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Old 07-22-2020, 10:18 PM
 
Location: New York City
19,061 posts, read 12,723,110 times
Reputation: 14783

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Yesssssssssssssssss

Lock her up!!
Lock her up!!
Lock her up!!
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Old 07-22-2020, 10:36 PM
 
Location: *
13,240 posts, read 4,927,027 times
Reputation: 3461
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_N_1962 View Post
What law did they break?
They have been charged with a felony under

Quote:
Under Section 571.030(4) of the Revised Statutes of Missouri, it is a crime when a person “[e]xhibits, in the presence of one or more persons, any weapon readily capable of lethal use in an angry or threatening manner.” Such a person “commits the offense of unlawful use of weapons,” which is defined as a class E felony. Such felonies carry up to four years in prison, one year in jail, and/or a $10,000 fine–but are subject to probation.
The McCloskeys, their defense attorneys, & the prosecution are all aware of previous case law analogous to the current case.

State v. Lutjen was decided by the Missouri Court of Appeals for the Western District & has been relied upon by the Missouri Supreme Court:

Quote:
... “To hold that it is incumbent upon the state to prove affirmatively that a pistol…which is exhibited in a rude, angry, and threatening manner, is loaded, as a condition precedent to a conviction, would be practically to render the statute unenforceable. This is not only the view which this court has already taken [citations], but it is the view held in all other jurisdictions…”

The [Missouri Jury Instructions and Charges] definition of readily capable of lethal use to mean readily capable of causing death does not impede our conclusion that a loaded gun need not be proven. Common equivalents of the word readily are easily or speedily. A gun is easily transformed into a lethal weapon by the insertion of bullets. The statute does not contemplate that the gun be already lethal [loaded], but only that the weapon can readily become lethal [by loading].
https://lawandcrime.com/george-floyd...ers-with-guns/

The state does not have to prove that a weapon was operable during a criminal incident in order to satisfy the “readily capable of lethal use” language in the statute.

Brandishing weapons in an angry threatening manner could have reasonably put the protesters in fear for their safety ~ how were they to know that one of the weapons brandished was inoperable at the time.
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Old 07-22-2020, 10:49 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,029 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiGeekGuest View Post
They have been charged with a felony under



The McCloskeys, their defense attorneys, & the prosecution are all aware of previous case law analogous to the current case.

State v. Lutjen was decided by the Missouri Court of Appeals for the Western District & has been relied upon by the Missouri Supreme Court:



https://lawandcrime.com/george-floyd...ers-with-guns/

The state does not have to prove that a weapon was operable during a criminal incident in order to satisfy the “readily capable of lethal use” language in the statute.

Brandishing weapons in an angry threatening manner could have reasonably put the protesters in fear for their safety ~ how were they to know that one of the weapons brandished was inoperable at the time.
They weren't protestors. They were criminal trespassers, the aggressors in this incident. The couple was legally engaging in self-defense of their lives and property as MO law clearly permits.
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Old 07-22-2020, 10:49 PM
 
Location: *
13,240 posts, read 4,927,027 times
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Circuit Attorney Kimberly M. Gardner's statement said she’s willing to recommend the couple participate in a diversion program designed to reduce unnecessary involvement with the Courts; she said this would be a fair resolution to this matter.
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Old 07-22-2020, 10:53 PM
 
Location: SE Asia
16,236 posts, read 5,882,675 times
Reputation: 9117
Quote:
Originally Posted by tamajane View Post
They probably had it working and then disassembled it before it was taken, for their case. They knew what was going to happen.
Maybe, but then that is for the prosecution to prove. As it is the gun wasn't functional when it was taken into police custody. Meaning it was no more dangerous than a replica. So can you be charged anyway? Because the protestors didn't know that the gun wasn't functional so it had the same effect. Oh but wait, does that mean that the 2 gun owners were also justified in feeling threatened? I mean violence and mayhem do seem to follow those BLM protests on a fairly regular basis. Yeah if I was on the jury I would have to say NOT GUILTY.
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Old 07-22-2020, 10:59 PM
 
18,561 posts, read 7,375,874 times
Reputation: 11376
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiGeekGuest View Post
They have been charged with a felony under



The McCloskeys, their defense attorneys, & the prosecution are all aware of previous case law analogous to the current case.

State v. Lutjen was decided by the Missouri Court of Appeals for the Western District & has been relied upon by the Missouri Supreme Court:



https://lawandcrime.com/george-floyd...ers-with-guns/

The state does not have to prove that a weapon was operable during a criminal incident in order to satisfy the “readily capable of lethal use” language in the statute.

Brandishing weapons in an angry threatening manner could have reasonably put the protesters in fear for their safety ~ how were they to know that one of the weapons brandished was inoperable at the time.
"Fear" doesn't matter. It's not an "assault" statute. Being operable and being loaded are two different things, as your own case points out. We know for a fact that the gun wasn't operable. There is no crime.
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Old 07-22-2020, 11:01 PM
 
Location: *
13,240 posts, read 4,927,027 times
Reputation: 3461
Quote:
Originally Posted by boneyard1962 View Post
Maybe, but then that is for the prosecution to prove. As it is the gun wasn't functional when it was taken into police custody. Meaning it was no more dangerous than a replica. So can you be charged anyway? Because the protestors didn't know that the gun wasn't functional so it had the same effect. Oh but wait, does that mean that the 2 gun owners were also justified in feeling threatened? I mean violence and mayhem do seem to follow those BLM protests on a fairly regular basis. Yeah if I was on the jury I would have to say NOT GUILTY.
"Our law has always placed a higher value upon human safety than upon mere rights in property." [Katko v. Briney 183 N.W.2d 657]
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Old 07-22-2020, 11:03 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,029 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiGeekGuest View Post
"Our law has always placed a higher value upon human safety than upon mere rights in property." [Katko v. Briney 183 N.W.2d 657].
Why would anyone assume the couple was safe when a criminal mob was threatening their lives?
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Old 07-22-2020, 11:08 PM
 
Location: *
13,240 posts, read 4,927,027 times
Reputation: 3461
I was not aware of the 'Property Matters More Than Lives' movement?
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Old 07-23-2020, 12:11 AM
 
Location: in a galaxy far far away
19,221 posts, read 16,701,480 times
Reputation: 33352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer Time View Post
The state AG has had enough of this farce.

https://saraacarter.com/enough-is-en...-be-dismissed/
Good. It's about time. It was a bogus charge to begin with.
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