Russia Spelled It Out And marked The Page In History. (economy, retired)

[erasure]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

Russia sees everything from the perspective of the 1930s-40s and fascism.

Are you a Russian?

Or do you live there by any chance?

[musiqum]

Originally Posted by Winterfall8324

Russia has filed a draft for a potential treaty with NATO over the situation in Ukraine:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/russia-...pe-11639753002
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-59696450

Here is the abbreviated list:

- NATO members who joined after 1997 cannot deploy NATO troops or missiles were it could endanger the Russian border

- Georgia and Ukraine must not be permitted to join NATO

- No more expansion of NATO towards Russia

- No more deployment of nuclear weapons by the US onto Europe (and no Russian nukes in the Americas)

- Ukraine must cease attacks in the Donbass region and return to negotiations

Jen Psaki and the NATO leadership have both said these demands are unreasonable.

As US citizens what is your say?

I would say that Jen Psaki and the NATO leadership both are unreasonable.

[TMSRetired]

The US needs to engage in war. Our economy revolves around it.

And if they can't find a war they will create one.

Did the Gulf of Tonkin really happen ?
They wait until all involved are dead before they release papers that tell the truth.

We provoked and taunted Russia to where they built up a defense line.
And now we claim they are mounting forces with intent to invade.

What do you think the US would do if Russia decided to play their wartime exercises off the coast of Cuba with naval and air fleets ?

[Skezo]

Originally Posted by k350

Countries should feel free to do as they wish, including joining whatever organization they wish, hosting whatever forces they wish.

and if Russia feels it is in their best interest to invade Ukraine?

[erasure]

Originally Posted by TMSRetired

The US needs to engage in war. Our economy revolves around it.

And if they can't find a war they will create one.

Did the Gulf of Tonkin really happen ?
They wait until all involved are dead before they release papers that tell the truth.

We provoked and taunted Russia to where they built up a defense line.
And now we claim they are mounting forces with intent to invade.

What do you think the US would do if Russia decided to play their wartime exercises off the coast of Cuba with naval and air fleets ?

See, at the end it's all about the "exceptionalism" of America, voiced out in the open by Hillary Clinton.

That America has the *moral right* to do what other nations ( in this case Russia) are not allowed to do.

The moral superiority so to speak.

That's where it all starts.

The cornerstone of the belief, that's worthy of exploration I'd say...

[erasure]

Originally Posted by Skezo

and if Russia feels it is in their best interest to invade Ukraine?

It actually WAS in Russia's best interests ( the national interests) to invade Ukraine right after the coup d'etat in Kiev, sponsored by Americans.
This would nip this potential NATO invasion in the bud, and would have saved a lot of lives of the Eastern Ukrainians ( who are basically Russians - let's be honest about it.)

But see, Russian national interests and the interests of the Russian ruling class are not one and the same thing.

[musiqum]

Originally Posted by k350

Countries should feel free to do as they wish, including joining whatever organization they wish, hosting whatever forces they wish.

If you are talking about military organizations and blocs, then they should be aware they could break "wishes" of another country and then they should wait for the corresponding consequences. These countries should realize that joining a military bloc is a big challenge to another country. This means that their joining creates military tension.

[UAman]

Could the moderators combine two Russian-Ukrainian threads into one?
Thanks.

[musiqum]

Originally Posted by jbgusa

Does that mean handing them the keys to Ukraine, Georgia, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Finland, Poland, Hungary, Slovak Republic, Czech Republic and maybe half of Germany? I think that is not a good idea.

Why the hell do you seriously think that Russia will invade these countries??
Your brain is poisoned by deceitful anti-Russian propaganda.

[PullMyFinger]

Originally Posted by Scrat335

Just where this will end is anyones guess.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...DHP&li=BBnb7Kz

This would be so easy if all parties concerned came to the table and made peace. Sadly, the people who run the West think that peace is not profitable and therefore unrealistic to expect, it's not how things work. The US simply sees a world filled with threatening adversaries to be dominated or destroyed. America, working together with other great powers for the good of humanity is not an option.

It's quite apparent to the Russians what the goals of the West are. The destruction of their state as a nation. I really get the feeling that Russia is going to act because it has been forced to. We all know what happens when you force something into a corner.

It's time to either respect Russia as an equal and the great nation it is, or we all suffer the consequences.

I expect if this message is not heard it's going to get rough. Russia has nothing to lose at this point.

Russia has big nukes so like it or not we have to negotiate in good faith…unless we have new weapons that neutralize those nukes which I doubt. We could give them half of Canada for the Ukraine or something.