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Old 02-12-2022, 07:47 PM
 
Location: az
13,734 posts, read 7,999,139 times
Reputation: 9402

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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dark Enlightenment View Post
I meant Gu is substantially Chinese in an objective sense, if not by the standards of some irrational people in China or America.
It's the way the Chinese people view themselves. You are either Chinese or you're not. And Gu is not. Furthermore she knows this. She's an outsider and always will be.

Last edited by john3232; 02-12-2022 at 08:41 PM..
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Old 02-12-2022, 08:03 PM
 
8,146 posts, read 3,676,088 times
Reputation: 2718
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981 View Post
Nope. Who the heck said anything about traitor? Gu only received criticism because china and u s relationship is not going so well at the moment. Honestly. Both countries kind of used her to push their agenda. She didn't violate any rules or break any laws.

We really shouldn't beat the dead horse.

Actually. I respect her if she truly gave up her American citizenship. I think she did. At least she does not want to have the cake and eat it too. That shows character.
It is highly unlikely that she did. And there is nothing wrong with that.
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Old 02-12-2022, 08:14 PM
 
Location: Elysium
12,386 posts, read 8,152,322 times
Reputation: 9194
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981 View Post
Nope. Who the heck said anything about traitor? Gu only received criticism because china and u s relationship is not going so well at the moment. Honestly. Both countries kind of used her to push their agenda. She didn't violate any rules or break any laws.

We really shouldn't beat the dead horse.

Actually. I respect her if she truly gave up her American citizenship. I think she did. At least she does not want to have the cake and eat it too. That shows character.
Didn't break an American rules or laws. Someone got someone in China to break their laws because she couldn't drop her American citizenship as she was too young.
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Old 02-12-2022, 09:10 PM
 
Location: Perpetuality On Wheels
447 posts, read 496,030 times
Reputation: 143
Had their leader think so, they should take down digital Great Wall and open all around party control media, let people speak freely without ever tightening censorship and fearing for severe repercussion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
True. If they have an American-style fair election today, Xi would win 90% of the votes.

Last edited by seagull84; 02-12-2022 at 09:19 PM..
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Old 02-12-2022, 11:39 PM
 
Location: The Heart of Dixie
10,214 posts, read 15,927,883 times
Reputation: 7203
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dark Enlightenment View Post
I meant Gu is substantially Chinese in an objective sense, if not by the standards of some irrational people in China or America.
I think the difference is that white for myself, country is everything, for her, race and ethnicity is everything. So racially and ethnically she sees herself as Chinese and she sees Xi Jiping as the leader of the Chinese people worldwide, in a racial sense. Note that I personally disagree with this, but many people see the President of China as the leader of the global Chinese people, similar to how the Prime Minister of Israel is the leader of the Jewish people. So her ethnic solidarity probably trumps her American citizenship which is why she would play for China.

Now of course I'm not an Olympic athlete. However my national pride in the U.S. is too strong for me to even display a Chinese flag in my home or wear a shirt with a Chinese flag on it, let alone represent the nation of China in anything. For me it all comes down to nationality and religion. These these are the most important parts of my identity other than my immediate family. I think as Americans we need to stop focusing so much on race and ethnicity, that is why our nation is so divided.

Personally speaking, being American, Southern, Christian and Louisianan are all far more important to my identity than being Asian or Chinese American. And no being a "global citizen" doesn't figure into my mindset at all. That's a liberal construct.
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Old 02-13-2022, 05:45 AM
 
Location: Japan
15,292 posts, read 7,759,397 times
Reputation: 10006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70 View Post
I think the difference is that white for myself, country is everything, for her, race and ethnicity is everything. So racially and ethnically she sees herself as Chinese and she sees Xi Jiping as the leader of the Chinese people worldwide, in a racial sense. Note that I personally disagree with this, but many people see the President of China as the leader of the global Chinese people, similar to how the Prime Minister of Israel is the leader of the Jewish people. So her ethnic solidarity probably trumps her American citizenship which is why she would play for China.

Now of course I'm not an Olympic athlete. However my national pride in the U.S. is too strong for me to even display a Chinese flag in my home or wear a shirt with a Chinese flag on it, let alone represent the nation of China in anything. For me it all comes down to nationality and religion. These these are the most important parts of my identity other than my immediate family. I think as Americans we need to stop focusing so much on race and ethnicity, that is why our nation is so divided.

Personally speaking, being American, Southern, Christian and Louisianan are all far more important to my identity than being Asian or Chinese American. And no being a "global citizen" doesn't figure into my mindset at all. That's a liberal construct.
I understand where you're coming from, and I see the value of nationalist sentiments, but in this case it seems far too extreme. It is perfectly normal for a bicultural person like Gu to accept citizenship in and represent the country of either one of her parents in athletic competition. To condemn her for that infringes on her rights as an individual.
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Old 02-13-2022, 07:05 AM
 
Location: Boston, MA
14,483 posts, read 11,282,562 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lily76 View Post
Last but not least. Hating Gu won't make you a better person. Please change your eyes to Jake Chelios, an adult American playing for the Chinese this time as well. Stop bullying a 18 year old.

You want to be her then work hard for your own dream.

You want your daughter to be a champion then input resources, love, and support as Gu's mum once did.
Oh stop it! No one hates her.

Jake Chelios has been playing in China for 3 years. That's what a lot of marginally talented sports personalities or ones who are nearing the end of their career do when they cannot get into the majors in the US. They are trying to make a living.
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Old 02-13-2022, 07:51 AM
 
Location: Newport Beach, California
39,228 posts, read 27,603,964 times
Reputation: 16066
Why do some people have questions/problems with her is understandable.

This is why the ONLY thing that matters at this moment is whether or no she broke any rules.

Based on this article: https://sports.yahoo.com/eileen-gu-a...123345918.html

A.
The IOC ( International Olympic Committee) allows athletes with dual citizenship to compete but requires them to hold a passport for the country which they represent in the Olympics.

B. China does not permit dual citizenship, at least according to the laws on its books.

The actual renunciation process is fairly quick — a simple declaration that you want to end your U.S. citizenship, the payment of a fee and the surrender of your passport — but the repercussions could last a lifetime.

C The Federal Register publishes a quarterly list of individuals who have renounced citizenship. It’s purported to be comprehensive, but expatriates have reported waits of months or years before appearing on the list.

Eileen Gu’s name does not appear on any quarterly list to date.

All these being said,

An International Olympic Committee statement said Gu acquired her Chinese nationality in 2019 and its Executive Board approved her "change of sporting nationality" in December of that year.

So it looks like she did not break any rule.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


well, Let's face it, SOME people think having duel citizenship is the best. Of course there are advantages as well, but during war or other crises you can find yourself in hot water if not able to leave to a neutral country. These days, dual citizens enjoy certain benefits, such as the ability to live and work freely in two countries, own property in both countries, and travel between the countries with relative ease.

In my humble opinion, some people are born in a situation where both parents are from different countries and makes more sense to get dual citizenship because of valid affinities to both. Choosing to hold dual citizenship does not necessarily mean they are any less loyal to either country.

For some people having dual citizenship is useful if they plan on doing business there, visiting family or owning property.

Now, in term of Loyalty.

Let me ask you this, how do you prove loyalty?

During ww2, the government asked the Japanese-Americans to prove loyalty.

To that, many Japanese-Americans' answer would be

We didn’t have to choose to be loyal, we already were. Even the Issei, first-gen immigrants, were known to say to their 2nd-gen Nisei kids: You were born here, you are an American.

Do you believe it? if you do, great, if you don't, then that is too damned bad. Either way, don't ask anybody to prove anything to you. Either you trust, or you don't.

This said, I'm sure the vast majority (Japanese-Americans were loyal but there was a number acting as spies if they were not already before the war.

In a way they already were acting as spies of a sort. Japan built their industrial might threw studying American industries and bringing this knowledge back to japan.

But then as today most legal immigrants mind there own business obey the laws because they came here to live the American dream and have a better life.

Like I said earlier, Loyalty, is just like love or passion, either you got it, or you don't. It is hard to explain.

I have been to so many different countries, and have lived in Germany, Japan, or China for more than 1 year. I have also visited at least 30 different countries, I can HONESTLY say there is NO country I dislike. I like them all. But do i have mad love for any of them? nope. I just love America. Don't ask me why, I don't why. It just is.

So when Gu answered media, "When I am in the U.S., I am American. When I am in China, I am Chinese." well, I think it is a lame answer, but I understand where she is coming from.

I never believe that when I am in Germany, I am a German; when I am in Japan, I am a Japanese. (It does not make any sense to me.) I just believe that, I am an American who likes to travel. lol That's it, no more/less. But this does not mean I think there is anything wrong with somebody like Gu.

All b.s. aside, I think most people would be more loyal to the country they call HOME. The country that provides their livelihood, protects their family, educates their children, take care of their medical needs and those of their family. I respect the land of my ancestors but I don't feel much if any loyalty toward it.

My HOME is the U.S., That is why I am loyal to my country.

No matter how much you want to over analyze the situation. Gu did not break the rules on paper. Even if she abandoned her American citizenship, what seems to be the big deal?

IN term of which team she would be cheering for in war, ONLY she can answer that question. Regardless what her answer would be, I have a feeling that it really does not matter to our national security. she ain't that important.

Last edited by lilyflower3191981; 02-13-2022 at 08:13 AM..
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Old 02-13-2022, 07:59 AM
 
5,956 posts, read 2,878,990 times
Reputation: 7792
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fisherman99 View Post
Now the youngest ever GOLD medalist in freestyle skiing, a very attractive model, and very smart...almost a perfect 1580 SAT score and accepted into Stanford. Will always be some jealous haters out there unfortunately...she is set for life now with dual nationality (tons more listed below)...kudos to her!!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eileen_Gu


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...al_nationality
The CCP (China) doesn't recognise dual citizen ship
She had to cut her citizenship with the US
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Old 02-13-2022, 08:56 AM
 
8,146 posts, read 3,676,088 times
Reputation: 2718
Quote:
Originally Posted by ben young View Post
The CCP (China) doesn't recognise dual citizen ship
She had to cut her citizenship with the US
The first statement does not lead to the second.
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