House Votes to Purge ALL Confederate Statues From the Capitol (Senate, Baltimore)
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If Lee was executed, we would have had decades of guerilla warfare.
Fortunately, enough of the Northerners of that time were wiser than the intolerant people of our time.
The way I see it, letting said Confederate leaders get off easy is the equivalent of coddling. And after that coddling, the United Daughters of the Confederacy went around claiming that slavery had nothing to do with the war. They also claimed that slavery was a "positive good" for Black people. And then they went on to refer to the North as a villain.
Maybe I am intolerant. This is what I understand. I can't be tolerant. The Confederates were fighting to make sure that the enslavement of Black people remained a permanent fixture of their society. This was stuff that was stated back then. I can't be tolerant of anyone who would fight to make sure I stayed enslaved. And those who would start a guerrilla war, you could say they wouldn't be tolerant either. There was no tolerance afforded to Black people during the years following the Civil War. Why would I want to have tolerance towards those who would have fought to make sure someone like me would remained enslaved?
and since he didn't get either of those sentences, which you have determined 150 years later to be just ... what then?
I won't claim to understand (yet) what happened at the end of the Civil War. Surely, there's some differences in the war behavior of both Confederate and Union generals. It seems perhaps we should all study that.
Was the mercy and or justice of 1865 "good" or "bad"?
My point is that Lee got lucky. The US government wanted to exercise some goodwill. I think there should have been more justice than that. I consider what happened to be coddling.
The way I see it, letting said Confederate leaders get off easy is the equivalent of coddling. And after that coddling, the United Daughters of the Confederacy went around claiming that slavery had nothing to do with the war. They also claimed that slavery was a "positive good" for Black people. And then they went on to refer to the North as a villain.
Maybe I am intolerant. This is what I understand. I can't be tolerant. The Confederates were fighting to make sure that the enslavement of Black people remained a permanent fixture of their society. This was stuff that was stated back then. I can't be tolerant of anyone who would fight to make sure I stayed enslaved. And those who would start a guerrilla war, you could say they wouldn't be tolerant either. There was no tolerance afforded to Black people during the years following the Civil War. Why would I want to have tolerance towards those who would have fought to make sure someone like me would remained enslaved?
What happened to Black rights after the civil war was because most white people in north and south didn't care. In the south, it was about power. In some of those states Blacks were the majority and the minority wanted to keep power so they disenfranchised the Black population.
My point is that Lee got lucky. The US government wanted to exercise some goodwill. I think there should have been more justice than that. I consider what happened to be coddling.
We were tolerant of all but the leaders and mass murderers in Germany and Japan and they became our allies. We disenfranchised and fired the Baathists in Iraq and there is still war there.
What we did after the Civil War and after WWII in Germany and Japan was the best policy.
What happened to Black rights after the civil war was because most white people in north and south didn't care. In the south, it was about power. In some of those states Blacks were the majority and the minority wanted to keep power so they disenfranchised the Black population.
I never said there weren't any problems up north. You mentioned that people today were intolerant. I know that in the South it was about power. It was about the re-establishment of the slavery-based social hierarchy of the antebellum era. The thought of Black people being in charge of anything scared many people. They wanted Blacks to "know their place" and "stay in their place". just like it had been during slavery.
What I am saying is this. I have a reason for being intolerant towards Confederate leaders. It has to do with fighting to making sure Blacks stayed enslaved.
We were tolerant of all but the leaders and mass murderers in Germany and Japan and they became our allies. We disenfranchised and fired the Baathists in Iraq and there is still war there.
What we did after the Civil War and after WWII in Germany and Japan was the best policy.
And those Confederates went on to promote the Lost Cause.
Today in Germany, there are no statues of Nazis. We still have statues of Confederate generals. That forgiveness should have come with some conditions. I could never be tolerant of the Confederate leaders. I have to think about what they were fighting for. They were fighting to make sure Blacks stayed enslaved. Being a Black man, and being descended from slaves, being tolerant of Confederate leaders is something I don't have in me.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner
I never said there weren't any problems up north. You mentioned that people today were intolerant. I know that in the South it was about power. It was about the re-establishment of the slavery-based social hierarchy of the antebellum era. The thought of Black people being in charge of anything scared many people. They wanted Blacks to "know their place" and "stay in their place". just like it had been during slavery.
What I am saying is this. I have a reason for being intolerant towards Confederate leaders. It has to do with fighting to making sure Blacks stayed enslaved.
Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner
The thought of Black people being in charge of anything scared many people. They wanted Blacks to "know their place" and "stay in their place".
"Not everyone battled for equal rights within white society—some chose a separatist approach.
Convinced by Jim Crow laws that Black and white people could not live peaceably together, formerly enslaved Isaiah Montgomery created the African American-only town of Mound Bayou, Mississippi, in 1887.
Montgomery recruited other former enslaved people to settle in the wilderness with him, clearing the land and forging a settlement that included several schools, an Andrew Carnegie-funded library, a hospital, three cotton gins, a bank and a sawmill. Mound Bayou still exists today, and is still almost 100 percent Black."
The sentiment is the same for some on both sides of this isle --- the communities needs were equal funding and opportunities from the States and the Federal government to help meet their needs --- what they got, was desegregation. Like that would solve it. I guess you could say that is one time the government didn't throw money at a problem.
Where else in the world does a country keep statues of their defeated enemy?
You never heard of Pompey and the statues to HIM?
He was defeated by Caesar.
Ditto, for Mark Antony and Cleopatra.
They were defeated by Caesar Augustus.
. . . .
If you consider the Confederacy and its people "defeated enemies" why on earth would you admit them back as members of the UNION? Or allow them to regain their status as citizens?
Why not march them into concentration camps? Confiscate their property? Keep them in chains, by golly!
(Sigh)
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