If you are vaxxed and I am not, please explain why that's a risk to you. (ethical, 9/11)

[Jandrew5]

Originally Posted by snowmountains

Was I not calm?

See the color fonts.They are your words, my coloring. Hope you knew what you were saying.

Reading is fundamental. As you can see, I still did not say vaccinated people cant pass the virus. You are warping my sentence. The OP asked..."if you are vaxxed and I'm not vaxed, how am I a threat?" I was clearly answering their specific question focused on unvaccinated people.

[swagger]

Originally Posted by lchoro

If you're still asking questions like that, you have to question your mental ability to make decisions. This is now over a year and a half into the pandemic. So somebody has decided to make the decision for you.

The analogy is one of a household where some children throw tantrums and refuse to take responsibility. Eventually, the law gets laid down.

This is the most dangerous thinking I've seen in this thread so far.

I seriously hope that you never, ever hold any position of governmental power. Thinking as you do, you have no business whatsoever being a part of making decisions at that level.

[snowmountains]

Originally Posted by Jandrew5

Reading is fundamental.

Read your own words as an exercise, then.

[CorporateCowboy]

Originally Posted by ChrisC

It isn't. The problem they have is that it ticks them off to see anyone making a choice different from their own.

I have a smallpox vaccine. I'm protected from that disease with XXX probability. I couldn't care less whether my neighbor or friend has a smallpox vaccine. That is their choice to make.

Vaccination helped to eradicate smallpox. What's stupid is dying from a virus (such as conservative radio talk-show hosts Phil Valentine, Marc Bernier, and Dick Farrel) when we have the ability to prevent death/serious illness from the virus and reduce its transmission, as a whole.

Originally Posted by Grlzrl

If you are vaxxed and I am not, please explain how that's a threat to you.

It's not a direct threat to me; it's a threat to our health care system and economy. Some states have areas in which hospitals are bulging at the seams with covid patients in the ER and ICU. Do you think you will receive the best (or even adequate) health care if you suffered some sort of medical emergency at this time?

[fishbrains]

Originally Posted by swagger

You missed (or avoided) the point.

Were you shaming people into getting flu shots two years ago?

I did not miss the point. You simply ignored my response. Two years ago I was doing for the flu what I am doing now for covid. When the topic came up, I provided accurate scientific information, stated that the science was clear and that any action other than getting the shot was not rational, and having an interactive discussion if the person was interested. If you consider that shaming, then the answer is yes, if you do not consider that shaming, the answer is no. Regardless, I have been consistent.

Covid is more transmissible by design, sure, and it's a little bit worse than the flu, generally.

"Design" is an unfounded, unsupported allegation. If by "a little bit worse" you mean that >500,000 deaths is "a little bit worse" than the typical 30,000 deaths, I guess you are correct, but I typically consider things that are about 15x as deadly to be a lot worse.

But shaming people into getting a shot? Do you understand the seriousness of that? Would you shame a woman into having sex - accepting something into her body that she doesn't want or need?

This is completely absurd.

The differences between the flu and covid, practically speaking, aren't terribly significant. What's getting us is the newness of it, but it's becoming less and less new over time, and the strain it's putting on our systems is way down from where it was a year ago and will continue to fall until this is just another flu. The emergency is over.

Well, newness, high transmissibility rates, long term impacts, and death rates. Other than those things, sure, it is just a flu. Kind of link how bubonic plague is just like a mosquito bite.

Why do you feel it's your place to make medical demands of total strangers today, when you weren't doing it two years ago? What changed in your mind to lead you to the conclusion that it was immoral then, but not immoral now?

Have I made medical demands? I didn't see that in my posts.

I have advocated and given reasons why people aught to be vaccinated. I think it is irresponsible for people not to get vaccinated. I think it is ok for unvaccinated people to suffer the consequences of their decisions. But I have not demanded.

Originally Posted by Oldhag1

How many times do people have to give you links to RECENT research? The above is no longer true; what you keep repeating over and over was all pre-Delta. Starting with:

Not 95%, but 42%, at most.

I did acknowledge that the initial vaccines are less effective. This is moving so quickly that any reports are preliminary, and citing an exact percentage efficacy is premature. I will point out that you have not provided links either, but mere quotes from an unknown source.

Originally Posted by snowmountains

Unbeknowst to you, semantics is part of logic.

Unlike ad hominem attacks taught in your handbook.

Have I made an ad hominem attack? Please show me so that I can edit my post or apologize. If you cannot show me, I would appreciate it if you would retract your implication.

As for semantics being part of logic, that is true to the point that in a logical argument you want to clearly state your premises so that there is no confusion. That is very different than stating the CDC cannot be trusted because they used slightly different language than NASA did. You are drawing a false equivalence, and citing NASA as an authority on what language can be used when referring to science, which is a fallacious argument to authority.

[fishbrains]

Originally Posted by Jandrew5

It is semantics, you are focused on my wording. I'm not sure why youre coming at me, we're both in agreement.

I may have confused posts and posters.

[gmagoo]

Originally Posted by swagger

This is the most dangerous thinking I've seen in this thread so far.

I seriously hope that you never, ever hold any position of governmental power. Thinking as you do, you have no business whatsoever being a part of making decisions at that level.

Protecting U.S. citizens is the president`s job. He tried the carrot, time for the stick.

[swagger]

Originally Posted by vicky3vicky

The economy will get much better if almost everyone is vaccinated. The drain on the economy is ridiculous because a $5 shot is less deletrious to the nation than wasting hundreds of thousands of dollars on on one person who could have gotten the $5 jab. As others have mentioned, good people are dying waiting for an ICU bed to open up.

Also, when [if] the nation gets vaccinated, when people who are sick or dying in the hospital, their family will be able to be with them as it was before covid.

Get your shot, and you can be with your family member in their final moments. Isn't that nice of the government to allow you to do that? That's really nice of them. I wonder what other normal parts of life we'll have to give up so they can give them back to us, if we're allowed.

Propaganda works.

[STL74]

For me it’s not so much the non vaxxers as it is the non vaxxers who also refuse to take any precautions.

And I know it’s hard for some of you to understand, but it’s not all me, me, me. I’m not worried about me. I’m vaxxed, low risk, and a responsible adult. There is a societal effect you your behavior. From the spread of the virus that would be minimized by higher vax numbers and more responsible behavior…to the impact on our hospitals and healthcare workers that would be greatly minimized by higher vax numbers and more responsible behavior…to the effect on our schools and kids that could be minimized by higher vax numbers and a better sense of personal responsibility.

For people who claim to be patriots, the non vaxxer, anti precautions conservatives really show how little they care about American society and American citizens in favor of me, me,me.

[Corrie22]

Originally Posted by Grlzrl

If you are vaxxed and I am not, please explain how that's a threat to you.

short answer....

They know the vaccines aren't working