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Old 12-29-2020, 07:58 AM
 
Location: Japan
15,292 posts, read 7,779,017 times
Reputation: 10007

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Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
This is not about Lincoln.

It’s all about the slave groveling at his feet.
Repeating that over and over doesn't make it any more true.
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Old 12-29-2020, 07:58 AM
 
Location: A Nation Possessed
25,947 posts, read 18,946,695 times
Reputation: 22731
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cape Cod Todd View Post
They are so misguided, ridiculous and pessimistic. Do they even know what they want? The statue depicts hope and all they see is oppression.
And they are spitting in the face of those who actually DID face oppression. There has never been such a pampered generation as that of the morons who are tearing down the statues. Historically speaking, it hasn't been all that long ago that folks their age would typically be dead. They've never once faced hunger, never once faced REAL disease, never once faced a significant challenge to their lives, never once faced a time where they couldn't afford to dye their hair blue and get a blm tattoo. We're living in a violent version of Idiocracy (the movie).
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Old 12-29-2020, 07:58 AM
 
9,897 posts, read 3,440,774 times
Reputation: 7737
Quote:
Originally Posted by moneill View Post
What matters is how Black people perceive it -- not you....it's not all about you -- -or me.

I personally don't have a horse in this race. But I understand why it may be offensive.

So remove it -- it isn't history, it is a statue.

It does not erase history.

History is not the statues built
Then what is history? Words? How long before the woke demand only certain accounts and narratives are to be written? (And you know that's coming.)
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Old 12-29-2020, 07:59 AM
 
9,897 posts, read 3,440,774 times
Reputation: 7737
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dark Enlightenment View Post
Repeating that over and over doesn't make it any more true.
Right? They see what they want to see.
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Old 12-29-2020, 08:02 AM
 
Location: NNJ
15,076 posts, read 10,136,586 times
Reputation: 17288
I don't like the take down of statues.. if anything I hope they are protected in a museum to preserve historical context. Even if the statue is perceived as racial or offensive, its still good to preserve history. Whether or not statues are destroyed or just removed from public viewing are two different things.

But I also don't see how removal of statues equates to Marxism... that's just drama.
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Old 12-29-2020, 08:05 AM
 
Location: A Nation Possessed
25,947 posts, read 18,946,695 times
Reputation: 22731
Quote:
Originally Posted by usayit View Post
I don't like the take down of statues.. if anything I hope they are protected in a museum to preserve historical context. Even if the statue is perceived as racial or offensive, its still good to preserve history. Whether or not statues are destroyed or just removed from public viewing are two different things.

But I also don't see how removal of statues equates to Marxism... that's just drama.
Then you should study Marxism a bit. It's one of their fundamental tenets: erase society's history.
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Old 12-29-2020, 08:06 AM
 
Location: NNJ
15,076 posts, read 10,136,586 times
Reputation: 17288
Quote:
Originally Posted by Absolom View Post
Then what is history? Words? How long before the woke demand only certain accounts and narratives are to be written? (And you know that's coming.)
Consider Nazi related items on display in the Holocaust Memorial Museum versus similar items on display in public.

Two different things.... different contexts.
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Old 12-29-2020, 08:07 AM
 
Location: NNJ
15,076 posts, read 10,136,586 times
Reputation: 17288
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisC View Post
Then you should study Marxism a bit. It's one of their fundamental tenets: erase society's history.
No one is erasing history here.... no more than the removal of Camp Nordland, NJ was removal of history from that time period. Its fake outrage.

Keep in mind, I'm against the removal of these statues... but the public if so wish should have a choice of whether or not it is displayed in public (celebrated) or preserved in museum (historical).
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Old 12-29-2020, 08:10 AM
 
26,583 posts, read 15,149,248 times
Reputation: 14711
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Seems to me, most people, regardless of their politics, don’t care about statues.

This particular statue shows Lincoln with the Emancipation proclamation in hand while a black slave grovels at his feet.

It’s weird.
#1 It was paid for and designed by freed slaves - literally former slaves paid for it. Why are Democrats trying to silence the voices of freed slaves?

#2 It represents in part Lincoln's trip to Richmond Virginia on April 4, 1865. Upon entering the captured confederate capital, slaves mobbed Lincoln, bowed to him, and tried to kiss his feet. At that point Lincoln said and I am paraphrasing - 'don't kneel before me, kneel only before God for he is the one who has freed you, I am but merely his humble instrument, but so long as I live no one will again put shackles on your limbs.'

On April 11 Lincoln then became the first sitting president to propose some black voting rights and John Wilkes Booth in the audience said that is the last speech he will ever make, that means N-word citizenship. On April 14 Booth shot Lincoln who died the next morning.

Learn history instead of tearing it down.
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Old 12-29-2020, 08:17 AM
 
Location: Chicago Area
12,687 posts, read 6,752,608 times
Reputation: 6598
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Seems to me, most people, regardless of their politics, don’t care about statues.

This particular statue shows Lincoln with the Emancipation proclamation in hand while a black slave grovels at his feet.

It’s weird.
This is a very poor interpretation and honestly you're reaching for something that just isn't there.

Lacking the ability to animate the stature, I suppose it's impossible to make it 100% clear on the message they're trying to convey: The black slaves were on their knees. Abraham Lincoln and the abolitionists rescued them from it. If you could add animation to the statue, you would no doubt see Abe Lincoln helping the man rise to his feet -- which is what the black Americans who designed the statue intended.

Jumping to conclusions and inserting the least charitable interpretation is most certainly unhelpful. Only a completed idiot is unaware that Lincoln is the single most important man to made Emancipation happen, so the interpretation that he is the man who has them on their hands and knees makes no historical sense whatsoever. If the black Americans who designed and created the statue left a message that is confusing, I think the most charitable interpretation is in order.

At the end of the day, if the statue is on public property and the people of Boston voted to remove it, then remove it. But I do find the lies about the intended meaning of the statue pretty ridiculous. The original that is displayed in DC was a monument that black Americans designed and demanded, so removing it does seem like a slap in the face to all their efforts.
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