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People are buying crossovers and SUV's and virtually no one is buying cars like the Mustang anymore, car makers have to adjust or die, Ford adjusted and dropped all of their cars except the Mustang that has a small niche market. Tesla Model 3 Performance will run circles around the Mustang anyway.
Why are EV nutswingers so misinformed? Stats from Car and Driver:
0-60:
2022 Model 3 Performance: 3.1
2022 Shelby GT500: 3.4
0-100
Model 3: 8.2
GT500: 6.9
1/4 Mile ET
Model 3: 11.6
GT500: 11.3
1/4 Mile Trap Speed
Model 3: 115
GT500: 132
Thanks to AWD, the Model 3 is a little quicker to 60 mph, then it gets ugly quickly. The Tesla's 0-60 advantage is gone by 100 mph, when it is 1.3 seconds behind, losing 1.6 seconds in a very short time frame. By the end of the 1/4 mile, the Model is going 17 mph slower than the GT500. That's huge.
Why are EV nutswingers so misinformed? Stats from Car and Driver:
0-60:
2022 Model 3 Performance: 3.1
2022 Shelby GT500: 3.4
0-100
Model 3: 8.2
GT500: 6.9
1/4 Mile ET
Model 3: 11.6
GT500: 11.3
1/4 Mile Trap Speed
Model 3: 115
GT500: 132
Thanks to AWD, the Model 3 is a little quicker to 60 mph, then it gets ugly quickly. The Tesla's 0-60 advantage is gone by 100 mph, when it is 1.3 seconds behind, losing 1.6 seconds in a very short time frame. By the end of the 1/4 mile, the Model is going 17 mph slower than the GT500. That's huge.
Not mention around a track something so heavy and tall like an EV would get smoked, and they have troubles with the engines getting too hot when driven hard.
Simply put, EV's ARE NOT good performance vehicles. They have good low end torque but are not optimized for hard driving, they don't have manual transmissions so road course performance won't be as good, they are not really aerodynamic, etc.
They weigh 500-1000lbs more than their gas counterparts! That's not productive for performance! They also must constantly be topped off on their charge if you want to go fast. As the charge decreases, so does the performance.
They are made for ECONOMY DRIVING and to save us from "environmental doom," not for no-compromise performance.
Why are EV nutswingers so misinformed? Stats from Car and Driver:
0-60:
2022 Model 3 Performance: 3.1
2022 Shelby GT500: 3.4
0-100
Model 3: 8.2
GT500: 6.9
1/4 Mile ET
Model 3: 11.6
GT500: 11.3
1/4 Mile Trap Speed
Model 3: 115
GT500: 132
Thanks to AWD, the Model 3 is a little quicker to 60 mph, then it gets ugly quickly. The Tesla's 0-60 advantage is gone by 100 mph, when it is 1.3 seconds behind, losing 1.6 seconds in a very short time frame. By the end of the 1/4 mile, the Model is going 17 mph slower than the GT500. That's huge.
You're comparing a car that starts at $80K to a car that starts under $60K. That's like comparing the GT500 to a Model S Plaid, of course the Gt500 is a slug in comparison.
Actually what I'm talking about is real world street performance when instantaneous acceleration wins the day, for that use case which is 99% of the time, Teslas are much quicker than any ICE vehicle. My Tesla is much quicker in my daily driving than my Hellcat was. The only driving I've ever done where the Hellcat would have been faster is on the autobahn in Germany.
Not mention around a track something so heavy and tall like an EV would get smoked, and they have troubles with the engines getting too hot when driven hard.
Simply put, EV's ARE NOT good performance vehicles. They have good low end torque but are not optimized for hard driving, they don't have manual transmissions so road course performance won't be as good, they are not really aerodynamic, etc.
They weigh 500-1000lbs more than their gas counterparts! That's not productive for performance! They also must constantly be topped off on their charge if you want to go fast. As the charge decreases, so does the performance.
They are made for ECONOMY DRIVING and to save us from "environmental doom," not for no-compromise performance.
If I were going to buy a car for the track, sure ICE vehicles are better but not many people have the desire and means to buy a car for track use. You're wrong about people not buying Teslas for performance, virtually everyone I know that has a Tesla (self included) bought it to some degree because of its performance capability.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Even with the Model 3, performance is just not the same without the roar and rumble of a gas engine. Silence is for self-driving cars, or taking an Uber. For those of us that like driving, the sound is a big percentage of the enjoyment. The US performance/aftermarket exhaust industry is expected to be $22 billion in 2022 per FAct.mr -If you don't need that, then go ahead and buy a silent EV.
You're comparing a car that starts at $80K to a car that starts under $60K. That's like comparing the GT500 to a Model S Plaid, of course the Gt500 is a slug in comparison.
Actually what I'm talking about is real world street performance when instantaneous acceleration wins the day, for that use case which is 99% of the time, Teslas are much quicker than any ICE vehicle. My Tesla is much quicker in my daily driving than my Hellcat was. The only driving I've ever done where the Hellcat would have been faster is on the autobahn in Germany.
The "Tesla Model S Plaid" weighs FOUR THOUSAND EIGHT HUNDRED TWENTY EIGHT pounds.
That's simply a non starter for a performance car. It's a joke. It weighs as much as a RAM 1500. For comparison a C6 corvette weighs a hair over 3,100 lbs.
Here's Car and Driver's less than stellar synopsis of this massive boat, hindered by it's Elephant-like weight (and it still can only get 275 miles of range!):
"Now it's time for your regular reminder that there's more to the driving experience than numbers, a drum we beat regularly when we explain why a clear objective champ didn't win a comparison test. The Plaid is a zombie at the limit, with nothing coming up through the two girthy grips at the end of the steering yoke. Getting that staggering skidpad number took far more runs than is typical because of the car's unpredictability. Turning right, it would walk itself into oversteer, which would then result in a heavy-handed smackdown from the stability control. Tesla touts that the Plaid's dual rear motors enable torque vectoring, but there's none to be had near the limit because of the undefeatable safety net."
The "Tesla Model S Plaid" weighs FOUR THOUSAND EIGHT HUNDRED TWENTY EIGHT pounds.
That's simply a non starter for a performance car. It's a joke. It weighs as much as a RAM 1500. For comparison a C6 corvette weighs a hair over 3,100 lbs.
Here's Car and Driver's less than stellar synopsis of this massive boat, hindered by it's Elephant-like weight (and it still can only get 275 miles of range!):
"Now it's time for your regular reminder that there's more to the driving experience than numbers, a drum we beat regularly when we explain why a clear objective champ didn't win a comparison test. The Plaid is a zombie at the limit, with nothing coming up through the two girthy grips at the end of the steering yoke. Getting that staggering skidpad number took far more runs than is typical because of the car's unpredictability. Turning right, it would walk itself into oversteer, which would then result in a heavy-handed smackdown from the stability control. Tesla touts that the Plaid's dual rear motors enable torque vectoring, but there's none to be had near the limit because of the undefeatable safety net."
The Plaid hitting 1.08 on the skid pad and 9.23 in the quarter mile would qualify as high performance, certainly the highest performing sedan in history. It's not a sports car but it's faster than them.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
44,576 posts, read 81,167,557 times
Reputation: 57808
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler
The Plaid hitting 1.08 on the skid pad and 9.23 in the quarter mile would qualify as high performance, certainly the highest performing sedan in history. It's not a sports car but it's faster than them.
Without hacking the computers, neither a Tesla nor any other EV can do a burnout. To me that's a key component of the high performance/muscle car.
Without hacking the computers, neither a Tesla nor any other EV can do a burnout. To me that's a key component of the high performance/muscle car.
The end user can't even separate the transmission from the engine which is the purpose of a manual transmission. You can't rev the engine independently of the transmission and then apply that to the wheels at the desired time.
This car is a giant black box that weighs as much as a elephant that people who like to push a button and have the car do everything for them would like.
It's not a car for a performance enthusiast or a driving enthusiast. It's like an Apple Watch vs. a Rolex.
The Plaid hitting 1.08 on the skid pad and 9.23 in the quarter mile would qualify as high performance, certainly the highest performing sedan in history. It's not a sports car but it's faster than them.
The Plaid is dangerously unstable at higher speeds. Numbers alone do not make a sports car. If you were an actual auto enthusiast, you would know this.
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