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View Poll Results: I support the right to choose
Only for abortion 4 4.40%
Only for vaccines 10 10.99%
For both vaccines and abortion 15 16.48%
For all things, including drugs and prostitution. 62 68.13%
Voters: 91. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-09-2022, 10:46 AM
 
50,730 posts, read 36,431,973 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
You shared your support of vaccine mandates.
Where did I say I support them? All I said is they existed before Covid and no one cared.
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Old 07-09-2022, 10:47 AM
 
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Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
Where did I say I support them? All I said is they existed before Covid and no one cared.
A lot of people cared. There have always been people against vaccine mandates
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Old 07-09-2022, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Cleveland
4,649 posts, read 4,970,942 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
It’s hardly the first vaccine that employers have mandated throughout history though. When I went to OT school, I had to have measles mumps rubella administered again even though I had it when I was a kid. If I didn’t get it, I would not have been admitted. The military has also required vaccinations long before Covid. But I don’t remember all these people being up in arms about it, because those other vaccines have not been so politicized.
The reason people are up in arms is because those vaccines suppress the level of a pathogen to the point where it does not spread, and this one does not. Read it again if you have to. That's the reason. Period.

It's a two-years-out-of-date flu shot. Enough with comparing it to MMR or whatever. Enough already. Stop it.
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Old 07-09-2022, 10:52 AM
 
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Originally Posted by tribecavsbrowns View Post
The reason people are up in arms is because those vaccines suppress the level of a pathogen to the point where it does not spread, and this one does not. Read it again if you have to. That's the reason. Period.
It’s also related to informed consent. Peoples should be able to weigh the risks with the benefits when it comes to putting something in their body without facing external coercive pressures such as the loss of a career, education, income, etc.
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Old 07-09-2022, 10:54 AM
 
50,730 posts, read 36,431,973 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tribecavsbrowns View Post
The reason people are up in arms is because those vaccines suppress the level of a pathogen to the point where it does not spread, and this one does not. Read it again if you have to. That's the reason. Period.

It's a two-years-out-of-date flu shot. Enough with comparing it to MMR or whatever. Enough already. Stop it.
That’s not the reason, because people were up in arms about it before we even knew how effective it would be. And while it is clear it is not effective against all the variance, I do believe it has helped protect people from the more serious effects of Covid. And the nursing home I work at, during our last outbreak about a month ago we had 21 people who are positive with Covid, all elderly. Only one went to the hospital for a brief time. Most of the residents did not even half symptoms. It was a far cry from how Covid affected the elderly before they were vaccinated. I don’t really know for certain that there’s a connection, but I feel there is.
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Old 07-09-2022, 10:55 AM
 
Location: Cleveland
4,649 posts, read 4,970,942 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
It’s also related to informed consent. Peoples should be able to weigh the risks with the benefits when it comes to putting something in their body without facing external coercive pressures such as the loss of a career, education, income, etc.
That is also a strong concern for most. For some, it's not a concern. But then, for some, no unprovoked assault on the dignity or autonomy of a worker is of any concern; the authority getting what it wants is the only concern.
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Old 07-09-2022, 10:57 AM
 
Location: Cleveland
4,649 posts, read 4,970,942 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
That’s not the reason, because people were up in arms about it before we even knew how effective it would be. And while it is clear it is not effective against all the variance, I do believe it has helped protect people from the more serious effects of Covid. And the nursing home I work at, during our last outbreak about a month ago we had 21 people who are positive with Covid, all elderly. Only one went to the hospital for a brief time. Most of the residents did not even half symptoms. It was a far cry from how Covid affected the elderly before they were vaccinated. I don’t really know for certain that there’s a connection, but I feel there is.
You didn't know, not "we." Going back to first principles, coronaviruses mutate like crazy, making vaccination unwieldy at the very best. That objective fact of the universe didn't suddenly change in 2020. You were led to believe that there was a miraculous scientific advance that sidestepped this objective fact, and thus, you were misled.

On the positive side, this is probably why your Covid outbreaks are mild. The current virus is not as virulent.
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Old 07-09-2022, 11:02 AM
 
15,063 posts, read 8,625,891 times
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Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
What happens if your body becomes a source of infectious disease that can endanger others? Are you willing to make an exception in that case? I’m not referring to Covid-19 specifically, but to diseases in general.
The moment infectious disease “in general” can be proven beyond challenge, then we can talk about it. Fair enough?

I’m sure you are, like most, totally unaware of the fact that there is a significant and compelling debate regarding the very existence of infectious disease itself. And this isn’t a new argument, as it has been taking place since the 1800’s when French scientist Antoine Bechamp challenged Pasteur’s germ theory. Bechamp postulates the “terrain theory”, which was based on his scientific observations that pathogens emerge from inside cells, and not from an outside source, such as is the accepted “germ theory” source of disease today.

I am not so foolish as to think for one nanosecond that I’ll be able to convince you or anyone else that viruses do not actually exist, and have never been proven to exist outside of a cell. The lies are too many, and the belief is far too ingrained in most, to even look at the evidence pointing in that direction. It sounds so totally preposterous, that few will give the idea the slightest glance.

But when simplified, it makes some sense … like the basic concept that the general health of a fish is directly related to the cleanliness of the water in which he swims. Bechamp’s “terrain theory” claims that the health of the human cell is similarly determined by its surrounding environment, and that all disease is the result of a poisoning of that environment, and not caused by germs, per se.

It’s a huge topic, but deemed too inappropriate among the mainstream consensus for anything other than abject ridicule. But there are growing numbers of scientists, medical doctors and biologists who are joining the “terrain theory” minority with very compelling arguments.

Other biological misnomers that have been proven inaccurate without much fanfare is genetic predetermination, which has long been accepted as proven fact, and still is. That being that a cell’s DNA determines what that cell will become, as it’s specific DNA code dictates.

But a Dr. Bruce Lipton proved that wrong way back in the 1970’s, when he was experimenting with stem cells. Dr. Lipton cloned a stem cell, which makes identical versions of the original. Therefore, based on genetic determination, all of those stem cells should produce the same thing, based on their identical DNA. However, when placed in different environment mediums, one could produce blood cells, another bone cells, etc. This would of course be impossible based on genetic determination, so the results which have been duplicated many times by other scientists totally disproves the accepted biological model of genetic determination, and that what a cell becomes is determined by its surrounding environment, not it’s DNA.

The implications of Dr. Lipton’s discovery literally turns biology upside down, and particularly when it comes to conventional medicine. One might expect such a discovery would become headline news and something warranting a Nobel Prize. It has been published in peer reviewed scientific journals, and has never been disproven.

Amazingly, it was, and still remains completely ignored.
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Old 07-09-2022, 11:08 AM
 
26,660 posts, read 13,735,487 times
Reputation: 19118
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
That’s not the reason, because people were up in arms about it before we even knew how effective it would be. And while it is clear it is not effective against all the variance, I do believe it has helped protect people from the more serious effects of Covid. And the nursing home I work at, during our last outbreak about a month ago we had 21 people who are positive with Covid, all elderly. Only one went to the hospital for a brief time. Most of the residents did not even half symptoms. It was a far cry from how Covid affected the elderly before they were vaccinated. I don’t really know for certain that there’s a connection, but I feel there is.
Vaccine mandates have typically been limited to children prior to the Covid vaccine with a few for healthcare workers (flu vaccine) and a lot for people in the military. Many adults were up in arms because the mandates suddenly applied to them and these vaccines were new with a lot of unknowns.
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Old 07-09-2022, 11:14 AM
 
26,660 posts, read 13,735,487 times
Reputation: 19118
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribecavsbrowns View Post
That is also a strong concern for most. For some, it's not a concern. But then, for some, no unprovoked assault on the dignity or autonomy of a worker is of any concern; the authority getting what it wants is the only concern.
That is the thing about bodily autonomy. One may not always agree with or understand someone else’s concerns but if they truly believe in bodily autonomy and choice they will stand up for that other people’s right to choose for themselves.

It’s about owning your own body.
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