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The land with no face masks: Holland's top scientists say there's no solid evidence coverings work and warn they could even damage the fight against Covid-19
Some excerpts from the article are reposted below for those without time to read the entire article. I am posting this article for another data point for people to make up their own minds about the practical effectiveness of full-time, mandatory requirement of masks.
'Face masks in public places are not necessary, based on all the current evidence,' said Coen Berends, spokesman for the National Institute for Public Health and the Environment. 'There is no benefit and there may even be negative impact.'
Holland's position is based on assessments by the Outbreak Management Team, a group of experts advising the government. It first ruled against masks in May and has re-evaluated the evidence several times, including again last week.
It believes they detract from a clear three-pronged message that has kept deaths from coronavirus down to less than half the rate in Britain: wash hands regularly, maintain social distancing of 1.5 metres and stay at home if suffering any symptoms.
The one exception outside of the medical frontline has been on public transport, where masks are mandatory on the basis it is difficult to stay apart on crowded buses, ferries and trains
Christian Hoebe, head of infectious disease control in Zuid-Limburg, the region hit hardest when the pandemic struck Holland, pointed to a Norwegian study showing 200,000 people must wear surgical masks for one week to stop a single Covid-19 case.
Wearers routinely misuse or contaminate their coverings by fitting them incorrectly, failing to change them and touching their faces.
'I was in Belgium recently and saw many people putting them beneath their noses, upside down or under chins', says Hoebe. 'Others stuffed them in their pockets. The effectiveness also depends on the right fabric and the mask being worn very close to the nose.'
The World Health Organisation has also been sceptical, warning that 'widespread use of masks by healthy people in the community setting is not yet supported by high-quality or direct scientific evidence'.
Although changing its advice in June to back the encouragement of mask wearing in some settings, the WHO lists 11 'potential harms' that range from discomfort through to self-contamination and lower compliance with more critical preventative measures.
ABSOLUTELY masks protect the wearer - and when they don't 100%, you may not get as sick, either - because viral load matters. ANY protection is better than none.
I'm a mask wearer. Only the people NOT WEARING MASKS on that bus were INFECTED.
Also - I'm not a Mask Nazi. Other people want to be stupid, I ignore them and stay far away.
I think everyone agrees that on a bus or other instances where people are packed close together, the disease can spread faster. But wearing a mask doesn't prevent the virus from making its way into your eyes.
My first focus is hand washing and hygiene practices. Admittedly I have always had a bit of a compulsion towards hand washing because I don't like the sensation of foreign substances on my skin. So whether it be dirt, grease, oil, mud or grit on my hands I have always hated the sensation of it and I would wash my hands frequently. I did not have to adjust my behavior when COVID19 hit the scene.
My second focus is on maintaining six feet or more of physical distance from other people. This was an adjustment for me but I actually like this way. In the past I had fairly frequent occurrences of other people getting too close in public settings and COVID19 has reduced those occurrences. If it were up to me I'd keep social distancing around forever. It is nice to have a little bit of mandated personal space around me at all times.
Mask wearing is a distance third. I keep a mask on me at all times in public but I only put it on where social distance cannot be reasonably maintained or it is mandated by store management or government.
We are in a pandemic. Had we had a President capable of leading he would have told the nation we need to wear masks and stay at home as much as possible to beat this. The red state minions would have listened and the blue state already adhere to common sense. Hot wearing masks is what Herman Cain did.
The only bright side of the anti maskers is that they are doing damage to their own voters.
I just read a few days ago that they're facing their second wave. Shouldn't people be immune by now, given their theory?
No one is immune for very long. People who've previously had CV will in all likelihood get it again, but not quite as severely - so say many doctors. Immunity for coronavirus - cold viruses can also be coronaviruses, just not CV-19 - is very short-lived.
So, yes, there will be another wave this winter - and the very same people who had it before may get it again - and the very same people who for some reason have immunity and will never get it will also not get it again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thelinnen
Way to just ignore the article..
And 'way' to just ignore some very real salient points made by others on this thread such as:
Quote:
Originally Posted by lchoro
They're beneficial when you're in close proximity to someone who's infected or in a congested area where there is lot of people contributing virus particles to the air. Netherlands just ordered face masks in busy public areas in addition to the standing order to wear them in public transportation. That's why they're in heavy use in Asia which is heavily urbanized like the Netherlands.
If you read the original post, it's heavily qualified. The doctors believe people with masks ignore avoiding crowds.
In the end, masks protect you from 70-95 percent of the particles depending on the type of mask. If the number of particles in the air are such that they overwhelm the defenses, the wearer of the mask will still get sick.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LifeIsGood01
It's easy to say such nonsense when scientists are not studying masks.
Indeed, but we've got other studies which should provide sufficient evidence on effectiveness, such as:
But the naysayers will always deny evidence if it conflicts with their world view. Herman Cain is the poster child for doing so. I would have thought his death would have FINALLY awakened people to the value of social distancing and wearing masks. And, for heaven's sake, if you are over 70 - avoid crowds, avoid crowded indoor gatherings, and when you can't, BE CAREFUL.
Last edited by Ariadne22; 08-02-2020 at 07:12 PM..
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