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What scaring me is I see too much of this out there.. (the idea that we should go to war with Russia becasuse they are meanies) I am afraid our leaders might think these people are what we think.
I am not going down for your ignorance.
For my ignorance? What, pray tell, am I being ignorant about?
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Who said anything about go to war over Ukraine? A government there that cozies up to nazis...
I don't like the Russians either but if Putin wanted to destroy Ukraine, he is doing it all wrong. Russians are treading very, very slowly when they could move in with gusto if they wanted to. There is something else going on.
No, America First. Stay out.
Don't sanction either -- they're useless unless the goal is to destroy a people not a government.
Just because the Russian government is complicit in a new war does not mean we should be sanctioning Russian banks that serve the people there. Visa and Mastercard have been cut off and ordinary peoples' savings are being wiped out.
What purpose does this serve? It is the same idiotic policy we did with Iran, where instead of crippling the regime there we crippled the people. And it didn't even work, the mullahs are still in power 40 years later.
Ordinary civilians should not be used as political fodder.
What about the "evil" being showered upon Ukranian citizens?
The purpose of sanctions is to put pressure on the leaders by making the citizens miserable. If applied hard enough, they can and do work. They have not "worked" against Iran as they have not been universal and applied harshly enough.
The sanctions against Russia will not "work" either, as the US and NATO continue to buy Russian oil, the life blood of their economy. In the absence of cutting off oil purchases, the sanctions are just political theater in the absence of meaningful military help.
Well Sanctions are preferable to American boots on the ground and an acceleration towards all out war. Let's try to avoid WW3.
Of course the average citizen suffers with sanctions and that is the idea to turn the public against its leaders. The problem with the sanctions Biden put on is that we are going to suffer as much if not more than the Russian people.
Americans don't do well with inconvenience but Russians have had generations of practice living in hard times.
I don't know what Germany is going to do when Putin shuts off their energy that serves 70% of their country?
I don't know what the world is going to do when Putin occupies the major cities and Zelenskyy is killed or forced to run?
We might be able to avoid dead Americans but we are all going to be hit in the wallets for years to come.
I think Iran and North Korea are poor examples. The citizens there don't value or know about western life and lets be clear, they are pretty easily suppressed.
But Russia has had a 30 year taste.... and a history of revolution. This could be a place where either it would work for a new regime or the current regime would get a good talking to.. and they could change their minds... or at the very least go no further.
Americans are pretty easily suppressed too, many people believe whatever the media tells them. lol
Lets talk about all the horrific medical experiments done in the US over the past 40 yrs...in which the govt lied directly to the citizens about! Some of them being worse than what the Nazis did in WW2.
The ruble is near worthless. Inflationary pressure in Russia is now relentless as they have little purchasing power. The Russian central bank has raised rates to 20% from 9.5% in one day. The pressure is on.
Who said anything about go to war over Ukraine? A government there that cozies up to nazis...
I don't like the Russians either but if Putin wanted to destroy Ukraine, he is doing it all wrong. Russians are treading very, very slowly when they could move in with gusto if they wanted to. There is something else going on.
No, America First. Stay out.
Don't sanction either -- they're useless unless the goal is to destroy a people not a government.
No, while it’s true they don’t always, they do for the most part work. Mostly, just the threat of them is effective or a couple of weeks and the country just quietly does what is requested to cease them. Here are some of the more notable examples of effective uses:
1921: the League of Nations vs. Yugoslavia
Keep Yugoslavia out of Albania
1925: the League of Nations vs. Greece
Forced Greece to withdraw from Bulgaria
1948-1949: the United States vs. Netherlands
Forced the Netherlands to allow for Indonesia’s independence.
1958-1959: the U.S.S.R. vs. Finland
The USSR forced Karl-August Fagerholm to resign as prime minister of Finland. The sanctions cost 1.1.% of the Finnish GNP.
1961-1965: the United States vs. Ceylon (Sri Lanka)
Caused the fall of the socialist government of Sirimavo Bandaranaike after he expropriated the assets of U.S. and British oil companies. The sanctions cost 0.6% of the the country's GNP.
1965-1967: the United States vs. India
United States forced India to change its agricultural policies. The economic cost was 0.08% of the Indian GNP.
1975-1976: the United States vs. South Korea
The US stopped South Korea from buying a nuclear fuel reprocessing plant from France
1976-1977: the United States vs. Taiwan
Taiwan had started developing nukes, they stopped. The estimated economic cost was 0.1% of Taiwan's GNP.
1982-1986: South Africa vs. Lesotho
South African wanted refugees with links to the African National Congress returned. After a military coup in Lesotho, attributed to the sanctions, 60 ANC members were deported back home.
1987-1988: the United States vs. El Salvador
The United States used economic sanctions to block El Salvador from releasing those accused of killing U.S. citizens.
1992-1993: the United States vs. Malawi
The United States (and other nations) significantly cut aid in 1992 in a bid to improve the democratic standards and human rights situation in Malawi. A referendum resulted in a multi-party democracy
1993: the United States vs. Guatemala
President Jorge Serrano dissolved Congress. Business owners, scared of the economic effects, helped force Serrano out of power and installed a new president.
1994-1995: Greece vs. Albania
Greece got the release of political prisoners
__________________
When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
No, while it’s true they don’t always, they do for the most part work. Mostly, just the threat of them is effective or a couple of weeks and the country just quietly does what is requested to cease them. Here are some of the more notable examples of effective uses:
1921: the League of Nations vs. Yugoslavia
Keep Yugoslavia out of Albania
1925: the League of Nations vs. Greece
Forced Greece to withdraw from Bulgaria
1948-1949: the United States vs. Netherlands
Forced the Netherlands to allow for Indonesia’s independence.
1958-1959: the U.S.S.R. vs. Finland
The USSR forced Karl-August Fagerholm to resign as prime minister of Finland. The sanctions cost 1.1.% of the Finnish GNP.
1961-1965: the United States vs. Ceylon (Sri Lanka)
Caused the fall of the socialist government of Sirimavo Bandaranaike after he expropriated the assets of U.S. and British oil companies. The sanctions cost 0.6% of the the country's GNP.
1965-1967: the United States vs. India
United States forced India to change its agricultural policies. The economic cost was 0.08% of the Indian GNP.
1975-1976: the United States vs. South Korea
The US stopped South Korea from buying a nuclear fuel reprocessing plant from France
1976-1977: the United States vs. Taiwan
Taiwan had started developing nukes, they stopped. The estimated economic cost was 0.1% of Taiwan's GNP.
1982-1986: South Africa vs. Lesotho
South African wanted refugees with links to the African National Congress returned. After a military coup in Lesotho, attributed to the sanctions, 60 ANC members were deported back home.
1987-1988: the United States vs. El Salvador
The United States used economic sanctions to block El Salvador from releasing those accused of killing U.S. citizens.
1992-1993: the United States vs. Malawi
The United States (and other nations) significantly cut aid in 1992 in a bid to improve the democratic standards and human rights situation in Malawi. A referendum resulted in a multi-party democracy
1993: the United States vs. Guatemala
President Jorge Serrano dissolved Congress. Business owners, scared of the economic effects, helped force Serrano out of power and installed a new president.
1994-1995: Greece vs. Albania
Greece got the release of political prisoners
Now do for Iran -- the closest ancillary to Russia, albeit on a smaller, more regional scale.
You can't because the mullahs still own that country.
If sanctions haven't brought the Iranian regime down, what makes you think it will bring down the more powerful Russian one?
If anything, we're emboldening Putin to make more severe moves in Ukraine.
But they DO want to hurt the Russian people. The west has declared war on Russia, on the Russian people. Why else would they remove Russian singer from the Eurovision song contest? And kick out the Russian football players from FIFA? Olympic Committee has banned Russian athletes. Austria removed vodka from the stores.
What next? The symphony will remove Tchaikovsky from the program? I would not be surprised.
This is what western liberal culture has become. This is the cancellation and virtue signaling we're so familiar with.
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