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Old 12-11-2021, 07:19 AM
 
25,805 posts, read 16,456,078 times
Reputation: 15996

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“Saving Europe”. What a joke. That ship has sailed. 80 years ago Europe was worth saving. What are we saving for?
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Old 12-11-2021, 07:29 AM
 
26,732 posts, read 22,409,968 times
Reputation: 10023
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
The Russians themselves don't want a war, and neither does the west.

Negotiations are the best way forward.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCsswh7L3QM

BNW...
I just came back from Moscow few days ago ( spent a month there.)
The Russian men look as intimidating as ever (not that they are all that way, but they sure LOOK this way.)
Russia is not for the faint of heart. Even when it comes to Moscow, where the life is indeed more comfortable than in the province and many other Russian cities.

I am sure nobody wants war for real there ( although some hot heads do wish to smack the Ukrainians to calm them down.)
But interestingly enough, it's the NEGOTIATIONS that brought the situation to the dead end ( to this latest crisis) in the first place.

And since ( as I've said earlier) the Western media is not doing its job, presenting situation in a very non-objective manner, following the *prescribed* narrative, Putin finally got the attention of the West, bringing Russian troops to Ukrainian border.

Since no words were getting through to the Western governments and they were falling on the deaf ears so to speak, the actions finally achieved their goal.

The Ukraine will be FORCED to return to the table of negotiations, and not on its terms as their government hopes.

That's what it looks like.

But I will have to explain the details on the "Ukraine's" thread, the caveat that I see so far, the catch 22.
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Old 12-11-2021, 08:42 AM
 
Location: Fort Payne Alabama
2,558 posts, read 2,884,236 times
Reputation: 5014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova View Post
Russia has more nuclear weapons than we do. They can take out the whole east coast with just 5 Satan 2's.


https://www.express.co.uk/news/world...ic-missile-USA
Yes they can wipe us out 8 times over, we can only wipe them out 5 times over.......Russia, Russia, Russia!
Wonder what our trade deficit is with Russia? Wonder how many US jobs have moved to Russia? I keep looking for those cheap made Russian Goods at Walmart........LOL!!
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Old 12-11-2021, 09:05 AM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,570,693 times
Reputation: 9675
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cape Cod Todd View Post
I think Biden and the Dems think Putin is a joke and Putin certainly feels that way about Biden and the now weakened US. The world saw what happened in Afghanistan with the pitiful withdrawal/ retreat/ embarrassment and Putin knows that the Dems don't have the fortitude to be tough. Trump on the other hand was a skilled negotiator that knew to keep his friends close but his enemies closer.



Obama thought Russia was a joke. There was that time in the debate against Romney and Mittens said that Russia is a great threat, Obama replied "hey Mitt the 80's called and they want their foreign policy back" and he got a big laugh for it. What is it with the Dems?




Russia is poised to launch a ground attack the likes we haven't seen since the Blitzkrieg. Imagine tanks and troops moving in mass across Eastern Europe again. What is Biden going to do? Probably not much but if those Russian troops are not fully vaccinated they better watch out because Biden will have some harsh words for them.
My goodness, what web site do you follow that has you convinced that Russia is about to launch one of the biggest military attacks on a country ever?
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Old 12-11-2021, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Great Britain
27,044 posts, read 13,303,145 times
Reputation: 19282
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
BNW...
I just came back from Moscow few days ago ( spent a month there.)
The Russian men look as intimidating as ever (not that they are all that way, but they sure LOOK this way.)
Russia is not for the faint of heart. Even when it comes to Moscow, where the life is indeed more comfortable than in the province and many other Russian cities.

I am sure nobody wants war for real there ( although some hot heads do wish to smack the Ukrainians to calm them down.)
But interestingly enough, it's the NEGOTIATIONS that brought the situation to the dead end ( to this latest crisis) in the first place.

And since ( as I've said earlier) the Western media is not doing its job, presenting situation in a very non-objective manner, following the *prescribed* narrative, Putin finally got the attention of the West, bringing Russian troops to Ukrainian border.

Since no words were getting through to the Western governments and they were falling on the deaf ears so to speak, the actions finally achieved their goal.

The Ukraine will be FORCED to return to the table of negotiations, and not on its terms as their government hopes.

That's what it looks like.

But I will have to explain the details on the "Ukraine's" thread, the caveat that I see so far, the catch 22.
I don't think anyone is bothered about how allegedly intimidating Russian men are, as modern warfare is increasingly hi-tech and relies more on brains and technology that vodka fuelled masculinity.

As for Ukraine, I suggest it becomes a demilitarised zone between Russia and NATO, with both sides backing off in order to avoid conflict.
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Old 12-11-2021, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Some Airport Transit Zone
2,776 posts, read 1,836,128 times
Reputation: 857
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
As for Ukraine, I suggest it becomes a demilitarised zone between Russia and NATO, with both sides backing off in order to avoid conflict.
That's not enough to avoid conflict. Additionally, Ukraine MUST stop shelling peaceful civilians in eastern Ukraine and killing them almost every day. Ukraine MUST end all domestic war crimes against the pro-Russian population. If Ukraine stop it, Russia will calm down.
And yes, NATO bases should not be deployed in Ukraine at all.
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Old 12-11-2021, 10:40 AM
 
26,732 posts, read 22,409,968 times
Reputation: 10023
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
I don't think anyone is bothered about how allegedly intimidating Russian men are, as modern warfare is increasingly hi-tech and relies more on brains and technology that vodka fuelled masculinity.

As for Ukraine, I suggest it becomes a demilitarised zone between Russia and NATO, with both sides backing off in order to avoid conflict.

That's not "vodka-fuelled" I assure you - that's the toughness of life over there in general; the wilderness of nature, the vast space, the constant survival mode, the calamities, the wars.

They just look this way naturally, without any actual attempt to intimidate anyone in my opinion)))

With that being said, the "hi tech and brains" are not exactly lacking there as well.

Last edited by erasure; 12-11-2021 at 11:10 AM..
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Old 12-11-2021, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Austin
2,953 posts, read 988,510 times
Reputation: 2790
Russia's military is very good. Nobody who's lived through the cold war can underestimate their basic military philosophies that make them very effective. They are somewhat down on tech compared to the US but make up for that with the quality of large numbers. Their deficit in tech is not that large anymore and in some cases they are ahead. Our traditional superiority in air power has led them to develop very effective anti-aircraft systems. Their armor has always been very good and has at times surpassed ours as we see-sawed back and forth in that arena. The T14 Armata has very different new features than the Abrams and it's an open question whether it might be superior to the M1-A2 or A3. That new generation aside, the Russians still have 2x the main battle tanks as we do. Air power ... Very good but without a doubt our pilots are better trained which is a huge advantage. In general this holds true for all aspects of the US military. We hold a significant advantage over everyone in the world in the sense that we have forgotten more about naval, air and ground combat than any other military will ever know. Like it or not the US has been fighting virtually nonstop all over the world since the start of WWII. There is NOTHING like the experiences of combat to create a huge wealth of lessons learned that becomes the foundation for how we train, arm and lead our fighting forces. In that regard our military forces are the Roman legions of the modern era. They fought everywhere across the empire for centuries and their lessons learned created a highly disciplined and nearly unbeatable force. This is a huge intangible advantage that we bring to war fighting. The Russians have good tech, large numbers of many weapons systems, well trained forces in some areas but they are raw and relatively untested. Advantage US vs Russia. Even larger advantage over China. That said I damn sure don't want to go to war against either one or both like Brandon may inadvertently stumble us into.
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Old 12-11-2021, 12:32 PM
 
Location: Austin
2,953 posts, read 988,510 times
Reputation: 2790
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova View Post
Russia has more nuclear weapons than we do. They can take out the whole east coast with just 5 Satan 2's.


https://www.express.co.uk/news/world...ic-missile-USA

Irrelevant. This sort of hack calculus has been debunked for nearly forty yrs. We used to call that sort of 2x, 3x, 5x overkill advantage "bouncing the rubble". You've turned your enemy's cities to glowing glass with first and second strikes. After that everything you send their way is just bouncing the rubble. It's not a deterrent. The thing that upsets the balance is first strike capability. We may not have hypersonic delivery (yet) but we still have the advantage in SLBMs. Virtually untraceable, shorter flight times thus difficult to intercept. Russia or China's hypersonic capability will never be able to take us out of the fight with a first strike as long as we have our SLBM capability.
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Old 12-11-2021, 01:16 PM
 
2,456 posts, read 1,257,169 times
Reputation: 1663
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreggT View Post
Wonder what our trade deficit is with Russia? Wonder how many US jobs have moved to Russia? I keep looking for those cheap made Russian Goods at Walmart........LOL!!
I remember Trump was flying all over the world trying to threaten different countries not to buy sophisticated Russian weapons.

U.S. sanctions Turkey over purchase of Russian S-400 missile system
---
I don't think Putin invests into production of plastic toys for Walmart.
Instead, he invests into nuclear reactors, civilian and military planes, cars, etc.

I believe Putin is building reactors in Egypt and Belarus.
"The 6th largest economy in the world", California, is building none.

It's interesting to compare this Ukrainian deal.

https://neutronbytes.com/2021/11/24/...al-in-ukraine/
Quote:
U.S. nuclear reactor vendor Westinghouse Electric announced this week that it signed a contract with Energoatom, the state-owned nuclear utility of Ukraine, to build five 1150 MWe AP1000 reactors at four separate sites in Ukraine.

The deal, with an estimated value of about $30 billion...
I guess Ukrainians want Biden to cover $30 billion. Biden is hesitating.

I wonder who will built nuclear reactors first: Russia in Egypt or the USA in the Ukraine.
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