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Old 05-21-2008, 12:51 AM
 
21,026 posts, read 22,146,264 times
Reputation: 5941

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Energy Victory by bestselling author Robert Zubrin

Check this out. Robert Zubrin has a book out explaining OPEC's plan to strangle the U.S. , bring us to our knees so the Arab world can take over....invade through economics. Also gives solutions. Haven't read it yet but will be getting it soon. Read a little about it and see what you think.....


Some comments:


"To win the war on terror, we need to remove the yoke of our oil dependence and cut the flow of petrodollars to regimes that spread radical Islam. Energy Victory is a bold, yet realistic plan to do just that. It is a vitally important book about the most critical issue we face today."
Dr. Gal Luft, Executive Director, Institute for the Analysis of Global Security

"In Energy Victory [Zubrin] lays out a compelling case for on the importance, and practicality, of winning the war on terror by making oil obsolete."
Professor Glenn Reynolds, Instapundit.com

"Robert Zubrin pulls no punches ... Don't miss this one."
James Woolsey, former Director, CIA

"Americans are buying ammunition for their enemies every time they buy gas. Energy security is the way out of this dilemma and Dr. Zubrin has a plan to achieve it."
Clifford D. May, President, Foundation for the Defense of Democracies

"...should command the attention of advocates, academics and policy-makers."
Louis Putterman, Professor of Economics, Brown University

 
Old 05-21-2008, 12:53 AM
 
Location: southern california
61,288 posts, read 87,405,055 times
Reputation: 55562
well we certainly seem to be playing along with the game don't we.
i dont think cheap oil is so cheap. whats a war cost these days.
 
Old 05-21-2008, 07:30 AM
 
21,026 posts, read 22,146,264 times
Reputation: 5941
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
well we certainly seem to be playing along with the game don't we.
i dont think cheap oil is so cheap. whats a war cost these days.

What's a war cost???? ...less than what we'll be paying for gas....read the book.
 
Old 05-21-2008, 07:34 AM
 
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,329 posts, read 54,373,658 times
Reputation: 40736
Quote:
Originally Posted by Who?Me?! View Post
What's a war cost???? ...less than what we'll be paying for gas....read the book.


How many $$$$ are you valuing lives lost and affected forever in making that cost comparison?

How do you price out:

Children growing up without a parent?

Wives living without their husbands?

Husbands living without their wives?

Parents living without their children?

Young people given a future of being handicapped for life?

How many $$$ do you allow for those things?
 
Old 05-21-2008, 07:48 AM
 
21,026 posts, read 22,146,264 times
Reputation: 5941
Quote:
Originally Posted by burdell View Post
How many $$$$ are you valuing lives lost and affected forever in making that cost comparison?

How do you price out:

Children growing up without a parent?

Wives living without their husbands?

Husbands living without their wives?

Parents living without their children?

Young people given a future of being handicapped for life?

How many $$$ do you allow for those things?

I'm not going to argue...your point is well taken but when members of OPEC take over the U.S. those things may not matter. I'd rather be dead than ruled by other countries.
 
Old 05-21-2008, 07:59 AM
 
21,026 posts, read 22,146,264 times
Reputation: 5941
From the OP book:

In this compelling argument for a new direction in US energy policy, world-renowned engineer and best-selling author Robert Zubrin lays out a bold plan for breaking the economic stranglehold that the OPEC oil cartel has on our country and the world. Zubrin presents persuasive evidence that our decades-long relationship with OPEC has resulted in the looting of our economy, the corruption of our political system, and now the funding and protection of terrorist regimes and movements that are committed to our destruction. Debunking the false solutions and myths that have deterred us from taking necessary action, Zubrin exposes the fakery that has allowed many politicians — including current US president George W. Bush — to posture that they are acting to resolve this problem while actually doing nothing significant toward that goal.
 
Old 05-21-2008, 08:11 AM
 
1,955 posts, read 5,266,641 times
Reputation: 1124
It looks like an interesting book in some ways, but having read the blurb on the link you pasted, I'm highly skeptical of some aspects.

More alcohol fueling cars will be much more negative than positive for the simple reasons that it will make food more expensive and electricity more expensive (producing ethanol requires tremendous amounts of electricity).

I think more practical steps would simply to bring SUVs and light trucks back into the fuel economy targets, drill for more oil at home, stop publicly funded new road construction that leads to more suburban sprawl and consequent gas consumption, and reign in general government spending in a way that causes the value of the dollar to strengthen.

The price of oil has so much to do with factors that are marginally related to oil, if at all.
 
Old 05-21-2008, 08:18 AM
 
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,329 posts, read 54,373,658 times
Reputation: 40736
Quote:
Originally Posted by Who?Me?! View Post
I'm not going to argue...your point is well taken but when members of OPEC take over the U.S. those things may not matter. I'd rather be dead than ruled by other countries.
I'm simply saying if people want to use cost as a measure of the value of a war it goes far beyond the realm of dollars and cents.

Last time I checked, OPEC wasn't a country.

I don't think we can blame OPEC, we had a big wake-up call with the shortages in the '70s and hit the snooze button.

But I've been thinking we would have been far better off to leave Saddam, who was no imminenyt threat, alone for a while and concentrate our efforts to ending OPEC's strangle hold on oil starting with not one penny of US aid snet to any OPEC member country along with trade restrictions and anything else we can do to disrupt life and business in OPEC member countries.
 
Old 05-21-2008, 08:24 AM
 
28,895 posts, read 54,147,443 times
Reputation: 46680
Wait a minute. OPEC isn't strangling us. We're strangling ourselves.

Tell you what. Answer these questions and see if you're complicit in the mortgaging of this country to pay a bunch of sheiks barely out of the Middle Ages.

1) Do you own an SUV?
2) Have you elected to live somewhere more than 5-10 miles from your place of employment?
3) Do you drive to the store even though it's less than a mile away?
4) Even funnier, do you drive to the track to run?
5) Do you not use public transit, even when it's available?
6) Do you run errands daily in your car?
7) Do you not carpool?
8) Do you oppose drilling for oil in the northwest slope of Alaska?

If you answered those questions yes, then you're part of the problem not the solution. In short, the way to deal with OPEC is by making lifestyle choices that make their product in less demand.
 
Old 05-21-2008, 08:37 AM
 
21,026 posts, read 22,146,264 times
Reputation: 5941
Quote:
Originally Posted by burdell View Post
I'm simply saying if people want to use cost as a measure of the value of a war it goes far beyond the realm of dollars and cents.

Last time I checked, OPEC wasn't a country.

I don't think we can blame OPEC, we had a big wake-up call with the shortages in the '70s and hit the snooze button.

But I've been thinking we would have been far better off to leave Saddam, who was no imminenyt threat, alone for a while and concentrate our efforts to ending OPEC's strangle hold on oil starting with not one penny of US aid snet to any OPEC member country along with trade restrictions and anything else we can do to disrupt life and business in OPEC member countries.
The author of the book does address Saddam...he says as long as he was waving his sword and shouting the Saudis were glad to have us in their country to protect them from Hussein...but once he was no longer a threat they didn't have to "play nice".....


OPEC isn't a country but that doesn't matter...OPEC controls the price of oil....most are Arab countries....thnk it through...if the U.S. goes to it's knees economically, those oil rich countries start(edited to add: They HAVE started) buying banks, land, businesses, media outlets....then who controls the U.S.??



The author explains why it isn't ethanol that's the solution or the problem...OPEC is the problem and alternate fuel like methanol is part of the answer.



""""cpg35223Wait a minute. OPEC isn't strangling us. We're strangling ourselves""""


The author agrees that we are aiding OPEC by not finding solutions....

1.OPEC can charge anything it wants for oil

2. We must find alternatives

3 Our oil "demand" has NOT increased that much as to cause the artificially high oil prices.
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