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So I have a few things to say and unpack hope you take time read.
It all started today when management went around making a list of who and who not has had the vaccine. They say it is because they are probably going to lax regulations on masks and distance, my state Florida officially ended mandates a couple days ago. In my immediate department there are 10 people, 4 of us don't want to get the vaccine yet.
So I was having a very civil discussion with a co-worker about the vaccine and my fear that it could be forced on me officially or non-officially by harassment. He has taken the vaccine and he explained he wanted to on the side of caution and I explained why I don't want to yet because in my view a side of caution. It was a civil discussion with NO politics or political siding mentioned.
Another co-worker that works in a near by dept who is known to be hard leftist and hardcore democratic party happened to walk by and hear the conversation , I never talk to him about ANYTHING political because of the fact but he proceeded to inject himself in the conversation pretty much screaming at me.
He said basically screaming " oh you idiots that don't vaccinate we are all in this together it is for the good of the country we all should look out for each other you should be forced to get it otherwise not be allowed to go to work or anywhere". So he thinks if I don't comply I should be cast from society, be deemed a dreg of society and "cancelled".
Ok wow. I normally don't get into these type of heated debates except here on CD, in everyday life I try to avoid political people I know that are hard left or hard right because I know no good comes out of it. But yeah guess they are out there lol.
No use trying to explain my position to him but I WILL TO YOU.
I have searched the internet and every medical and government website cannot or will not verify that the vaccine stops transmission. At best they say " there is some evidence" or "we think so" or "too soon to confirm". They do say it will protect you from getting as sick as you could get, but that's it.
Show me verifiable and proven fact from multiple trusted sources that getting the vaccine will stop me from giving it to others and I will go get the vaccine, but until then it should be my choice whether I feel comfortable or not injecting myself with COVID 19 and that is what getting a vaccine is, introducing the virus into your body.
So given the fact that if passenger A who has the vaccine and passenger B who has not both get on a airplane and are both just as likely to contaminate the airplane what is the point of mandating it? Again PROVE the vaccine stops transmission and then it will be a different story.
For a year we have seen the CDC , the scientists , the doctors , the politicians claim one thing then later retract it or move the goal posts. THEY DON'T KNOW everything about it, they claim long term health effects, they claim 6 ft apart then later say distance doesn't matter, they say no masks help then later mandate masks everywhere then later again retract that masks are very effective. Follow the science? , they obviously don't know it all.
Vaccines and trials for them usually take years of experiment and approval, yet in less than a year one is made (and maybe a modern medical miracle) but given the rush, given the fact that what CDC and scientists keep changing rules, given that COVID is HIGHLY politicalized , I rather side on caution and wait to see more times pass before I get the vaccine.
SHOW ME trusted proof verified from several independent trustworthy sources that the vaccine is safe and has no long term effects AND WILL stop me from spreading it to others, I'll go get it, but right now I see a lot of "I don't know for sure" and it should be my choice without making me a cast from society cancelled person.
So in a nutshell you don't want folks telling you what to do ...me either... had someone say I shouldn't get the vaccine...yawn -- didn't rant rage and feel the need to show my superiority -- ignored them.
Your coworker could have been more courteous, but they have a good point in that people who are refusing to get vaccinated are going to make the pandemic drag on much longer than it otherwise would.
So I have a few things to say and unpack hope you take time read.
It all started today when management went around making a list of who and who not has had the vaccine. They say it is because they are probably going to lax regulations on masks and distance, my state Florida officially ended mandates a couple days ago. In my immediate department there are 10 people, 4 of us don't want to get the vaccine yet.
So I was having a very civil discussion with a co-worker about the vaccine and my fear that it could be forced on me officially or non-officially by harassment. He has taken the vaccine and he explained he wanted to on the side of caution and I explained why I don't want to yet because in my view a side of caution. It was a civil discussion with NO politics or political siding mentioned.
Another co-worker that works in a near by dept who is known to be hard leftist and hardcore democratic party happened to walk by and hear the conversation , I never talk to him about ANYTHING political because of the fact but he proceeded to inject himself in the conversation pretty much screaming at me.
He said basically screaming " oh you idiots that don't vaccinate we are all in this together it is for the good of the country we all should look out for each other you should be forced to get it otherwise not be allowed to go to work or anywhere". So he thinks if I don't comply I should be cast from society, be deemed a dreg of society and "cancelled".
Ok wow. I normally don't get into these type of heated debates except here on CD, in everyday life I try to avoid political people I know that are hard left or hard right because I know no good comes out of it. But yeah guess they are out there lol.
No use trying to explain my position to him but I WILL TO YOU.
I have searched the internet and every medical and government website cannot or will not verify that the vaccine stops transmission. At best they say " there is some evidence" or "we think so" or "too soon to confirm". They do say it will protect you from getting as sick as you could get, but that's it.
Show me verifiable and proven fact from multiple trusted sources that getting the vaccine will stop me from giving it to others and I will go get the vaccine, but until then it should be my choice whether I feel comfortable or not injecting myself with COVID 19 and that is what getting a vaccine is, introducing the virus into your body.
So given the fact that if passenger A who has the vaccine and passenger B who has not both get on a airplane and are both just as likely to contaminate the airplane what is the point of mandating it? Again PROVE the vaccine stops transmission and then it will be a different story.
For a year we have seen the CDC , the scientists , the doctors , the politicians claim one thing then later retract it or move the goal posts. THEY DON'T KNOW everything about it, they claim long term health effects, they claim 6 ft apart then later say distance doesn't matter, they say no masks help then later mandate masks everywhere then later again retract that masks are very effective. Follow the science? , they obviously don't know it all.
Vaccines and trials for them usually take years of experiment and approval, yet in less than a year one is made (and maybe a modern medical miracle) but given the rush, given the fact that what CDC and scientists keep changing rules, given that COVID is HIGHLY politicalized , I rather side on caution and wait to see more times pass before I get the vaccine.
SHOW ME trusted proof verified from several independent trustworthy sources that the vaccine is safe and has no long term effects AND WILL stop me from spreading it to others, I'll go get it, but right now I see a lot of "I don't know for sure" and it should be my choice without making me a cast from society cancelled person.
File a complaint with HR. Be sure to use two words in your complaint: hostile workplace.
If an employer wants to make vaccination a condition of employment, then that's their right. It's no different than requiring a drug test. If you don't like the policy then resign and find another job.
I also believe health insurance companies should start looking at increasing premiums for the unvaccinated. They have a higher risk profile for catching Covid, and if they should get hospitalized, it could result in expensive claims. Or, to be less punitive and more positive, they could offer discounts on premiums to the vaccinated instead.
“But you don’t have the right to endanger others,” counter the passport advocates. This statement deserves a response.
The primary endpoint of the Covid-19 vaccine trials, according to Dr. Anthony Fauci, was “to prevent clinically recognizable disease,” not infection or transmission. If vaccinated people can still spread the virus — as shown by reports of “breakthrough cases” in the fully vaccinated — then passports are rendered meaningless. Conversely, if the vaccines are eventually proven to provide immunity, as a CDC study suggests, recipients can feel confident they are protected regardless of others’ choices. No passports necessary.
There are some video interviews of former Pfizer VP Dr. Mike Yeadon, though often removed by youtube. Also Dr. Sucharit Bhakdi. You can find some.
I also believe health insurance companies should start looking at increasing premiums for the unvaccinated. They have a higher risk profile for catching Covid, and if they should get hospitalized, it could result in expensive claims. Or, to be less punitive and more positive, they could offer discounts on premiums to the vaccinated instead.
If an employer wants to make vaccination a condition of employment, then that's their right. It's no different than requiring a drug test. If you don't like the policy then resign and find another job.
I also believe health insurance companies should start looking at increasing premiums for the unvaccinated. They have a higher risk profile for catching Covid, and if they should get hospitalized, it could result in expensive claims. Or, to be less punitive and more positive, they could offer discounts on premiums to the vaccinated instead.
Well, it being "their right" is still not settled regarding the current Covid vaccine. We will see when it gets through the courts. They key issue is the EUA.
It is much different than a drug test, a drug test is not injecting you with anything.
So I have a few things to say and unpack hope you take time read.
It all started today when management went around making a list of who and who not has had the vaccine. They say it is because they are probably going to lax regulations on masks and distance, my state Florida officially ended mandates a couple days ago. In my immediate department there are 10 people, 4 of us don't want to get the vaccine yet.
So I was having a very civil discussion with a co-worker about the vaccine and my fear that it could be forced on me officially or non-officially by harassment. He has taken the vaccine and he explained he wanted to on the side of caution and I explained why I don't want to yet because in my view a side of caution. It was a civil discussion with NO politics or political siding mentioned.
Another co-worker that works in a near by dept who is known to be hard leftist and hardcore democratic party happened to walk by and hear the conversation , I never talk to him about ANYTHING political because of the fact but he proceeded to inject himself in the conversation pretty much screaming at me.
He said basically screaming " oh you idiots that don't vaccinate we are all in this together it is for the good of the country we all should look out for each other you should be forced to get it otherwise not be allowed to go to work or anywhere". So he thinks if I don't comply I should be cast from society, be deemed a dreg of society and "cancelled".
Ok wow. I normally don't get into these type of heated debates except here on CD, in everyday life I try to avoid political people I know that are hard left or hard right because I know no good comes out of it. But yeah guess they are out there lol.
No use trying to explain my position to him but I WILL TO YOU.
I have searched the internet and every medical and government website cannot or will not verify that the vaccine stops transmission. At best they say " there is some evidence" or "we think so" or "too soon to confirm". They do say it will protect you from getting as sick as you could get, but that's it.
Show me verifiable and proven fact from multiple trusted sources that getting the vaccine will stop me from giving it to others and I will go get the vaccine, but until then it should be my choice whether I feel comfortable or not injecting myself with COVID 19 and that is what getting a vaccine is, introducing the virus into your body.
So given the fact that if passenger A who has the vaccine and passenger B who has not both get on a airplane and are both just as likely to contaminate the airplane what is the point of mandating it? Again PROVE the vaccine stops transmission and then it will be a different story.
For a year we have seen the CDC , the scientists , the doctors , the politicians claim one thing then later retract it or move the goal posts. THEY DON'T KNOW everything about it, they claim long term health effects, they claim 6 ft apart then later say distance doesn't matter, they say no masks help then later mandate masks everywhere then later again retract that masks are very effective. Follow the science? , they obviously don't know it all.
Vaccines and trials for them usually take years of experiment and approval, yet in less than a year one is made (and maybe a modern medical miracle) but given the rush, given the fact that what CDC and scientists keep changing rules, given that COVID is HIGHLY politicalized , I rather side on caution and wait to see more times pass before I get the vaccine.
SHOW ME trusted proof verified from several independent trustworthy sources that the vaccine is safe and has no long term effects AND WILL stop me from spreading it to others, I'll go get it, but right now I see a lot of "I don't know for sure" and it should be my choice without making me a cast from society cancelled person.
The coworker who lit into you was rude. Sorry you had to experience that.
There is now clear evidence that the vaccines greatly reduce asymptomatic infection. If you are not infected you cannot transmit the virus.
The biggest study is from Israel, which is using the Pfizer vaccine. The data come from their HMOs, and they have excellent electronic records that cover most everybody in the country.
"Findings from the analysis were derived from de-identified aggregate Israel MoH [Ministry of Health] surveillance data collected between January 17 and March 6, 2021, when the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine was the only vaccine available in the country and when the more transmissible B.1.1.7 variant of SARS-CoV-2 (formerly referred to as the U.K. variant) was the dominant strain. Vaccine effectiveness was at least 97% against symptomatic COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations, severe and critical hospitalizations, and deaths. Furthermore, the analysis found a vaccine effectiveness of 94% against asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infections. For all outcomes, vaccine effectiveness was measured from two weeks after the second dose."
This one was done in health care workers in the UK
It shows that a single dose of the Pfizer vaccine can reduce asymptomatic infections by 75 percent in an analysis of around 4,400 tests conducted on vaccinated health care workers in Cambridge over a two-week period in January.
"Prospective cohorts of 3,950 health care personnel, first responders, and other essential and frontline workers completed weekly SARS-CoV-2 testing for 13 consecutive weeks. Under real-world conditions, mRNA vaccine effectiveness of full immunization (≥14 days after second dose) was 90% against SARS-CoV-2 infections regardless of symptom status; vaccine effectiveness of partial immunization (≥14 days after first dose but before second dose) was 80%."
Of course no vaccine is ever going to be 100% effective and completely free of adverse reactions so if you are looking for that it will never happen.
However, you can look at what is happening in Israel to see what an mRNA vaccine can do. They are down to a seven day average of 69 cases with 1 death for a population of about 8.8 million.
The vaccines do not contain any coronavirus. The mRNA vaccines contain the directions for the vaccinated person's cells to make the viral spike protein. The J&J vaccine uses an altered adenovirus containing DNA from which the vaccinated person's cell can make mRNA to make the spike protein. None of the vaccines result in generation of entire viral particles.
The vaccines have been through all of the necessary testing. The timeline was compressed by doing some studies side by side rather than sequentially, large amounts of money enabled large phase 3 trials, and FDA red tape was cut. In addition we now have the real world experience of millions of vaccinated people.
The "rules" changed as new evidence came in. It was always going to happen.
So I have a few things to say and unpack hope you take time read.
It all started today when management went around making a list of who and who not has had the vaccine. They say it is because they are probably going to lax regulations on masks and distance, my state Florida officially ended mandates a couple days ago. In my immediate department there are 10 people, 4 of us don't want to get the vaccine yet.
So I was having a very civil discussion with a co-worker about the vaccine and my fear that it could be forced on me officially or non-officially by harassment. He has taken the vaccine and he explained he wanted to on the side of caution and I explained why I don't want to yet because in my view a side of caution. It was a civil discussion with NO politics or political siding mentioned.
Another co-worker that works in a near by dept who is known to be hard leftist and hardcore democratic party happened to walk by and hear the conversation , I never talk to him about ANYTHING political because of the fact but he proceeded to inject himself in the conversation pretty much screaming at me.
He said basically screaming " oh you idiots that don't vaccinate we are all in this together it is for the good of the country we all should look out for each other you should be forced to get it otherwise not be allowed to go to work or anywhere". So he thinks if I don't comply I should be cast from society, be deemed a dreg of society and "cancelled".
Ok wow. I normally don't get into these type of heated debates except here on CD, in everyday life I try to avoid political people I know that are hard left or hard right because I know no good comes out of it. But yeah guess they are out there lol.
No use trying to explain my position to him but I WILL TO YOU.
I have searched the internet and every medical and government website cannot or will not verify that the vaccine stops transmission. At best they say " there is some evidence" or "we think so" or "too soon to confirm". They do say it will protect you from getting as sick as you could get, but that's it.
Show me verifiable and proven fact from multiple trusted sources that getting the vaccine will stop me from giving it to others and I will go get the vaccine, but until then it should be my choice whether I feel comfortable or not injecting myself with COVID 19 and that is what getting a vaccine is, introducing the virus into your body.
So given the fact that if passenger A who has the vaccine and passenger B who has not both get on a airplane and are both just as likely to contaminate the airplane what is the point of mandating it? Again PROVE the vaccine stops transmission and then it will be a different story.
For a year we have seen the CDC , the scientists , the doctors , the politicians claim one thing then later retract it or move the goal posts. THEY DON'T KNOW everything about it, they claim long term health effects, they claim 6 ft apart then later say distance doesn't matter, they say no masks help then later mandate masks everywhere then later again retract that masks are very effective. Follow the science? , they obviously don't know it all.
Vaccines and trials for them usually take years of experiment and approval, yet in less than a year one is made (and maybe a modern medical miracle) but given the rush, given the fact that what CDC and scientists keep changing rules, given that COVID is HIGHLY politicalized , I rather side on caution and wait to see more times pass before I get the vaccine.
SHOW ME trusted proof verified from several independent trustworthy sources that the vaccine is safe and has no long term effects AND WILL stop me from spreading it to others, I'll go get it, but right now I see a lot of "I don't know for sure" and it should be my choice without making me a cast from society cancelled person.
" Co-worker told me" well whoop-de-do!
Do you do EVERYTHING every co-worker tells you to do?
As they say, "Are you a MAN or a mouse?"
Can't you think for yourself?
God help us if you VOTE!
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