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View Poll Results: Do women need to take more responsiblity for their sexual health?
Yes 192 75.29%
No 59 23.14%
Not Sure 4 1.57%
Voters: 255. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-16-2022, 07:49 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,505 posts, read 44,230,479 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
This is just another example of how the abortion debate is about judgement of the woman and NOT about the life of the fetus. You are making it about responsibility and innocence. But the argument that a fetus is the same as a born baby, independent of its mother and to abort is equivalent to murder is thrown out the window when you disregard the innocence of the fetus in favor of the innocence of the mother in cases of rape. That fetus is no different than the fetus of a harlot.

The only one who can determine and judge the physical and mental health and trauma any woman goes through with an unwanted pregnancy (forced rape, date rape, statutory rape, incest, consensual sex, lack of BC, using BC, married, unmarried) is the pregnant woman and her doctor. Otherwise, it is nothing more than self-righteousness.
It's hard to argue or believe that a pregnancy is unwanted when a woman doesn't even bother to use birth control or at least make sure her male partner uses it when willingly participating in male/female sex.

 
Old 08-16-2022, 07:58 AM
 
35,911 posts, read 30,458,873 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell View Post
That may be true, but comparing a parasite to the unborn offspring of the homo sapiens is very unscientific.

The fetus is a parasite, abortion is like plucking out a hair: how much does Jerry Coyne really know about biology?



All animals kill their young, but the human animal is the only one in the animal kingdom that will attempt to justify it, using some ridiculous means.
Are we being held to be scientific? How about calling an embryo a baby or abortion, murder?
The only reason calling a fetus a parasite is not scientific is because no biologist has yet put a name to that particular form of parasitism.

Quote:
The notion that the embryo/fetus is some sort of parasite was decisively refuted forty years ago in an article titled, Why the Embryo or Fetus is Not a Parasite by Dr. Thomas L. Johnson, Professor Emeritus of Biological Sciences, Mary Washington College, Fredericksburg, Virginia. Professor Johnson has identified no less than eight significant differences between an embryo/fetus and a parasite.

1. a) A parasite is defined as an organism of one species living in or on an organism of another species (a heterospecific relationship) and deriving its nourishment from the host…
b) A human embryo or fetus is an organism of one species (Homo sapiens) living in the uterine cavity of an organism of the same species (Homo sapiens) and deriving its nourishment from the mother…
c) Brood parasitism refers to intraspecies (there are different types of parasitism). Deriving its nourishment form the mother is deriving its nourishment from the host.
2. a) A parasite is an invading organism — coming to parasitize the host from an outside source.
b) A human embryo or fetus is formed from a fertilized egg — the egg coming from an inside source, being formed in the ovary of the mother…
c) An embryo is not an embryo without being fertilized from an outside source, sperm.



3. a) A parasite is generally harmful to some degree to the host that is harboring the parasite.
b) A human embryo or fetus developing in the uterine cavity does not usually cause harm to the mother…
c) Not usually? A fetus is to some degree harmful to the host. It can be slight to fatal. A tick is an ectoparisite and usually causes no harm to the host.

7. a) A parasite is generally detrimental to the reproductive capacity of the invaded host. The host may be weakened, diseased or killed by the parasite, thus reducing or eliminating the host’s capacity to reproduce.
b) A human embryo or fetus is absolutely essential to the reproductive capacity of the involved mother (and species). The mother is usually not weakened, diseased or killed by the presence of the embryo or fetus…
c) WTF
8. a) A parasite is an organism that, once it invades the definitive host, will usually remain with host for life (as long as it or the host survives).
b) A human embryo or fetus has a temporary association with the mother, remaining only a number of months in the uterus.
c) again, WTF
You might want to read some biology books instead of gleaning your knowledge from an article, an article, by one professor from the university of Mary Washington.
 
Old 08-16-2022, 08:01 AM
 
21,382 posts, read 7,840,903 times
Reputation: 18148
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
Are we being held to be scientific? How about calling an embryo a baby or abortion, murder?
The only reason calling a fetus a parasite is not scientific is because no biologist has yet put a name to that particular form of parasitism.



You might want to read some biology books instead of gleaning your knowledge from an article, an article, by one professor from the university of Mary Washington.
We can all just agree to call them humans. Which is what they are.

Humans have long development, beginning in the womb, and continuing after they are born.

If one were to compare a picture of a baby who was just born to a picture of an 85-year-old terminally ill person, would you say that they look alike? Or do they look very different?
 
Old 08-16-2022, 08:04 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,505 posts, read 44,230,479 times
Reputation: 13496
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice View Post
We can all just agree to call them humans. Which is what they are.

Humans have long development, beginning in the womb, and continuing after they are born.

If one were to compare a picture of a baby who was just born to a picture of an 85-year-old terminally ill person, would you say that they look alike? Or do they look very different?
Exactly. ALL are various stages of the human life cycle. Abortion kills a human life. There's just no way getting around that scientific or legal fact (murder convictions and prison sentences for those who kill children in utero).
 
Old 08-16-2022, 08:44 AM
 
Location: Retired in VT; previously MD & NJ
14,277 posts, read 6,865,818 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veuvegirl View Post
This is a Christian belief, life beginning at conception. Christianity is imposing its beliefs on all women.

My body. My choice. My belief.
Exactly.
 
Old 08-16-2022, 08:47 AM
 
21,382 posts, read 7,840,903 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ansible90 View Post
Exactly.
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politic...ception-n67202

Study: 95 Percent of Biologists Say Life Begins at Conception

Jacobs compiled a sample of 5,502 biologists from 1,058 academic institutions (he reached out to 62,469 biologists and 7,383 participated in the survey, but only 5,502 answered the pertinent questions). The biologists predominantly identified as non-religious (63 percent), liberal (89 percent and 11 percent conservative), Democratic (92 percent), and pro-choice (85 percent, only 15 were pro-life). The sample included biologists who were born in 86 countries around the world.

A broad consensus of those biologists affirmed each of three statements representing the view that “a human’s life begins at fertilization” (75 percent-91 percent). Overall, 95 percent affirmed the view that human life begins at conception.



I guess it's not a Christian view. Huh.

SCIENCE!
 
Old 08-16-2022, 08:47 AM
 
Location: Retired in VT; previously MD & NJ
14,277 posts, read 6,865,818 times
Reputation: 17870
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice View Post
That's what I am. Pro choice but NOT pro abortion.

Abstinence
Motherhood
BC
Adoption
Pro life but NOT pro abortion

I'm pro choice right? Would fit right in with all the protesters at pro choice rallies, waving my pro life sign? Nah. Why? Because I am NOT pro abortion.

Pro choice = pro abortion.
The twisting of common expressions is really getting old and tiresome.
 
Old 08-16-2022, 08:48 AM
 
Location: Retired in VT; previously MD & NJ
14,277 posts, read 6,865,818 times
Reputation: 17870
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice View Post
What's the question?

Your post is so convoluted with insults and snark, hyperbole and hysteria I have no idea what you are talking about.
Read slowly.
 
Old 08-16-2022, 08:50 AM
 
21,382 posts, read 7,840,903 times
Reputation: 18148
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Exactly. ALL are various stages of the human life cycle. Abortion kills a human life. There's just no way getting around that scientific or legal fact (murder convictions and prison sentences for those who kill children in utero).
I would like to know what public schools people went to who don't believe that humans are alive and developing in the womb.

What were they taught as to what happens in utero when a woman is pregnant?

Do they think the human magically pops out fully formed at birth? BAM! That it is dead tissue until it leaves the birth canal?

I can't figure it out. Do they not believe in science at all?
 
Old 08-16-2022, 08:51 AM
 
21,382 posts, read 7,840,903 times
Reputation: 18148
Quote:
Originally Posted by ansible90 View Post
The twisting of common expressions is really getting old and tiresome.
I agree.

Abortion kills humans.

What is your definition of human?
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