Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
NATO doesn't do a damn thing. Sovereign countries - and this may hurt, but having a border with Russia doesn't mean you can't be a sovereign country - apply for membership.
Finland and Sweden did not see that at an advantageous thing to do until Russia decided on a quick demonstration of the principle of power growing from the muzzle of a gun. The balance has changed, and Russia changed it. Putin has become the world's leading advocate for NATO membership, and ain't that a kick in the head?
Don't forget what they say: every nation deserves their ruler, I mean the vast majority of people in eastern europe aren't exactly exceptionally smart and as a result they fall easily for the western traps: nato/eu. There's no question in my mind that a remarkable amount of retards exist in eastern europe who favour nato/eu and I'm sure the average supporter is neither smarter, nor richer, nor better in any way than me. Ukraine's government is the same - they see cheese in the mouse trap, they go for it.
NATO doesn't do a damn thing. Sovereign countries - and this may hurt, but having a border with Russia doesn't mean you can't be a sovereign country - apply for membership.
Of course not.
And neither does the American gov.
It all happens as a pure coincidence - the change of the government and the new "aspirations" of this newly-installed government.
Quote:
Finland and Sweden did not see that at an advantageous thing to do until Russia decided on a quick demonstration of the principle of power growing from the muzzle of a gun. The balance has changed, and Russia changed it. Putin has become the world's leading advocate for NATO membership, and ain't that a kick in the head?
Surrre.
"Russia has changed it."
"Muzzle of the gun."
What happened to all those lengthy diplomatic negotiations that preceded it, when Russians were basically told to "shut up" with all their security concerns?
As they say "war is another way of diplomacy," when the first appeals haven't been heard.
As I've said - stop being hypocrites, it is what it is.
And it's not really even about "Putin."
It's about Russia, its very existence as an independent state, as the experience of the 90ies showed.
Only without Russia, this triumphant march of 33 genders and "non-binary individuals" can go full speed ahead.
I am not mentioning some other *aspects* of this (potential) triumphant march for obvious reasons.
Don't forget what they say: every nation deserves their ruler, I mean the vast majority of people in eastern europe aren't exactly exceptionally smart and as a result they fall easily for the western traps: nato/eu. There's no question in my mind that a remarkable amount of retards exist in eastern europe who favour nato/eu and I'm sure the average supporter is neither smarter, nor richer, nor better in any way than me. Ukraine's government is the same - they see cheese in the mouse trap, they go for it.
Look at GDP per Capita and median incomes, most EU members are far richer than Russians and backwards looking ex communist satellites of the Soviet Union. You would have to be am buffoon to think otherwise.
I on another hand apparently miss some information too, on the earlier attempts of Ukrainian gov. of evacuation in the Western direction.
I need to look up some more on that one.
What's there to look up? Other than the cite for the Russian's bombing the rail line on February 27th or 28th. It's an announcement by the railway itself that appeared in the Kyiv Independent. About 100,000 civilians did leave so called "early." Like I just happened to mention today, Kherson fell fast. Zelenskyy fired two generals.
Civilian accounts, including those of the newly arrived AP reporters, spoke of "waking" up to war. Crossing military lines never easy. Where were many to go. Into the sea? To Russia? Towards the fighting?
Still the Russian siege (outer, not closer in to the city) did not begin until about March 8th. That rail line was cut on February 27-28. Earlier you tried to spin the "wealthier" citizens getting out. Maybe in private vehicles that could drive around mines placed in a pattern designed to stop tanks, not cars.
When the city was still functioning, Ukrainians did not need to go-to-door. People still able to hop on a town bus down to the railway station to pile into cars 200 people strong like for other Ukrainian cities. Oh wait. No railway.
This description of Russians now going leisurely door to door in a wrecked city? Yup, that's what it takes. About which you say: "That's what you do, when you REALLY want to evacuate people." Too bad the International Red Cross isn't allowed to 'help.' How many die in the meantime waiting to be reached? Perhaps the Russians do want them kept far away until more bodies are tidied up.
Wasn't that one of the rationales for denying Bucha: Russians would never be stupid enough to allow bodies to just sit out to be photographed etc.
You'd do well to take a look at a Mariupol city map: the city is literally cut in two by the river, parkland, and a massive industrial area that contains the rail lines that are now, well, cut.
Plus, there isn't much fighting anywhere in Mariupol right now, except in the area right around the once two now one pocket in the industrial area not in some residential neighborhood. Battle maps show only a "disruption zone" inside the main Russian lines well outside the city where there's a possibility of artillery strikes or limited ground activity.
What do the Russians inside Mariupol have to say about this: Well every morning at 10am sharp we open the gate to the evacuation corridor to the west but the aid convoys run by the International Red Cross just never come!!! Sure, crossing now substantial Russian-controlled territory through the large number of individual Russian checkpoints. With strict orders not to be o the road at dusk. Maybe some day they'll get thru.
Last edited by EveryLady; 04-15-2022 at 04:19 PM..
Lets see, capitalist country needs more resources so it seeks outward expansion in order to survive. It needs to justify it so it takes the George W. Bush approach but instead of WMDs it uses “deNazifaction” as a front for what is essentially an imperial expansion to take another nation’s natural resources.
I look forward to your mental gymnastics in response.
Sure, let's proceed with "mental gymnastics" here.
So Russia ( or rather Putin's government) is a corporatist government - no doubt about it.
For him - money is what rules the world.
But isn't it what America wanted to achieve back in the 90ies, so that the Russians would drop their strange ideology of "communism," and become more like them, Americans, believing in the power of money instead?
That's precisely what happened - Putin's Russia operates on the "monetary principles" first and utmost - that's their main drive.
And no, it doesn't need "more resources" but it want(ted) to expand its economy, merging it with the Ukrainian one. And Putin was ready to PURCHASE this project, the way the corporatists do.
But this ( according to America) was a no-no thing.
See, it's only America that's allowed to expand its economy wherever it wants - be that Iraq's oil or what not, even by the way of invasions.
But Russia - oh no. How dare.
That's when it all started, back in 2014, with that Putin's attempt to PURCHASE Ukrainian economy.
And as I've said - it was a no-no thing in America's book, because America had different design for Ukraine in mind - you can read about it in Brzezinski's works ( he was Obama's adviser just in case you are not aware.)
So instead of punching the West back straight in the nose, once it made this slimy move in Ukraine ( i.e. coup d'etat,) Putin, being a corporatist that he is, decides to think about his money/economy ( that he accepted being dependent on the West back when,) and to betray Ukrainians that ask for his help.
Eight years fast forward, as the direct result of his decisions, NATO is on his door step, with Ukrainian state going crazier by day.
Of course Putin could have always
A. Not be stooge that he was for 20 years for American $$$/Western banking system, that enriched him personally
B. Not betray the people of South-Eastern Ukraine and treat them and their pleas in the same manner as he treated Crimea.
Since he didn't do any of it, by now he has nothing left to do, but to use "denazification" as the pretext for his belated punch back, which is coming a bit too late, as valid as it still is.
P.S. I hope this will give you enough of the "mental exercise" for the day, precisely as you were looking forward to it.
Don't forget what they say: every nation deserves their ruler, I mean the vast majority of people in eastern europe aren't exactly exceptionally smart and as a result they fall easily for the western traps: nato/eu. There's no question in my mind that a remarkable amount of retards exist in eastern europe who favour nato/eu and I'm sure the average supporter is neither smarter, nor richer, nor better in any way than me. Ukraine's government is the same - they see cheese in the mouse trap, they go for it.
Yes you can say that - it's a pretty good analogy.
Meh. Russia has nukes in the Kaliningrad exclave already, no one assumes otherwise.
egg-xactly
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
