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Old 06-25-2022, 04:55 PM
JL
 
8,515 posts, read 14,458,648 times
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I just hope my state of Texas ,specifically my city, doesn't get hit with a hurricane. Biden might unleash his revenge on the abortion laws here by giving out limited fema $ . He might think less federal intervention is what texans wanted.

 
Old 06-25-2022, 05:03 PM
 
Location: Native of Any Beach/FL
35,329 posts, read 20,692,861 times
Reputation: 14102
To answer my own question,
Data from both the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and the Guttmacher Institute on total abortions and late-term abortions suggests that approximately 1.1 to 1.3% of abortions are carried out at 21 weeks of gestation and later.

https://lozierinstitute.org/question...term-abortion/

I have no problem except for health to stop at 21 weeks. Most states have limits. New Mexico does not. I am not pro abortion. I want Drs stopped at 21 weeks. Just like all those terrible disfiguring plastic surgeries. There has got to be a cut off regardless of what the person wants. But Texas rather have a neighbor rat out a mom than hold the Dr responsible. I don’t get that.
 
Old 06-25-2022, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Native of Any Beach/FL
35,329 posts, read 20,692,861 times
Reputation: 14102
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL View Post
I just hope my state of Texas ,specifically my city, doesn't get hit with a hurricane. Biden might unleash his revenge on the abortion laws here by giving out limited fema $ . He might think less federal intervention is what texans wanted.
DeSantis in Fl has the personal feud going on. Think abbot is doing his crazy -stuff but not really fighting w Biden.
There’s a blob headed to the Caribbean area by next week
 
Old 06-25-2022, 06:10 PM
 
Location: Arizona
5,998 posts, read 2,592,075 times
Reputation: 5688
Quote:
Originally Posted by beach43ofus View Post
Aside from rape, incest, Mother's health issues, the whole Roe v Wade reversal is just about women (or men) having to use birth control or contraceptives now. Is that such a uge deal? That is what the vast majority of Americans do anyways.

I get that these measures are not 100% effective, & only ~99% effective, so in some of those cases, women many have to travel.

Why not just take the morning after pill each time?
Some of these states now have a total ban on it and not any exceptions.
 
Old 06-25-2022, 06:12 PM
 
25,403 posts, read 9,678,321 times
Reputation: 15224
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goofball86 View Post
Some of these states now have a total ban on it and not any exceptions.
Then let them foot the bill for babies who are born with birth defects or for those families who cannot financial care for their children. Because you can be sure of one thing. Banning abortion will not stop people from having babies.
 
Old 06-25-2022, 06:12 PM
 
Location: lake zurich, il
3,197 posts, read 2,840,170 times
Reputation: 1217
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerZ View Post
Reminder: here is the topic. It is about children that will be born, not embryos that will be aborted. Thanks!

In states that want to ban abortion entirely:

1. Who will pay for prenatal care if the mother can't afford it? (For example, Texas leads the nation in teen pregnancies.)

2. How will states deal with an increase in babies the parents can't afford? How will social programs to feed these babies be expanded?

3. Will state-funded DNA testing be automatically enacted to confirm paternity? How will paternity tests be bodily forced upon accused fathers?

4. Will stiffer penalties, including prison, be enforced against fathers who refuse to pay child support? Will the mothers be represented pro bono if they can't afford attorneys to ensure this happens?

5. Will rape charges be brought by the state if the girl is underage and the man isn't?
At the moment reading through this thread no one has actually answered all of these questions straight up. I will. The only thing I ask is for you to answer these questions as well, but assume the state hasn't banned abortion. To questions that assume there will be an increase in babies parents can't afford, just answer the question generally "How do/will states deal with babies parents can't afford? How will social programs feed these babies?"

1. The mother. The father. The mother's parents, sisters, brothers, uncles, aunts, friends, whoever. Doesn't really matter who does so. As long as someone does so. Otherwise debt collectors will probably come knocking. I personally think hospitals are way to expensive sometimes, would like to see that changed. Hopefully the hospital can provide the patient with a payment plan that suits their lifestyle.

2. Is it the responsibility of the states to provide the livelihood to babies who parents can't afford? Probably. If a mother or father cannot maintain a health environment for the child to grow up in they shouldn't be allowed to keep the child. The state should take the child in. The foster system I know isn't fantastic in this country. It should definitely be reformed. I believe adopting a child shouldn't take as long as it does or cost as much as it does. I know many people who would adopt in a heart beat but the process of adopting deters them. Hopefully though it won't come to parents having their children taken away. Pregnancy support centers can help new parents. Food pantries are a thing that should be support by anyone who cares about hungry children in this country. Social programs will still exist, they don't have to be expanded, but just funded more heavily possibly. There is an incredible amount of corruption in many states in this country (I'd be willing to bet in all states) so nixing that can definitely go towards helping social programs. What else? Family, community, friends can all help support families in need. That is what people in this country should rely on in the first place, not big government which is prone to waste and corruption. I know personal responsibility is frowned upon in these discussions but that should also be looked at. If the parent's aren't working, why not? Anyone can get a job at McDonalds. Not fancy but it'll help as well.

3. I don't think so. If the mother wishes to prove paternity she can petition the courts for a DNA test of the suspected father. If the father refuses he can be fined heavily, and face criminal charges (throw the book at em, I don't care, screw dead-beat dads and moms). The person going to get the DNA test should pay for it...or the mother, I don't know, doesn't really matter. It looks like Walgreens might be selling one for $19.19.

4. First part of this question, sure. As I said, throw the book at them. Second part of the question: that depends on the lawyer. Lawyers deserve to be paid. I propose the losing party should have to pay the legal fees of the winning party in this case. I think this already happens in some instances.

5. Isn't this already the case in most (all?) states? Statutory rape is already a thing. I'm totally fine with it as a law (it gets stupid at times if parents want to prosecute an 18 year old boyfriend that had sex with his 17 year old girlfriend, who is about to turn 18 in 3 weeks, when the couple had no issue with it but the parents want to cause trouble or something...whatever. It is a good law.).
 
Old 06-25-2022, 06:57 PM
 
30,907 posts, read 32,842,615 times
Reputation: 26919
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohKnip View Post
At the moment reading through this thread no one has actually answered all of these questions straight up. I will. The only thing I ask is for you to answer these questions as well, but assume the state hasn't banned abortion. To questions that assume there will be an increase in babies parents can't afford, just answer the question generally "How do/will states deal with babies parents can't afford? How will social programs feed these babies?"

1. The mother. The father. The mother's parents, sisters, brothers, uncles, aunts, friends, whoever. Doesn't really matter who does so. As long as someone does so. Otherwise debt collectors will probably come knocking. I personally think hospitals are way to expensive sometimes, would like to see that changed. Hopefully the hospital can provide the patient with a payment plan that suits their lifestyle.

2. Is it the responsibility of the states to provide the livelihood to babies who parents can't afford? Probably. If a mother or father cannot maintain a health environment for the child to grow up in they shouldn't be allowed to keep the child. The state should take the child in. The foster system I know isn't fantastic in this country. It should definitely be reformed. I believe adopting a child shouldn't take as long as it does or cost as much as it does. I know many people who would adopt in a heart beat but the process of adopting deters them. Hopefully though it won't come to parents having their children taken away. Pregnancy support centers can help new parents. Food pantries are a thing that should be support by anyone who cares about hungry children in this country. Social programs will still exist, they don't have to be expanded, but just funded more heavily possibly. There is an incredible amount of corruption in many states in this country (I'd be willing to bet in all states) so nixing that can definitely go towards helping social programs. What else? Family, community, friends can all help support families in need. That is what people in this country should rely on in the first place, not big government which is prone to waste and corruption. I know personal responsibility is frowned upon in these discussions but that should also be looked at. If the parent's aren't working, why not? Anyone can get a job at McDonalds. Not fancy but it'll help as well.

3. I don't think so. If the mother wishes to prove paternity she can petition the courts for a DNA test of the suspected father. If the father refuses he can be fined heavily, and face criminal charges (throw the book at em, I don't care, screw dead-beat dads and moms). The person going to get the DNA test should pay for it...or the mother, I don't know, doesn't really matter. It looks like Walgreens might be selling one for $19.19.

4. First part of this question, sure. As I said, throw the book at them. Second part of the question: that depends on the lawyer. Lawyers deserve to be paid. I propose the losing party should have to pay the legal fees of the winning party in this case. I think this already happens in some instances.

5. Isn't this already the case in most (all?) states? Statutory rape is already a thing. I'm totally fine with it as a law (it gets stupid at times if parents want to prosecute an 18 year old boyfriend that had sex with his 17 year old girlfriend, who is about to turn 18 in 3 weeks, when the couple had no issue with it but the parents want to cause trouble or something...whatever. It is a good law.).
Thank you for answering my questions!

Re: #1...49% of women seeking abortion are below the poverty line. The bill collectors can knock all they want, the money is not there. But the children need to eat so now what?

#3: same problem as #1. Poverty. Or they're teens, or whatever.

I 100% agree that adoption should be faster and not as expensive.

I appreciate your taking the time. Thanks again.
 
Old 06-25-2022, 07:12 PM
 
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,008 posts, read 16,824,160 times
Reputation: 15357
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL View Post
I just hope my state of Texas ,specifically my city, doesn't get hit with a hurricane. Biden might unleash his revenge on the abortion laws here by giving out limited fema $ . He might think less federal intervention is what texans wanted.
If you listen to the rhetoric that comes out of your Governors mouth people would think exactly that. Of course the current President is not a thin skinned 5 year old like his predecessor and I doubt Federal Assistance would be withheld after a hurricane.
 
Old 06-25-2022, 07:36 PM
 
25,403 posts, read 9,678,321 times
Reputation: 15224
Quote:
Originally Posted by VA Yankee View Post
If you listen to the rhetoric that comes out of your Governors mouth people would think exactly that. Of course the current President is not a thin skinned 5 year old like his predecessor and I doubt Federal Assistance would be withheld after a hurricane.
As much as I would like the federal government to withhold funds, I know it would only hurt those who need it most. *Sigh*
 
Old 06-25-2022, 08:23 PM
 
Location: California
37,042 posts, read 41,967,329 times
Reputation: 34835
I disagree that changing laws won't change behaviors and think if there were NO abortions allows we'd have plenty of behavior changes. We just think they won't change because we're used to having all our mistakes cleaned up with no muss no fuss and no questions asked. We've become lazy and why not? It's easy! Sure, not everyone is going to come out the other end any wiser, but there's always going to be people who don't have the capacity to or the willingness to be responsible for themselves. Overall people will change though, people will adapt. Look how well we adapted to be locked up for a year. I also think that if people regularly got locked up for years, or shot and killed while shoplifting or breaking into cars there would be far less shoplifting and breaking into cars. Sacrificing the few changes the behavior of the many and make society better in the process. Fear is a great motivator...like heads on a pike.

Yeah I'm being extreme, but I'm not wrong either.
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