Is it irresponsible not to get the vaccine? (compare, state, claim)
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Yes, companies have the right and can remove non vaccinated people
Yes, it is irresponsible. Not only do you put your life in danger, you put the lives of everyone that you come into contact with in danger. Plus, you might end up taking a hospital bed away from vaccinated patients that have an emergency
Prove it. Prove that I haven't already had the virus and beat it. Prove that I would not get the virus if I'm vaccinated. Prove that I would infect someone if I don't get vaccinated. Prove that if infected, I will become hospitalized.
You can't prove any of that. So no, you have no right to require I get vaccinated.
You are correct in saying that a business can remove me if not vaccinated. But remember that, when a business denies service to someone for another reason.
I drive a car. Every day, I put my life in danger, and put the lives of everyone else on the road in danger. Should we ban cars?
Seriously, people. Grown adults have the RIGHT to weigh risks, and make their OWN decisions about how to live their lives. And spare me the "you're selfish and put other's lives in danger" garbage. Life is not without risks or danger. It's time we face that fact.
Of course it is irresponsible to not get the Covid vaccine. Only the truly deluded would reach the conclusion that they shouldn't.
For 99.9% of the population, getting the vaccine is the most important civic duty you will ever have in your lifetime. No matter what some wingnuts on an Internet forum might say to the contrary.
If you voted for the guys that support riots and burning businesses,
if you voted for the guys that are allowing hoards of infected illegals to stream into out country,
you have no right to demand that I get a vaccine, wear a mask, or that a business shut its doors.
That makes you a hypocrite, not a voice of reason.
Anyone who makes a political decision to not get vaccinated should just hang a sign around their neck that says, "I'm a Grandma killer." Major corporations need to get some backbone here and make vaccination a mandatory condition of employment.
I like Israel's system: when you get vaccinated, you get an ID card. If you want to eat inside at a restaurant, sit in a movie theater, or go to the gym, show your vaccination ID. If you haven't been vaccinated, too bad, you are refused admission.
We need to crack down on anti-vax scofflaws.
There's no proof that not getting vaccinated will "kill grandma". But there is proof that a lefty governor actually DID kill scores of grandmas, then covered it up. I've searched and searched, but can't seem to find where you demand he be charged with murder. Or does your outrage only extend to those who you agree with politically?
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but ... you didn't get a Tetanus shot. There hasn't been a Tetanus only vaccine available in the US for years. I know they probably didn't tell you this but you were given a Dtap; a 3 in 1 vaccine for Diphtheria, Tetanus & Pertussis.
I do believe you; this is why you have an autoimmune disease. So much for informed consent.
Thank you, I did actually notice you left out the Brazilian study. But I don't trust vaccine safety epidemiology, Suzy. It's always flawed; if it's not the methods it's the math. The confounders & criteria. But they go to peer review & as long as vaccines come out looking all sparkly clean, the studies pass with flying colors & it's WRONG. There's something wrong with the vaccines.
Many of the 500,000 + covid deaths last year were actually a vaccine injury. They blunted their CD4 T cell response & didn't stand a chance.
After my car crash, the nurse in ER said to me she was going to give me a Tetanus shot. I asked her which one? TD or Tdap? She looked very annoyed and said it's just a Tetanus shot. No, it isn't. No, I don't want it.
What happened to the liberal cry "my body, my choice"? One may say 'if you don't get vaccinated you may affect the life of another', may being the key word. But following through with the common act associated with that phrase, you will definitely affect the life of another and not in a positive way, so spare me the judgmental tripe if I make the decision of taking this vaccine my choice and not yours.
Location: In a city within a state where politicians come to get their PHDs in Corruption
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010
The thread is about vaccination. I did not discuss mitigation measures at all. You seem to not understand that vaccination means that those other things can gradually be relaxed.
It is a simple statement of fact. Low risk is not no risk. Lower risk people need to be vaccinated in order to control the epidemic.
You can keep the conspiracy theory.
VAERS is an early warning system. Anyone can report anything to it. One guy once made a report that a vaccine turned him into the Incredible Hulk. Many of the reports contain too little information to even be able to follow up on them. Much as you would like for them to be they are not proof of cause and effect. There is nothing to make anyone "fear it/avoid it." It just cannot do what you want it to do.
There is no evidence that any tetanus containing vaccine causes an autoimmune disease.
Of course you do not trust vaccine safety epidemiology. It does not fit the narrative you want to believe. Such manipulation as you envision would require massive worldwide collusion by vaccine researchers. You are ultimately left with nothing to support your case but a conspiracy theory.
In order to claim that you have to show that the people who died were more likely to have been vaccinated. In fact, the opposite is true. Those who have taken the flu vaccine are less likely to have severe disease. That has now been shown in multiple studies. One possible way it does that may be by training innate immunity. It is far more complex than a theoretical "blunted CD4 T cell response".
Sorry, but the experts researching this disease know far more about it than you do. None of them are discussing a "blunted CD4 T cell response" due to the flu vaccine. They are recommending that everyone take the flu vaccine.
Aha, I see. And who determines that, the need? You? The government? As I've said before, you people are projecting rights/demands onto someone else that you don't have. Everyone's for government involvement and mandates as long they're for.....you know....somebody else......who disagrees.....who's not for "greater good".
what happened to the liberal cry "my body, my choice"? One may say 'if you don't get vaccinated you may affect the life of another', may being the key word. But following through with the common act associated with that phrase, you will definitely affect the life of another and not in a positive way, so spare me the judgmental tripe if i make the decision of taking this vaccine my choice and not yours.
"I write to announce a major new NIH initiative to identify the causes and ultimately the means of prevention and treatment of individuals who have been sickened by COVID-19, but don’t recover fully over a period of a few weeks. Large numbers of patients who have been infected with SARS-CoV-2 continue to experience a constellation of symptoms long past the time that they’ve recovered from the initial stages of COVID-19 illness. Often referred to as “Long COVID”, these symptoms, which can include fatigue, shortness of breath, “brain fog”, sleep disorders, fevers, gastrointestinal symptoms, anxiety, and depression, can persist for months and can range from mild to incapacitating. In some cases, new symptoms arise well after the time of infection or evolve over time."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ligurian
Judy Mikovits is called discredited by wikiEDITpedia.
Without two sides to a story, the best you can do chase your tail.
Where did I mention Mikovits? She has been discredited, though.
With regards to medicine there are not two sides to the story. That is called false equivalence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tolovefromANFIELD
Aha, I see. And who determines that, the need? You? The government? As I've said before, you people are projecting rights/demands onto someone else that you don't have. Everyone's for government involvement and mandates as long they're for.....you know....somebody else......who disagrees.....who's not for "greater good".
Slippery slope.
The need is basic infection control. If you want the epidemic controlled, as many people as possible must be vaccinated. Otherwise the virus continues to circulate, it might take years for it to burn out, and a lot more people die. In addition, the more time passes the greater the opportunity for new variants to emerge which might escape the vaccines we have and the epidemic flares again.
"I write to announce a major new NIH initiative to identify the causes and ultimately the means of prevention and treatment of individuals who have been sickened by COVID-19, but don’t recover fully over a period of a few weeks. Large numbers of patients who have been infected with SARS-CoV-2 continue to experience a constellation of symptoms long past the time that they’ve recovered from the initial stages of COVID-19 illness. Often referred to as “Long COVID”, these symptoms, which can include fatigue, shortness of breath, “brain fog”, sleep disorders, fevers, gastrointestinal symptoms, anxiety, and depression, can persist for months and can range from mild to incapacitating. In some cases, new symptoms arise well after the time of infection or evolve over time."
Where did I mention Mikovits? She has been discredited, though.
With regards to medicine there are not two sides to the story. That is called false equivalence.
The need is basic infection control. If you want the epidemic controlled, as many people as possible must be vaccinated. Otherwise the virus continues to circulate, it might take years for it to burn out, and a lot more people die. In addition, the more time passes the greater the opportunity for new variants to emerge which might escape the vaccines we have and the epidemic flares again.
The fact that they are studying the possible long-term effects of COVID-19 does not in any way prove your assertion that "many" people are suffering such effects. You may recall that COVID came to us in late 2019 or early 2020. Not enough time has even passed to study the long term effects of COVID-19, if there even are any.
Once again, you are Chicken Little. Shrieking about the worst case scenario and proclaiming it as "scientific fact" when it is anything but, just like you've been doing for the past year.
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