because of a reduction in police presence or from other factors? What factors? I think you are jumping to conclusions, especially since crime has risen even in cities who haven't defunded the police.
I'm not saying defunding the police is a good idea, but these shootings Republicans are suddenly worried about would have happened regardless.
I'm not saying defunding the police is a good idea, but these shootings Republicans are suddenly worried about would have happened regardless.
Yep. My point too. The type who would do this is not the type who would refrain from so doing, under almost any circumstance. Poor impulse control and a love of violence supercedes all.
Can you prove that the upswing in violence is caused by a reduction in police? Crime-rates vary from year to year, sometimes dramatically. Is that because of a reduction in police presence or from other factors? What factors? I think you are jumping to conclusions, especially since crime has risen even in cities who haven't defunded the police.
I'm not saying defunding the police is a good idea, but these shootings Republicans are suddenly worried about would have happened regardless.
Most things are from a confluence of factors. The fact that normal civil life has been essentially vacuumed up from urban areas due to the lockdowns probably contributes to the upswing in anti-social behavior. The removal of the strong momentum of 'normal' and the pro-social protective cushion it provides, has given the streets to criminals.
But the police have also been abandoned by their leaders, and are not able to police...so when the anti-social element knows this, what is preventing them from running rampant? Nothing I can think of.
A lot of these shootings are drive-by's, or they're like domestic disputes. A fight at a party or a club or something. The police really can't stop them. At best they can arrest them afterwards.
This^^^. Let's add that across the country "mass shootings" happen every day in the gang controlled high crime urban areas.
And no, the cops cant do anything but clean up the mess. These criminals have an endless supply of weapons coming from the cartels (stolen citizen owned firearms are a tiny part of the supply) and even if every legal gun owner turned in all their guns right now the criminals would still have an endless supply.
And just go ahead and add mist of those turned in legal guns to it. They'd find a way to steal them once the government has them.
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