Ray Epps subpoena: Anyone think he will tell the truth? (lawyer, FBI)

[berdee]

Originally Posted by Malloric

It sounds like he encouraged people who were already in DC to go from Trump's speech to the Capitol building. Trump did that as well. Should we arrest Trump? I don't know about it. Going from Trump's speech to the Capitol building to peacefully protest is fine. At most you're breaking some nobody cares law about assembly without a proper permit.

On Jan 5, Epps incited people to into entering the capitol building. He was there, seeming to encourage/incite people, on Jan 6 as well.

He trespassed on capitol grounds but did not enter the building, was gone before violence started, and helped deescalate fellow rioters from attacking the police. I mean, that's kind of his side of the story, right, and he's probably not going to increment himself when giving interviews with the press. But it's consistent. A non-violent trespasser would get a slap on the wrist if they had to arrest them and formally charge them. They pretty much all got released without any bail on their own recognizance and then were on probation. There were thousands and thousands of people who trespassed on the grounds, thousands that entered the building most of whom were just stupid people who followed the crowds in and took some pictures and left.

Yes, he and many people, including Rhodes, trespassed on the grounds but never entered the building. Epps was not charged for that like many others were.

Rhodes has a lot more serious charges, a lot of them pretty complicated ones involving conspiracy. There's apparently a pretty well documented paper log of his actions where he coordinated with others to bring explosives, rambled on about starting a civil war, maintained a hitlist of officials. He's either basically a domestic terrorist that got himself caught prematurely or just a giant idiot and it's kind of hard to tell which as the case and charges against him are so complex and convoluted.

I never said Epps had done exactly the same as Rhodes, just that he'd done "similar", similar is not same. And yes, the Rhodes case is very "complex and convoluted".

It does make me angry that they'd done what they did. They are no better than blm antifa, with the exceptions being that they weren't quite as violent, no burning or murdering, and they didn't harm average citizens like blm antifa had done.

I'm fine with them being found guilty of crimes that they had committed as long as the punishment is 'what the law allows' and not 'more than', and I feel similar about blm antifa and the crimes that they had committed.

[berdee]

Originally Posted by kdog

So then you agree that:

Ray Epps did NOT arrange travel for people to DC.

Ray Epps did NOT arrange for weapons and tactical gear to be brought to DC.

Correct?

I never said he did those things to begin with, it's your invention not mine.

So for you to say that Ray Epps did "something similar" to Rhodes, is a totally bogus argument.

Ray Epps did none of that which is why he didn't get the same treatment as Rhodes.

"Same treatment"? I merely said he wasn't charged for committing crimes. Again, what you're yammering about is your own invention.

but then, you do like to twist what people say.

[Malloric]

Originally Posted by berdee

On Jan 5, Epps incited people to into entering the capitol building. He was there, seeming to encourage/incite people, on Jan 6 as well.

Yes, he and many people, including Rhodes, trespassed on the grounds but never entered the building. Epps was not charged for that like many others were.



I never said Epps had done exactly the same as Rhodes, just that he'd done "similar", similar is not same. And yes, the Rhodes case is very "complex and convoluted".

It does make me angry that they'd done what they did. They are no better than blm antifa, with the exceptions being that they weren't quite as violent, no burning or murdering, and they didn't harm average citizens like blm antifa had done.

I'm fine with them being found guilty of crimes that they had committed as long as the punishment is 'what the law allows' and not 'more than', and I feel similar about blm antifa and the crimes that they had committed.

But Epps didn't do anything similar to Rhodes, at least not that is public information. There's no allegations that he conspired with others to use explosives to attack the Capitol Building, spent lots of time online talking about civil wars, maintained with co-conspirators a hitlist of officials to assassinate, staged weapons nearby to foolishly try and overthrow the US government by force.

I really don't know how credible a threat Rhodes was or was not. Did he just spend his time with fellow likeminded people whining about things and the explosives and hitlists and civil war talk was just buddies chewing the fat at the bar? Not really. While they didn't bomb the Capitol Building and left their stockpile of arms in a hotel room, it definitely wasn't all just baseless fat chewing. It's a convoluted case for sure and really nothing similar to Epps which seems pretty straightforward.

[kdog]

Originally Posted by berdee

I never said he did those things to begin with, it's your invention not mine.


"Same treatment"? I merely said he wasn't charged for committing crimes. Again, what you're yammering about is your own invention.

but then, you do like to twist what people say.

I'm not twisting anything. Here are your exact words.

Originally Posted by berdee

Something isn't right. He did similar to what Rhodes had done, incited others to be there, trespassed on the grounds of the capitol, incited others to go inside the capitol building, etc., yet Epps was allowed to walk away scot-free. There are others who were on the grounds and had never entered the capitol building yet they are being charged with illegally being on the grounds of the capitol, while Epps was given a free pass for doing the same.

So no, Epps in no way did something "similar" to what Rhodes did which were your exact words. Rhodes used encrypted communications to coordinate and arrange travel to DC for his militia bringing weapons and tactical gear. That is seditious conspiracy. That's a huge crime and in no way resembles what Ray Epps did. All Epps did was shout encouragement at the rioters, and the DOJ isn't prosecuting people for that.

The only thing that "isn't right" is your initial statement that Epps did something similar and was treated differently.

[cuebald]

Originally Posted by berdee

Epps encouraged people to go to DC, as did Rhodes.
Epps trespassed on the capitol grounds but didn't enter the building, the same as Rhodes...(and the same as others who had been charged for being on the grounds but not in the building).
Epps incited people to enter the capitol building (it's even on tape), as did Rhodes.

Stop making excuses.

Rhodes founded the Oath Keepers, ran the group, coordinated security for Roger Stone, and hauled a load of firearms into Virginia to be close at hand if needed. Three of them have pleaded guilty to seditious conspiracy in relation to the coup attempt on 1/6, and are now cooperating witnesses against the group. Rhodes is also charged with seditious conspiracy, and has pleaded not guilty.

Epps is a simple schlub who got scapegoated by the media.

[berdee]

Originally Posted by kdog

I'm not twisting anything. Here are your exact words.



So no, Epps in no way did something "similar" to what Rhodes did which were your exact words. Rhodes used encrypted communications to coordinate and arrange travel to DC for his militia bringing weapons and tactical gear. That is seditious conspiracy. That's a huge crime and in no way resembles what Ray Epps did. All Epps did was shout encouragement at the rioters, and the DOJ isn't prosecuting people for that.

The only thing that "isn't right" is your initial statement that Epps did something similar and was treated differently.

Wow, you're still twisting what I'd said. but that is not surprising.

[kdog]

Originally Posted by berdee

Wow, you're still twisting what I'd said. but that is not surprising.

Then explain yourself. You keep telling me I'm twisting your words and yet you can't seem to untwist them.

Here's your quote:

Originally Posted by berdee

Something isn't right. He did similar to what Rhodes had done, incited others to be there, trespassed on the grounds of the capitol, incited others to go inside the capitol building, etc., yet Epps was allowed to walk away scot-free. There are others who were on the grounds and had never entered the capitol building yet they are being charged with illegally being on the grounds of the capitol, while Epps was given a free pass for doing the same.

Explain how Epps did something similar to Rhodes, when Rhodes is charged with Seditious Conspiracy for coordinating a militia to come to DC with weapons and tactical gear, and Epps didn't.

Your argument that their crimes were similar is like a bank robber complaining that he was treated more severely for double-parking his getaway car than most people who double park. That, while completely leaving out the part that he robbed a bank as well. Duh!

[WK91]

This makes no sense at all, and him being free at the moment, with the NYT painting him as a victim and Adam Kinzinger saying nice thing about him.

But why is this one guy given a pass while many others have been locked away for many months?

So let’s recap. He travels to DC from Arizona, because he’s supposedly a huge Trump supporter. But he doesn’t go watch the speech. What he did on Jan 5th and Jan 6th is repeatedly yelling out to everyone that they need to breach the Capitol, to actually go inside. He is caught on tape over and over again.

That sure seems like criminal activity to me, yet he’s not ever been charged by anyone.

Leftists like to laugh this whole thing off as a right wing conspiracy, because many have accused Epps as a covert agent planted by the Democrats.

But if the leftists are right, why is he not in jail and why are Dem politicians and Dem propaganda newspapers saying nice things about a guy who fomented an “insurrection”.?

Seems to me if Dems wanted to disprove this conspiracy, they’d arrest Ray Epps. But since they don’t, it’s very likely he is part of a false flag operation.

[InformedConsent]

He's a glowie (member/asset of a Fed Gov 3 letter agency). This is no different than when the FBI staged the fake Michigan Governor kidnapping plot that they tried to pin on what they said was an extremist group.

[Taratova]

Ray Epps is a paid operative being protected by the FBI. Take it to the bank.