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We had not lost lives because one of the terms of the Trump surrender at Doha is that the Taliban would not shoot at us if we left by May 31. They kept their word. They went along with an extension to Aug 31 which they also honored (ISIS, not the Taliban did the terror attack). Had we decided to toss the surrender and stay there, they would have attacked us and the casualties would have quickly added up.
As for the Embassy, we will have to see if the Taliban is a government we want to have diplomatic relationships with. The remaining Americans had 18 months since the surrender was signed to leave if they wanted to. One can only conclude they wished to stay or were extremely naive/stupid. Either way, they get no sympathy from me. The Taliban has said they will allow foreign citizens to leave even now.
Amazing how you dems keep blaming Trump. There was mounting evidence the Taliban were NOT abiding by the peace agreement. It’s almost assured Trump would have backed out, and it certainly gave Biden reasons to back out. Biden and the democrats own this debacle completely. They own the blood of dead Americans, dead Afghans, and the blood of those to come as a result of this pullout. You can twist and spin it any way you like but that does not change the facts. Biden and the democrats are in charge, and all the deaths and rapes related to this are on them.
I'm fine with placing the blame where it belongs. I don't know that a majority of people are blaming Trump, but there are plenty of sheep who give him a free pass.
Let's remember he released the 5,000 Taliban and also called them tough and smart. His hand is involved in this and to play "well Trump would have...." blah blah blah. It's easy to make up a story when reality is pretty crappy.
At the end of the day this is a failure on all levels, however it is a failure that was inevitable regardless of who is in the Oval Office. If these terrorists are anything, they are patient.
It's bad enough that Biden pulled all the troops leaving Americans behind enemy lines, but did we have to shutter the embassy too? Perhaps the embassy could have helped these stranded citizens, and now they have absolutely nothing. How can Biden claim we will still work to bring Americans home after pulling out any source of aid they might have?
(We could have kept heavy armed presence at the embassy.)
2001- US invaded Afghanistan to crush the Taliban.
2016- Trump campaigns on the complete withdrawal of troops from Afghanistan.
2019- ( maybe earlier) Trump Admin negotiates full withdrawal of all troops
2/29/2020- Pompeo and Taliban leader execute agreement for US to withdraw all troops by 5/1/2021 and to facilitate the freedom of 5000 Taliban fighters from Afghan prisons.
12/31/2020- all but 2500 troops withdrawn and 5000 Taliban fighters released from Afghan prisons.
5/1/2021- Deadline for complete withdrawal extended. . The Afghan Government collapses and puppet president and parliament departed in the dead of night. The Taliban is now in control of the country and the US is not welcome.
Mid August, 2021- Pompeo hits the Sunday news shows and advocates for putting troops back in and crushing the Taliban as if he is reading the 2001 script.
8/26/2021- ISIS ( not Taliban) claims responsibility for bombs that killed 13 US military.
The US has issued warnings against travel to Afghanistan for years due to security and terrorism.
All US visitors are requested to register their arrival, plans and departure with the US embassy. Many don’t which is why the US has never known how many US people were in country.
All of the above was public information. Who are these people who ignored travel warnings and stayed? What was their purpose? Contractors? Tourists? Visiting family? Drug traffickers? Media? Missionaries?
As an aside, similar thing happened during the last days in Vietnam. Unlike Vietnam, Afghanistan is landlocked. The Navy had a fleet staged in Saigon to takes as many Americans and Vietnamese as possible. It also chartered commercial planes for evacuation like what happened in Kabul. Nonetheless, American were left behind. Some by choice.
I'm fine with placing the blame where it belongs. I don't know that a majority of people are blaming Trump, but there are plenty of sheep who give him a free pass.
Let's remember he released the 5,000 Taliban and also called them tough and smart. His hand is involved in this and to play "well Trump would have...." blah blah blah. It's easy to make up a story when reality is pretty crappy.
At the end of the day this is a failure on all levels, however it is a failure that was inevitable regardless of who is in the Oval Office. If these terrorists are anything, they are patient.
Look across the mainstream media. Tons of articles from left leaning sources blaming all of this on Trump. I’m not defending Trump. I voted for him only the second time and that was because Biden was, imho, the greater of two evils. I don’t agree with him releasing Taliban. None of that has anything to do with what Biden has done and continues to do.
The failure is with Biden and his administration only. Biden is in charge. By many accounts he had people telling him don’t do this. As much as I didn’t support him, Obama even knew this was a bad idea.
Hey, the future will reveal all. Maybe Biden will be looked as as a hero decades from now. I seriously doubt it but if I’m still alive I will admit it. I’m not above admitting when people I vote for or support make mistakes. It seems many people are, and that’s a big problem in the US today.
Last edited by bertwrench; 08-31-2021 at 10:09 AM..
It's bad enough that Biden pulled all the troops leaving Americans behind enemy lines, but did we have to shutter the embassy too? Perhaps the embassy could have helped these stranded citizens, and now they have absolutely nothing. How can Biden claim we will still work to bring Americans home after pulling out any source of aid they might have?
(We could have kept heavy armed presence at the embassy.)
Those who have watched the Pentagon understand that the Troop Levels were the deciding factor in the cases of the US Embassy in Kabul AND the closure of Bagram Air Base. There were 2,500 Troops in Afghanistan when Biden took office. They were able to keep both the Embassy & the Base stable.
Biden wanted a Maximum of 600 Troops, and that was his Red Line with the Military. The Pentagon could not protect both the Embassy AND Bagram with a force of 600. In fact all of that 600 would be needed to keep the Embassy going, so they had no choice except to Secretly Bug-Out at Midnight on July 2nd … with ZERO ogives to the Afghan Government or our NATO Alliance. Only 600 US Troops remained.
Abandoning Bagram was the tipping point. The Afghan Government & Army believed they were bring abandoned along with the Air Base and the Taliban quickly took control. They seized the Military equipment AND they opened the Prisons and erased all the ISIS & Al Qaeda Prisoners.
In short order, the Embassy had to be abandoned and Kabul had to be held …. Biden ordered 6,000 Troops to Afghanistan. I assume everyone is aware that we did not have a US Ambassador to Afghanistan - it was Chaos.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight
I saw that the original plan was to keep an embassy open with a few hundred people, I don't see that working now with no Afghan military. Most of our embassies rely on local governments for protection in this case that would have been the Taliban.
We have no Troops there to protect an Embassy and we won’t have any.
This entire butbutbutbut….. Trump!!! Talking Point might work with the American people and the World except for one thing that everyone is aware of.
On January 20, 2021 Joe Biden signed 17 Executive Orders reversing or erasing Trump Policies.
He stopped the Border Wall and opened our Southern Border
He stopped the Keystone Pipeline and Oil Leases on Federal Land … just to name the top 2.
Biden had zero problems reversing Trump and now pretends that he was forced to adhere to Trumps incompleted Afghanistan withdrawal which was predicated on Conditions on the Ground AND a Withdrawal before the Fighting Season, which began in June.
So Biden was warned that the Taliban would (or likely could) capture the country within a day, meaning he knew that we couldn't maintain an embassy for the Americans left behind, and still went ahead? This whole thing is a disaster.
You realize the Doha Agreement - negotiated by the Trump Administration - was an agreement between the US and the Taliban, right? Everyone knew the Taliban would end up in charge of Afghanistan. We (the USA) just hoped the ANA would put up at least a little bit of a fight.
...This entire butbutbutbut….. Trump!!! Talking Point might work with the American people and the World except for one thing that everyone is aware of.
On January 20, 2021 Joe Biden signed 17 Executive Orders reversing or erasing Trump Policies.
He stopped the Border Wall and opened our Southern Border
He stopped the Keystone Pipeline and Oil Leases on Federal Land … just to name the top 2.
Biden had zero problems reversing Trump and now pretends that he was forced to adhere to Trumps incompleted Afghanistan withdrawal which was predicated on Conditions on the Ground AND a Withdrawal before the Fighting Season, which began in June.
Executive Orders and a negotiated "peace" deal with an enemy military force are not even in the same ballpark. They're not even the same sport.
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