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The pension should be a non starter. It's pensions that have forced union companies to file bankruptcy or go out of business. A pension is nothing more than a ponzi scheme. You can't keep paying people for not working the rest of their lives. The math does not add up, which is why so many union companies are bankrupt or shut down.
They should just have a 401k like most other companies.
It's more complicated than that and my father has been collecting his pension for over 20 years now with no hitch from a private company.
It's a VERY complicated issue and pensions are not necessarily the reason companies have failed, there are a variety of factors. It's absolutely not a ponzi scheme, there is a future value accrual so stop using that term if you want to be taken seriously.
Keep in mind that I'm generally against pensions and favor 401k's, I just happen to REALLY know the math and finance behind such transactions and am telling you that your comments are way off.
P.S. In general PUBLIC pensions are pay-go and not accrued, but even still that is not the same thing as a ponzi scheme. There is plenty to dislike about various pensions systems without having to incorrectly ascribe them as ponzi schemes. I could direct you to a few hundred pages of educational materials on the topic if you like.
Each person/employee is their own business with their own overhead. A business should do what is best for themselves. Why should these people accept less? So JimRom could get a blender for a few bucks less?
Listen to the language being used in this thread "Cancer", "Unskilled".....It is actually very revealing in a disappointing way. These people are our neighbors, when these people do better we are all better off because of it. The extra income will be spent locally and help their communities.
JimRom, despite his genius in business doesn't understand that Unionized workers have more buying power. Yes, blenders cost a little more but there are more people who can afford to purchase blenders. Furthermore, increased buying power in the working class increases the velocity of money. In essence, the dollar turns over more often in local economies. Partly because there are more people circulating more money and partly because the working class tends to spend more of their income on goods and services.
There are a lot of things that are troublesome about unions but the fact is that having a significant amount of unionized workers was a big reason why the '50s and '60s economy allowed upward mobility to the middle and lower middle classes.
There are a lot of things that are troublesome about unions but the fact is that having a significant amount of unionized workers was a big reason why the '50s and '60s economy allowed upward mobility to the middle and lower middle classes.
The 50s and 60s were an anomaly, and unions just rode the wave.
Europe and Japan had a multi decade rebuild to do post WWII; the uniform shipping container was not invented making the receipt of goods from overseas not realistic as a routine way to do business. Add in, women were not competing for 95% of union jobs in the 50s and 60s, and automation was Stone age level. Plus, of course, the male available to work US population was lower than usual due to lives lost, plus limbs lost, in WWII.
The employees voted how they wanted. Good for them. I just hope they are prepared and understand what they voted for. Nor more quick advancement if you are better than others. No more dropping the dead beat workers. You will be working hard and your neighbor will not be, but they get just as much as you do. Monthly union dues. No going in to your boss and discussing career advancement or changes within the company. This will all be dictated to them. Amazon could decide to pull out and move to a right to work state. Potentially higher wages for some, potentially better working conditions. Good luck.
But much of the same went on at the non-unionized places I worked at. One deadbeat worker told me I did too much!
The union would drag them out in an alley and break their legs.
Lol, vote the union out in NY.
You have an extremely high partisan optimism about how unions work in real life.
Really, you sound a whole lot like the horse in Animal Farm.
I have no idea what you're talking about, since my state was never able to attract much big business, hard core industry or manufacturing.
Furthermore, I was a union member for 25 years and can't relate to what you're talking about from that perspective, either. Getting a unionized job was the best thing I ever did for the betterment of my life. Not very many jobs in my small rural town paid better or had better benefits.
Last edited by StillwaterTownie; 04-03-2022 at 01:11 AM..
Amazon has an amazing quantity of distribution centers. That provides them an amazing amount of alternatives.
Time will tell how they react. Wal Mart has closed stores where even one department unionized. They also outsourced all meat-packing when one store's staff for that unionized.
I would bet Amazon is already forming a long-term strategy on how to act in response to this decision.
The media, meanwhile, will again fail to do what they should. Circle back on all involved in 2 years with a follow up story.(I also viewed media as failures for not following up with some of the Hostess strikers they interviewed 2 years later, to see if life was better or worse for them.)
Maybe this will work out ok for the staff, maybe not. Media will not follow up, so we will not know.
JimRom, despite his genius in business doesn't understand that Unionized workers have more buying power. Yes, blenders cost a little more but there are more people who can afford to purchase blenders. Furthermore, increased buying power in the working class increases the velocity of money. In essence, the dollar turns over more often in local economies. Partly because there are more people circulating more money and partly because the working class tends to spend more of their income on goods and services.
There are a lot of things that are troublesome about unions but the fact is that having a significant amount of unionized workers was a big reason why the '50s and '60s economy allowed upward mobility to the middle and lower middle classes.
Actually, I didn’t mention the buying power of union workers. What I said was that if the union permeated Amazon facilities the prices would go up for consumers.
And no, the unions of the 50s and 60s weren’t a major factor in upward mobility. The major push of upward mobility in that era was the fact that the United States was the only major economic force which didn’t have its manufacturing facilities flattened during WW2. Without unions, we would have still been well off because we were the only nation which still had an infrastructure.
More than 50% of AMZ sales are for third parties/ small businesses that use AMZ to advertise, facilitate and in some cases, fulfill orders.
Third party sellers set their own prices, not AMZ.
Consumers increasingly prefer to shop online rather than brick and mortar. Small businesses can reach the world instead of being limited to local traffic and they can do so without the overhead associated with a physical presence.
When Amazon increases their cost to the vendors it will be passed on to the customers.
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