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The girls thing was done intentionally to destroy the Boy Scouts organization.
Can't allow young men to be taught the virtues of self-reliance, independence, and being strong & tough.
Those are right-wing values and right-wing values are "bad".
What are you talking about?
Self-reliance is a a RW value? Since when?
U.S. farmers were lining up at the government trough the minute China switched to Russia for soybeans. Corn farmers have been lapping up government subsidies for years. Read recently, the 40% of farm income now is in the form of government subsidies.
Last I read, farm country votes huge RW.
As for being strong, and tough, guess that's one way to look at RW behavior.
Frankly, I had no idea that Boys Scouts was a RW organization. Guess the child abuse should have been a clue, eh?
Although the sex abuse is HORRIBLE -- of course! -- I think where the BOY Scouts as an organization started digging their own grave was when they began to allow girls to join (as if Girl Scouts was not good enough for girls). And, btw, many of the Boy Scout principles were not in alignment with liberal values, such as being self-reliant and having a decided Judeo-Christian bent, (as their motto includes the words "To do my duty, to God").
I am now wondering if there are any non-religious youth groups, if that, that are separated according to male/female?
It truly seems to me as though "someone" is trying very hard to promote the idea that male and female are really the same thing.
So in terms of the girl thing, the United States has one of the very (if not only?) Scouting organizations that has separate Boy and Girl Scouts. I really see nothing wrong with the inclusion of girls, especially since there must be separation in the units, particularly for overnight arrangements. I'm a proud Eagle Scout and welcome them with open arms.
The biggest excuse I heard for allowing girls into the boy scout program was the opportunity to earn the rank of Eagle Scout which the girl scouting program did not offer. So why not improve the girl scouting program to make it better and include an equal rank for the girls?
You can't deny that having pretty young girls hanging around young and curious boys isn't a huge distraction among other things...and yet they're worried about sexual abuse??
So in terms of the girl thing, the United States has one of the very (if not only?) Scouting organizations that has separate Boy and Girl Scouts. I really see nothing wrong with the inclusion of girls, especially since there must be separation in the units, particularly for overnight arrangements. I'm a proud Eagle Scout and welcome them with open arms.
This was one of the things I disagreed with the BSA on. While I'm all about inclusion generally, I feel that there is something very real about male bonding and relationship building (and the same goes for female bonding and relationship building). As others have written, my preference would have been for the Girl Scouts to up their game instead of women hijacking the Boy Scouts.
Last edited by prospectheightsresident; 05-24-2021 at 08:16 PM..
I don't think they are saying male and female is the same thing. I think they are saying females can do everything that males can do, and can work with and compete with males on an equal footing. This is where society is now. To be relevant the scouts had to embrace it. I go back to when McSorley's bar in the Village in NYC first admitted women in 1970. The bathroom was unisex until 1986 when they built the first ladies' bathroom. Times have changed.
I was a boy scout. I liked the uniform and sense of belonging. I only made it to second class scout. On one camp out our patrol leader ruined our dinner and all our food trying to make french toast in a number 10 can on a campfire. I went over to one of the more savvy kids who had packed some canned food in his knapsack and he shared his heated canned pork and beans with me.
In the 8th grade boys and girls were in separate classrooms in different wings of my school. In 9th grade I was in an all boys high school. Starting in 10th grade I was in a coed high school. Regarding male bonding, I think male-female bonding was actually more important.
Quote:
Originally Posted by katharsis
Although the sex abuse is HORRIBLE -- of course! -- I think where the BOY Scouts as an organization started digging their own grave was when they began to allow girls to join (as if Girl Scouts was not good enough for girls). And, btw, many of the Boy Scout principles were not in alignment with liberal values, such as being self-reliant and having a decided Judeo-Christian bent, (as their motto includes the words "To do my duty, to God").
I am now wondering if there are any non-religious youth groups, if that, that are separated according to male/female?
It truly seems to me as though "someone" is trying very hard to promote the idea that male and female are really the same thing.
The biggest excuse I heard for allowing girls into the boy scout program was the opportunity to earn the rank of Eagle Scout which the girl scouting program did not offer. So why not improve the girl scouting program to make it better and include an equal rank for the girls?
They do, it's called the gold award. But it doesn't have nearly the recognition or prestige that Eagle Scout does. Though by some accounts (including my own observations) the Eagle award shouldn't hold the prestige it used to given what passes for a project and how they're doing the requirements nowadays.
Quote:
You can't deny that having pretty young girls hanging around young and curious boys isn't a huge distraction among other things...and yet they're worried about sexual abuse??
Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident
This was one of the things I disagreed with the BSA on. While I'm all about inclusion generally, I feel that there is something very real about male bonding and relationship building (and the same goes for female bonding and relationship building). As others have written, my preference would have been for the Girl Scouts to up their game instead of women hijacking the Boy Scouts.
(responding to both the above quoted posts) For one, a lot of the activities are separate. A single troop can't be co-ed. Even if a sponsoring organization wants to have both, they still have to have separate charters and a certain degree of separate leadership. But there's nothing stopping them from doing joint activities, in fact there's nothing stopping Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts from doing joint activities. My troop did that back in 2004 or so, we had a campout with a Girl Scout troop. Very separated campsites, but everything else was done jointly. Co-ed activities and camps are nothing new. Outside Scouts, a lot of youth summer camps, including many church camps, are co-ed with the same separations as the Scouts (i.e. sleeping sites, bathrooms, showers, etc.). Let's also not forget that the Boy Scouts had a co-ed program, the Venturing program who did a lot of the same thing, and in fact, there were a few things that Venturers did that normal Boy Scouts could not. As for the bonding experience, I don't inherently disagree, but again, there's nothing that says they all have to be right next to each other at all times except sleeping, showering and bathrooms. Since they're separate troops, no reason the male troop can't go do their thing and the girl troop can't do their own thing.
A few years ago, my husband and I became involved with Boys Scouts/Friends of Scouting. My husband is a certified range instructor, so he was interested in teaching gun safety to the boys. He was the COR of a venturing crew, and taught shotgun/rifle for merit badges. I volunteered to help out with the financial side. After a year, we quit because the experience was a complete disaster. It's supposed to be about the children, but all they cared about was making money. The adults didn't seem to want our help. We were very disappointed.
Yup -- years of not adapting to the changing times, and some other serious problems. They have been on the edge for some time.
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