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100 pages of State Dept. documents have been released that highlight corruption regarding Ukraine and the Bidens.
There are statements from the fired Ukrainian prosecutor Viktor Shokin, and current Ukrainian prosecutor Yuriy Lutsenko. It starts at page 61 of the PDF. Start there for the relevant info.
100 pages of State Dept. documents have been released that highlight corruption regarding Ukraine and the Bidens.
There are statements from the fired Ukrainian prosecutor Viktor Shokin, and current Ukrainian prosecutor Yuriy Lutsenko. It starts at page 61 of the PDF. Start there for the relevant info.
Not surprised.......I've been waiting for something to pop up like this......
Goodbye Uncle Joe, we hardly knew ya.......
Actually, we knew creepy Joe too well. That includes his "secrets", his idiotic conduct, his sleezy dismisal of the truth whenever he is confronted with it. Slimy Joe is a disgrace, and proof that the DNC is entirely corrupt for trying to force him down America's throat, the way they tried doing with corrupt Hillary. It says alot about the democratic party, and how low they have sunk, when Hillary Clinton and dopey Joe Biden are the best they can summon for election.
I had not intended to comment on this, not wanting to take the time to type out much but finally could not resist skimming more documents. I am shocked I tell you shocked. Seriously, not sure whether it is more appropriate to laugh or cry (for this is our country today).
It's a hot mess. These guys are idiots. The ironic thing is that Rudy says he was in Ukraine defending Trump. What he did was to bring Trump to the brink of impeachment.
The timeline has Biden "believed" to have threatened Poroshenko about the loan guarantees in a call on March 22 2016. But Poroshenko had already fired Shokin back in mid-February, with Shokin reported to have submitted an official resignation letter (Ukrainian press announcement). The Ukrainian Parliament did not ratify the dismissal until late March 2016.
The Biden meeting with Poroshenko in Ukraine he described in the CFR video occurred in early December 2015. Per Biden, he brought up the firing at that time. The IMF added its threat about its loan guarantees in mid-February right before Poroshenko finally acted. Unlike the US who waited until the Ukrainian Parliament acted (and Obama and Poroshenko met in early April), the IMF started releasing funds in mid-February right after Poroshenko fired Shokin.
There's nothing inherently wrong with the Biden "threat," so the date itself is not so important but it shows how sloppy Solomon was with multiple guesses. The larger point is why Biden played his role (along with others) in wanting Shokin gone.
------
There are major flaws with the Shokin comments (not the least of which they are being solicited for specific reasons years after the fact about a man involved in firing him for corruption). Shokin makes reference to but leaves out details that Zlochevsky is alleged to have been bribing the prosecutor general before Shokin ($7m) ... that President Poroshenko had deep ties to Zlochevsky ... that even according to Shokin it was Poroshenko who did not want Burisma investigated ... that when Shokin finally prepared his Affidavit after the Trump call he was promised per his associates it would be kept confidential (too embarrassing to him per Poroshenko?). The Affidavit was filed in a Firtash (an oligarch with ties to the Russian mafia) pleading, who thru attorneys working with Giuliani and Parnas approached the DOJ in an attempt to avoid U.S. extradition.
The larger problem is how did Shokin know what he alleged: that Joe wanted him gone to protect Hunter. Joe told him? Sure. Here it looks like Shokin alleges the then U.S. ambassador (Pyatt) told him in July 2015 that Burisma should be handled with 'white gloves'. But then that same ambassador turned around and criticized Shokin in September 2015 for not investigating Burisma. How much sense does that make? So we have Shokin's guess about a comment that a third party made. In both the notes and Affidavit you will see Shokin turning unsubstantiated beliefs into firm statements of fact.
The reality is that Burisma was a highly sensitive issue since someone in the General Prosecutors Office in 2014 torpedoed the UK money laundering investigation into Zlochevsky. And there are allegations the UK prosecutor's office may have wanted certain facts handled carefully (UK prosecutorial malfeasance, corrupt Ukrainians sponsored by the US/IMF?). At that point my eyes begin to glaze over - but whatever those charges may be they have absolutely nothing to do with Hunter Biden.
----------
Lutsenko later retracted his "beliefs" or flat-out assertions about Joe Biden saying he played Giuliani. Giuliani now calls Lutsenko a liar. And Trump now wants to say he did not send Rudy to Ukraine!!!
There is a long Lutsenko interview with the BBC (recent) where he now says he explained to Rudy that Hunter Biden was allowed as a board member to also consult for Burisma. Burisma could pay him whatever it chose as a board member. No violations of Ukrainian law. The millions have disappeared in this recounting. Joe Biden's role has disappeared.
There was other interesting stuff about how the Ukrainian prosecutorial system is set-up that reinforces why Shokin could not hurt Hunter Biden for certain Burisma investigations and thus was no threat to be fired - namely, the relationship between the NABU / SAP and the GPO. But to get the implications there you'd have to understand more about the specific Burisma investigations. And the power struggles within Ukraine. Needless to say you would never hear it explained in a John Solomon column or by Rudy on TV.
Actually, we knew creepy Joe too well. That includes his "secrets", his idiotic conduct, his sleezy dismisal of the truth whenever he is confronted with it. Slimy Joe is a disgrace, and proof that the DNC is entirely corrupt for trying to force him down America's throat, the way they tried doing with corrupt Hillary. It says alot about the democratic party, and how low they have sunk, when Hillary Clinton and dopey Joe Biden are the best they can summon for election.
The EXACT SAME THING can be said for the GOP and TRUMP. Actually, we know The Liar Trump too well. That includes his "secrets," his despicable conduct, his sleazy nonstop lies and more lies when he is confronted with his lies. Crooked Liar Trump is a disgrace, proof that the GOP is entirely corrupt for trying to keep this egomaniacal liar, bully, extortionist, and traitor in office. It says a lot about the Republican Party, and how low they have sunk when self-serving narcissist and thief, liar, traitor, Bully-in-Chief Trump is the best it can support.
Last edited by Ariadne22; 11-27-2019 at 08:13 PM..
I had not intended to comment on this, not wanting to take the time to type out much but finally could not resist skimming more documents. I am shocked I tell you shocked. Seriously, not sure whether it is more appropriate to laugh or cry (for this is our country today).
It's a hot mess. These guys are idiots. The ironic thing is that Rudy says he was in Ukraine defending Trump. What he did was to bring Trump to the brink of impeachment.
The timeline has Biden "believed" to have threatened Poroshenko about the loan guarantees in a call on March 22 2016. But Poroshenko had already fired Shokin back in mid-February, with Shokin reported to have submitted an official resignation letter (Ukrainian press announcement). The Ukrainian Parliament did not ratify the dismissal until late March 2016.
The Biden meeting with Poroshenko in Ukraine he described in the CFR video occurred in early December 2015. Per Biden, he brought up the firing at that time. The IMF added its threat about its loan guarantees in mid-February right before Poroshenko finally acted. Unlike the US who waited until the Ukrainian Parliament acted (and Obama and Poroshenko met in early April), the IMF started releasing funds in mid-February right after Poroshenko fired Shokin.
There's nothing inherently wrong with the Biden "threat," so the date itself is not so important but it shows how sloppy Solomon was with multiple guesses. The larger point is why Biden played his role (along with others) in wanting Shokin gone.
------
There are major flaws with the Shokin comments (not the least of which they are being solicited for specific reasons years after the fact about a man involved in firing him for corruption). Shokin makes reference to but leaves out details that Zlochevsky is alleged to have been bribing the prosecutor general before Shokin ($7m) ... that President Poroshenko had deep ties to Zlochevsky ... that even according to Shokin it was Poroshenko who did not want Burisma investigated ... that when Shokin finally prepared his Affidavit after the Trump call he was promised per his associates it would be kept confidential (too embarrassing to him per Poroshenko?). The Affidavit was filed in a Firtash (an oligarch with ties to the Russian mafia) pleading, who thru attorneys working with Giuliani and Parnas approached the DOJ in an attempt to avoid U.S. extradition.
The larger problem is how did Shokin know what he alleged: that Joe wanted him gone to protect Hunter. Joe told him? Sure. Here it looks like Shokin alleges the then U.S. ambassador (Pyatt) told him in July 2015 that Burisma should be handled with 'white gloves'. But then that same ambassador turned around and criticized Shokin in September 2015 for not investigating Burisma. How much sense does that make? So we have Shokin's guess about a comment that a third party made. In both the notes and Affidavit you will see Shokin turning unsubstantiated beliefs into firm statements of fact.
The reality is that Burisma was a highly sensitive issue since someone in the General Prosecutors Office in 2014 torpedoed the UK money laundering investigation into Zlochevsky. And there are allegations the UK prosecutor's office may have wanted certain facts handled carefully (UK prosecutorial malfeasance, corrupt Ukrainians sponsored by the US/IMF?). At that point my eyes begin to glaze over - but whatever those charges may be they have absolutely nothing to do with Hunter Biden.
----------
Lutsenko later retracted his "beliefs" or flat-out assertions about Joe Biden saying he played Giuliani. Giuliani now calls Lutsenko a liar. And Trump now wants to say he did not send Rudy to Ukraine!!!
There is a long Lutsenko interview with the BBC (recent) where he now says he explained to Rudy that Hunter Biden was allowed as a board member to also consult for Burisma. Burisma could pay him whatever it chose as a board member. No violations of Ukrainian law. The millions have disappeared in this recounting. Joe Biden's role has disappeared.
There was other interesting stuff about how the Ukrainian prosecutorial system is set-up that reinforces why Shokin could not hurt Hunter Biden for certain Burisma investigations and thus was no threat to be fired - namely, the relationship between the NABU / SAP and the GPO. But to get the implications there you'd have to understand more about the specific Burisma investigations. And the power struggles within Ukraine. Needless to say you would never hear it explained in a John Solomon column or by Rudy on TV.
You say Shokin was fired or resigned Feb. 2016. HE said he was fired in April of 2016. Who should I believe?
Biden bragged about it.
I don't need to understand anything you wrote. They have already spoken about it. You don't trust them?
I had not intended to comment on this, not wanting to take the time to type out much but finally could not resist skimming more documents. I am shocked I tell you shocked. Seriously, not sure whether it is more appropriate to laugh or cry (for this is our country today).
It's a hot mess. These guys are idiots. The ironic thing is that Rudy says he was in Ukraine defending Trump. What he did was to bring Trump to the brink of impeachment.
The timeline has Biden "believed" to have threatened Poroshenko about the loan guarantees in a call on March 22 2016. But Poroshenko had already fired Shokin back in mid-February, with Shokin reported to have submitted an official resignation letter (Ukrainian press announcement). The Ukrainian Parliament did not ratify the dismissal until late March 2016.
The Biden meeting with Poroshenko in Ukraine he described in the CFR video occurred in early December 2015. Per Biden, he brought up the firing at that time. The IMF added its threat about its loan guarantees in mid-February right before Poroshenko finally acted. Unlike the US who waited until the Ukrainian Parliament acted (and Obama and Poroshenko met in early April), the IMF started releasing funds in mid-February right after Poroshenko fired Shokin.
There's nothing inherently wrong with the Biden "threat," so the date itself is not so important but it shows how sloppy Solomon was with multiple guesses. The larger point is why Biden played his role (along with others) in wanting Shokin gone.
------
There are major flaws with the Shokin comments (not the least of which they are being solicited for specific reasons years after the fact about a man involved in firing him for corruption). Shokin makes reference to but leaves out details that Zlochevsky is alleged to have been bribing the prosecutor general before Shokin ($7m) ... that President Poroshenko had deep ties to Zlochevsky ... that even according to Shokin it was Poroshenko who did not want Burisma investigated ... that when Shokin finally prepared his Affidavit after the Trump call he was promised per his associates it would be kept confidential (too embarrassing to him per Poroshenko?). The Affidavit was filed in a Firtash (an oligarch with ties to the Russian mafia) pleading, who thru attorneys working with Giuliani and Parnas approached the DOJ in an attempt to avoid U.S. extradition.
The larger problem is how did Shokin know what he alleged: that Joe wanted him gone to protect Hunter. Joe told him? Sure. Here it looks like Shokin alleges the then U.S. ambassador (Pyatt) told him in July 2015 that Burisma should be handled with 'white gloves'. But then that same ambassador turned around and criticized Shokin in September 2015 for not investigating Burisma. How much sense does that make? So we have Shokin's guess about a comment that a third party made. In both the notes and Affidavit you will see Shokin turning unsubstantiated beliefs into firm statements of fact.
The reality is that Burisma was a highly sensitive issue since someone in the General Prosecutors Office in 2014 torpedoed the UK money laundering investigation into Zlochevsky. And there are allegations the UK prosecutor's office may have wanted certain facts handled carefully (UK prosecutorial malfeasance, corrupt Ukrainians sponsored by the US/IMF?). At that point my eyes begin to glaze over - but whatever those charges may be they have absolutely nothing to do with Hunter Biden.
----------
Lutsenko later retracted his "beliefs" or flat-out assertions about Joe Biden saying he played Giuliani. Giuliani now calls Lutsenko a liar. And Trump now wants to say he did not send Rudy to Ukraine!!!
There is a long Lutsenko interview with the BBC (recent) where he now says he explained to Rudy that Hunter Biden was allowed as a board member to also consult for Burisma. Burisma could pay him whatever it chose as a board member. No violations of Ukrainian law. The millions have disappeared in this recounting. Joe Biden's role has disappeared.
There was other interesting stuff about how the Ukrainian prosecutorial system is set-up that reinforces why Shokin could not hurt Hunter Biden for certain Burisma investigations and thus was no threat to be fired - namely, the relationship between the NABU / SAP and the GPO. But to get the implications there you'd have to understand more about the specific Burisma investigations. And the power struggles within Ukraine. Needless to say you would never hear it explained in a John Solomon column or by Rudy on TV.
KUDOS for clearly laying out how complicated and convoluted the entire mess is. It is so easy for the liars and propagandists to misrepresent the situation because NO ONE will ever take the time to READ and follow the TIMELINE on this.
In the end, people will believe the lie that fits their world view - not the reality.
The EXACT SAME THING can be said for the GOP and TRUMP. Crooked Liar Trump is a disgrace, proof that the GOP is entirely corrupt for trying to keep this egomaniacal liar, bully, extortionist, and traitor in office. It says a lot about the Republican Party, and how low they have sunk when self-serving narcissist and thief, liar, traitor, Bully-in-Chief Trump is the best it can support.
The GOP DID NOT try to shove an establishment creep down America's throat like the DNC did, and is still trying to do. They allowed their constituents to decide who was most qualified to lead America, and they freely choose Trump, a complete outsider and dark horse candidate. DNC would never allow that sort of thing to happen.
The DNC is operated just like the mafia and actively works to REPRESS the will of the people. It's been demonstrated, it's been prove, there is no refuting it, there is no argument that can be made in their defense. Dims put up with it because deep down inside, they don't trust themselves to make the right decision. They are happy with letting someone else decide who they should vote for.
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Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
