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Old 03-16-2022, 11:50 PM
 
1,052 posts, read 452,677 times
Reputation: 1635

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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyforger View Post
It would reduce dependence on Russia and the Saudis.
Solar, wind, evs....bring it on...
Does your idea of clean energy include something more dependable like next generation nuclear and geothermal?

If not, I have to question your grounding in reality (Hint: the sun doesn't always shine and the wind doesn't always bl*w)
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Old 03-17-2022, 02:32 AM
 
Location: California
37,135 posts, read 42,214,810 times
Reputation: 35013
I'm not against clean energy but I'm not buying an EV or putting solar panels on my room either. I'm such an enigma
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Old 03-17-2022, 04:58 AM
 
Location: Just over the horizon
18,461 posts, read 7,089,783 times
Reputation: 11702
Quote:
Originally Posted by remco67 View Post
I have never heard anyone say they were "against" clean energy. That is idiotic leftist talking point that if you are not for it you are against it and by definition Evil. Its just many think that we are not there yet technology/cost wise to make clean energy work instead of current methods. IF it did no government effort would be necessary to push it down our throats people would adept to it over time. Deliberately making oil/gas more expensive to drive people into EV's and Solar does not make it effective nor cost efficient. And people are not generally that stupid to understand that is exactly what progressives are doing. Heck we have heard them say so multiple times.


Yep, they do the same thing with practically every topic and issue.

All while claiming to not be authoritarians.
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Old 03-17-2022, 05:03 AM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,642 posts, read 26,378,527 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by saltine View Post
Is it really viable? C'mon man

The OP conveniently left out the most important part of the clean energy question.

Sure, everyone wants clean energy, but at what cost?
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Old 03-17-2022, 05:38 AM
 
543 posts, read 703,071 times
Reputation: 643
Ive been involved in renewable sources for years as a resident in a town that has infrastructure to distribute electricity because of a expired atomic plant. It took 10 years to permit 19 1.25 mw windmills. There are 5 dams on a good size river, and solar has been proposed for at least 10 years with many residents under contract to lease their land. All of these combined would only produce a fraction of the electricity the 60 year old nuke plant produced, and the elitist liberals faught and are fighting the construction of all this, because they don't want to look at the windmills and found a rare fern, while at the same time are all in with ev's. Luckily they were still living in NYC when the dams and nuke plant was built. Everyone's talking about all electric everything by 2050 but none are talking about generation. Average cost of electricity is up 9% since January, so how much will it cost if everything from heat, hot water, to cars and trucks are electric? Besides more nukes, hydro would be the the only generation to make everything electric by 2050. How many dams are under construction in the US? Upset the fish Or tidal generators ? The lobsters New nuke plants? Earthquakes Very few if any. The masses are ignorant, especially media producers.

Last edited by cvap; 03-17-2022 at 05:54 AM..
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Old 03-17-2022, 06:23 AM
 
Location: Just over the horizon
18,461 posts, read 7,089,783 times
Reputation: 11702
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics View Post
One of the best sources of renewable energy (and most efficient source) is HYDROPOWER.
Yet the "Greenies" have opposed new dams and sought the demolition of older dams.
In the mountainous areas, where high head dams make sense, we certainly could double if not triple our power generating capacity.

POWER GENERATION EFFICIENCY
OIL: 38%
COAL: 45%
NUCLEAR: 37%
Natural Gas: 57%
Hydroelectric: 90%

U.S. Utility scale electricity generation by source
https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=427&t=3
Total : 4,116 Billion kWh (4.1x10^15 Wh)
Fossil Fuels : 2,504 ; 60.8% of total
. . . Natural gas : 1,575; 38.3 %
. . . Coal : 899 ; 21.8%
. . . Petroleum : 19 ; 0.5 %
Nuclear : 778 ; 18.9%
Renewables : 826 ; 20.1%
. . . Wind : 380 ; 9.2%
. . . Hydropower : 260; 6.3% (260x10^12 Wh)
. . . Solar : 115; 2.8%
. . . Biomass : 55 : 1.3%
. . . Geothermal : 16; 0.4%

The Three Gorges Dam, in CHINA, has been the world's largest power station in terms of installed capacity (22,500 MW) since 2012. The dam generates an average 95±20 TWh of electricity per year.
95x10^12 Wh.

In contrast, the Grand Coulee Dam on Washington's Columbia River is the largest power plant by generation capacity in the United States, and the seventh-largest hydropower plant in the world. It typically supplies about 21 million megawatthours of electricity annually.
21x10^12 Wh.

TVA generated 15.84 billion kilowatt-hours with 29 small, high head dams in the Smoky mountains.
15.84 x 10^12 Wh.

We might assume that a TVA-like project for the Susquehanna River and its branches, could meet or exceed the output of the TVA.
Let's create a non-government authority to oversee the construction of dams to control flooding, improve navigation, and create cheap electric power in the Susquehanna Valley basin. And while we're at it, make it navigable from the Chesapeake Bay to upstate New York and perhaps to the Great Lakes.
//www.city-data.com/forum/great-debates/559876-dam-susquehanna-dammit.html



That region sure could use the boost to it's economy that such a project would bring too.
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Old 03-17-2022, 07:03 AM
 
Location: Free State of Florida
25,737 posts, read 12,815,111 times
Reputation: 19304
Why all the focus upon the USA, & none upon China's dirty polluting economy?

Why don't Greenies here boycott Chinese products? Force legislation that mandates huge stickers be placed on all Chinese products & their packaging so they are easier to spot?

That would be the most effective way to reduce humans carbon footprint.

Focusing upon the already quite clean USA is a massive waste of time & resources.

Fix the problem at its source/s...China & India would be great places to start.
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Old 03-17-2022, 07:17 AM
 
Location: Long Island
57,286 posts, read 26,206,502 times
Reputation: 15644
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics View Post
One of the best sources of renewable energy (and most efficient source) is HYDROPOWER.
Yet the "Greenies" have opposed new dams and sought the demolition of older dams.
In the mountainous areas, where high head dams make sense, we certainly could double if not triple our power generating capacity.

POWER GENERATION EFFICIENCY
OIL: 38%
COAL: 45%
NUCLEAR: 37%
Natural Gas: 57%
Hydroelectric: 90%

U.S. Utility scale electricity generation by source
https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=427&t=3
Total : 4,116 Billion kWh (4.1x10^15 Wh)
Fossil Fuels : 2,504 ; 60.8% of total
. . . Natural gas : 1,575; 38.3 %
. . . Coal : 899 ; 21.8%
. . . Petroleum : 19 ; 0.5 %
Nuclear : 778 ; 18.9%
Renewables : 826 ; 20.1%
. . . Wind : 380 ; 9.2%
. . . Hydropower : 260; 6.3% (260x10^12 Wh)
. . . Solar : 115; 2.8%
. . . Biomass : 55 : 1.3%
. . . Geothermal : 16; 0.4%

The Three Gorges Dam, in CHINA, has been the world's largest power station in terms of installed capacity (22,500 MW) since 2012. The dam generates an average 95±20 TWh of electricity per year.
95x10^12 Wh.

In contrast, the Grand Coulee Dam on Washington's Columbia River is the largest power plant by generation capacity in the United States, and the seventh-largest hydropower plant in the world. It typically supplies about 21 million megawatthours of electricity annually.
21x10^12 Wh.

TVA generated 15.84 billion kilowatt-hours with 29 small, high head dams in the Smoky mountains.
15.84 x 10^12 Wh.

We might assume that a TVA-like project for the Susquehanna River and its branches, could meet or exceed the output of the TVA.
Let's create a non-government authority to oversee the construction of dams to control flooding, improve navigation, and create cheap electric power in the Susquehanna Valley basin. And while we're at it, make it navigable from the Chesapeake Bay to upstate New York and perhaps to the Great Lakes.
//www.city-data.com/forum/great-debates/559876-dam-susquehanna-dammit.html
China doesn't care much about environmental factors, we already have many dams in the US and there are certainly downsides to putting a dam on every river as far as fisheries. I guess if your alright with the impact to salmon in places like Washington State we could add more dams.
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Old 03-17-2022, 07:22 AM
 
Location: Long Island
57,286 posts, read 26,206,502 times
Reputation: 15644
Quote:
Originally Posted by beach43ofus View Post
Why all the focus upon the USA, & none upon China's dirty polluting economy?

Why don't Greenies here boycott Chinese products? Force legislation that mandates huge stickers be placed on all Chinese products & their packaging so they are easier to spot?

That would be the most effective way to reduce humans carbon footprint.

Focusing upon the already quite clean USA is a massive waste of time & resources.

Fix the problem at its source/s...China & India would be great places to start.
The US is number one in the world in terms of per capita fossil fuel consumption 66,525 kWH,
China is 23,373 kWH. To think that we quite clean is pure fantasy.

We need to address our own consumption problems before we go pointing fingers.
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Old 03-17-2022, 08:28 AM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,028 posts, read 14,205,095 times
Reputation: 16747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post
China doesn't care much about environmental factors, we already have many dams in the US and there are certainly downsides to putting a dam on every river as far as fisheries. I guess if your alright with the impact to salmon in places like Washington State we could add more dams.
There is no bar to installing fish ladders and other means to allow fish to deal with dams. In the past, engineers weren't asked to incorporate them into the design.

https://oceanservice.noaa.gov/facts/fish-ladder.html

https://theconstructor.org/water-res...ishways/33911/
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