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Old 11-05-2021, 07:18 AM
 
15,302 posts, read 7,334,822 times
Reputation: 19223

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Quote:
Originally Posted by james112 View Post
My voting method doesn't trust anyone. Go back to dropping a ballot into a box and video record everything- each voter dropping a ballot into the box (and the camera can see it's one ballot), the counting of each ballot one by one. Mail in ballots must be sent to the precinct of that voter, the location where voting will take place.

This should be done at each precinct and NOT at a central voting center. As each ballot is taken out of the box one at a time, on video, the poll worker holds it up so the camera records the vote. Then the poll worker presses +1 for that candidate. Large screens show the real time count. All precinct videos posted online for all to watch. mail in ballots are dropped in by a poll worker after confirming the sig/photo/etc of the voter.

No computers. Just an adding machine with a large display. The final tally is shown at the end of each precinct video with poll workers in front of the tally screen announcing the final totals. Each county adds up all the precincts on video as well. Then the state adds up all counties on video as well.

With this method every vote is recorded on video. This could be used for president and governor races where this is only a few candidates on the ballot.

Not only that each voter can write a secret 6 digit PIN on their ballot. Then they can watch the video and find their ballot held up and counted by the poll worker. This is the ONLY method that a voter can can confirm their vote was counted correctly. You can to see YOUR ballot counted, and see the tally got up +1 for your vote.
Really poorly thought out process. What happens in places where voters can vote at any polling location?

Houston is in Harris County - elections are run at the county level here, and there are hundreds of voting precincts. I can't find the exact number, but let's say there are 300. It would require about 10 people to run the process you suggest. That means the election administrator would have to find 3000 people to count votes. In the November 2020 General Election, 1.64 million votes were cast here. People complain about how late election results are now. I can't imagine how long it would take to get the votes counted.

Your "secret" PIN concept will lead to more fraud, with bad guys paying, or extorting, for votes, then watching the videos to make sure their guys voted as ordered. There's a reason we have secret votes, with no ballot being personally identifiable.

And all of this because people with an inability to think critically believe Trump's proclamations that there was widespread fraud. There wasn't.
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Old 11-05-2021, 07:27 AM
 
15,302 posts, read 7,334,822 times
Reputation: 19223
Quote:
Originally Posted by albert648 View Post
Oh please.

No one is preventing persons of color from getting a real-ID compliant driver's license or a passport. And btw, the State of Texas has no jurisdiction over passports, that's within the Department of State's purview.
It's not all about ID. With the Legislature making birth certificates free, and non-profits helping would be voters get ID, and the deaths of the elderly women that were the largest group affected, ID isn't as big an issue.

The issues are more subtle now. things like requiring polling places be distributed differently in counties with more than a million , which results in fewer polling places in largely minority areas, and more in largely White areas. That would mean longer lines at polling places in largely minority areas, discouraging voting.

The list goes on.
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Old 11-05-2021, 07:58 AM
 
3,589 posts, read 1,564,481 times
Reputation: 5031
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRM20 View Post
Really poorly thought out process. What happens in places where voters can vote at any polling location?

Houston is in Harris County - elections are run at the county level here, and there are hundreds of voting precincts. I can't find the exact number, but let's say there are 300. It would require about 10 people to run the process you suggest. That means the election administrator would have to find 3000 people to count votes. In the November 2020 General Election, 1.64 million votes were cast here. People complain about how late election results are now. I can't imagine how long it would take to get the votes counted.

Your "secret" PIN concept will lead to more fraud, with bad guys paying, or extorting, for votes, then watching the videos to make sure their guys voted as ordered. There's a reason we have secret votes, with no ballot being personally identifiable.

And all of this because people with an inability to think critically believe Trump's proclamations that there was widespread fraud. There wasn't.
In my method counting of ballot votes is done at the precinct where the ballot boxes are, and counting is done on a table next to the ballot box, so that the camera records each ballot taken out of the box one at a time, and tallied one at a time on camera. I can think of no better fraud proof method, can you?

With every vote counted one at a time and proven on video that the tally is accurate, the only issue remaining is verifying the voter is registered and legal.

As for secret PIN- that's an option for the voter and extortion is a possibility. That's a good point you make. Instead of using a PIN a hidden serial number under a sticker could be used- the voter removes the sticker just before dropping the ballot into the box, and takes the sticker with them. The sticker has the serial number printed on the sitcky side. In this way only the voter has that removed sticker and only the voter knows the serial number of their ballot. And the voter can find their ballot on video playback, proving it was counted, and tallied accurately. I appreciate your input. This improves my method.

Computers are not secure and should not be used. Vote tallying is simply counting- starting at ONE and stopping at last vote. There's no reason all ballots and tallies should not be on live video so that counting can be verified accurate.
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Old 11-05-2021, 08:03 AM
 
8,181 posts, read 2,771,780 times
Reputation: 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRM20 View Post
It's not all about ID. With the Legislature making birth certificates free, and non-profits helping would be voters get ID, and the deaths of the elderly women that were the largest group affected, ID isn't as big an issue.

The issues are more subtle now. things like requiring polling places be distributed differently in counties with more than a million , which results in fewer polling places in largely minority areas, and more in largely White areas. That would mean longer lines at polling places in largely minority areas, discouraging voting.

The list goes on.
Boo hoo. There are longer lines in polling stations in large cities? Oh Come on. More people, longer lines. The D/FW area DPS offices were booked out for 7+ months so I once had to fly down to Houston to get my license. People will make it happen if they want to. Your problem would easily be solved by letting people vote in any polling station they want statewide.

By your logic, the FAA is racist because DFW Airport has longer lines than Waco Airport. More users, longer lines. It's just how it is. No one's being turned away at any polling station just like no one with a boarding pass is turned away at any airport.

The racism dog whistle's getting old. It's not even original anymore.

Last edited by albert648; 11-05-2021 at 08:11 AM..
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Old 11-05-2021, 08:16 AM
 
22,284 posts, read 21,659,779 times
Reputation: 54735
OP seems to want to restrict absentee voting to overseas military. Thoughtlessly excluding the millions of expats who live and travel overseas. Either he thinks we should not be allowed to vote, or he just forgot about us. Either of which disqualifies him from having his suggestions taken seriously.

If you want to advocate for disrupting our entire election system, BE SMARTER.
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Old 11-05-2021, 08:27 AM
 
4,903 posts, read 2,673,345 times
Reputation: 6932
Quote:
Originally Posted by moneill View Post
There is zero evidence of widespread fraud.

So trying to find solutions to a non-existing problem is an interesting approach.
Then this takes Trump off the hook for the 2016 election. There was talk of election fraud when the Russians colluded with Trump to get him elected. Since there was no fraud, this clears Trump as well as Biden. They both won fair and square in 2016 and in 2020. Obviously, it was the investigations about the Trump-Russian collusion that were a waste of time and resources. Didn't the investigators know that we have honest elections? Sheesh!
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Old 11-05-2021, 08:31 AM
 
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,149 posts, read 16,970,121 times
Reputation: 15499
Quote:
Originally Posted by james112 View Post
My voting method doesn't trust anyone. Go back to dropping a ballot into a box and video record everything- each voter dropping a ballot into the box (and the camera can see it's one ballot), the counting of each ballot one by one. Mail in ballots must be sent to the precinct of that voter, the location where voting will take place.

This should be done at each precinct and NOT at a central voting center. As each ballot is taken out of the box one at a time, on video, the poll worker holds it up so the camera records the vote. Then the poll worker presses +1 for that candidate. Large screens show the real time count. All precinct videos posted online for all to watch. mail in ballots are dropped in by a poll worker after confirming the sig/photo/etc of the voter.

No computers. Just an adding machine with a large display. The final tally is shown at the end of each precinct video with poll workers in front of the tally screen announcing the final totals. Each county adds up all the precincts on video as well. Then the state adds up all counties on video as well.

With this method every vote is recorded on video. This could be used for president and governor races where this is only a few candidates on the ballot.

Not only that each voter can write a secret 6 digit PIN on their ballot. Then they can watch the video and find their ballot held up and counted by the poll worker. This is the ONLY method that a voter can can confirm their vote was counted correctly. You can to see YOUR ballot counted, and see the tally got up +1 for your vote.
You can't get a picture added to credit cards so stores can see that the user matches the card because of privacy laws and you are going to implement the equivalent of a face recognition data base to cast a vote.

The process and procedures work it was the last President who cast the seeds of doubt even before the election occurred. Don't know what its like where you live but here the ballot it submitted to a scanner by the individual, the tally recorded on that scanner are the numbers collected from that precinct. Works fine and a lot easier than trying to watch a video and count votes......

Look at the last election in Virginia, prior to that there were accusations flying on these boards about all kinds of cheating that would occur, their candidate won not a peep out of them. Why is that if cheating always occurs wouldn't the Democrat have won or is cheating acceptable when the Republican wins?
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Old 11-05-2021, 08:48 AM
 
58,749 posts, read 27,080,924 times
Reputation: 14186
Quote:
Originally Posted by CALGUY View Post
First, make election day a federal holiday.
Get rid of mail in ballots for those who do not have a valid reason to have one.
The ONLY people who should receive a mail in ballot are people who are disabled, and military personnel who are out of the country, and that's it.

As in years past, candidates running for office, made sure people voting their party, got transportation to the polls.
That was not an issue.
For those voting by mail, their ballots must be postmarked no later than the last day of October.
All mail in ballots would be counted, and accounted for before the general election in November.
The only voting on election day would be done in person, at the polls.
ID would be required for anyone voting.
If you can't furnish ID, then you can't vote.

The reason this is not being done presently is because it is much to simple, and those in charge want confusion so the voting public doesn't have a clue what is going on.
People have been voting forever WITHOUT it.

Those that chose to vote ALWAYS did.

A fed holiday is NOT needed.
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Old 11-05-2021, 09:20 AM
 
Location: Philaburbia
41,882 posts, read 74,938,731 times
Reputation: 66814
Quote:
Originally Posted by james112 View Post
My voting method doesn't trust anyone. Go back to dropping a ballot into a box and video record everything- each voter dropping a ballot into the box (and the camera can see it's one ballot), the counting of each ballot one by one. Mail in ballots must be sent to the precinct of that voter, the location where voting will take place.
Your method is vastly more inefficient than it is trustworthy. How many precincts vote in schools, churches, community buildings, fire halls, etc.? How do these locations "where voting will take place" handle mail in ballots? Not only is this inefficient, it's also a recipe for error as schools and churches do not have the capacity to handle that volume of mail.

Counting votes at each precinct also is inefficient, nevermind the quaint notion of hand counting and displaying each ballot to a camera. You'd probably be the first to complain that the vote tally is going into the next morning.

Quote:
The final tally is shown at the end of each precinct video with poll workers in front of the tally screen announcing the final totals.
LOL - just who are the poll workers announcing the final total to?

Quote:
Originally Posted by albert648 View Post
No one is preventing persons of color from getting a real-ID compliant driver's license or a passport.
Real ID and passports cost money over and above a driver's license or state-issued ID. Cost is a factor; I'll leave it to you to figure out the economics as they relate to persons of color.

Quote:
Originally Posted by james112 View Post
There's no reason all ballots and tallies should not be on live video so that counting can be verified accurate.
Because no one has ever fudged a video.
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Old 11-05-2021, 09:25 AM
 
Location: Vallejo
21,716 posts, read 24,949,937 times
Reputation: 18986
Quote:
Originally Posted by albert648 View Post
Boo hoo. There are longer lines in polling stations in large cities? Oh Come on. More people, longer lines. The D/FW area DPS offices were booked out for 7+ months so I once had to fly down to Houston to get my license. People will make it happen if they want to. Your problem would easily be solved by letting people vote in any polling station they want statewide.

By your logic, the FAA is racist because DFW Airport has longer lines than Waco Airport. More users, longer lines. It's just how it is. No one's being turned away at any polling station just like no one with a boarding pass is turned away at any airport.

The racism dog whistle's getting old. It's not even original anymore.
Or just mail in your absentee ballot.
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