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The rest of the world is irrelevant in this discussion. The law in Alabama, regardless of what police think, is that you do not have to show your drivers license as proof of ID unless you are operating a motor vehicle. There was no reason for Jennings to do anything other than give his name and address, which he did. That is all the law in Alabama requires.
they asked for id not drivers licence and drivers licence these days are default ID you playing stupid now. lol guy said i am rev jenkins no usual atire that reverends are wearing at ALL but hey you are who you are lol
If a Jehovah's witness comes directly on to your front door and knocks on it and speaks to you, that is not trespassing. But if he wanders on to your backyard or starts watering your shrubs, that is trespassing.
I am OK with him not having ID because most of us don't carry it at all times. But be nice and cordial to the officers, answer their questions without attitude and be ready to ask them to come to your house and having ID produced. Things defuse rapidly and you have the police willing to help you the next time something similar occurs.
I said front yard, not backyard. A visitor who isn't a gardener watering shrubs unsolicited but without indication not to would be weird and possibly engaging in criminal mischief, but at that point it wouldn't be trespassing.
I don't think the pastor's watering flowers constituted "reasonable suspicion." Yes, there was a call, but it was vague and officers know some calls turn out to be illegitimate. Get a full name and address, assume the story about being asked to do watering is true, and leave. At worst a criminal posing as somebody doing a favor probably would be spooked and soon drive off without breaking in or something. I wonder if it was the truck that raised an eyebrow. I don't think that was his.
Last edited by goodheathen; 08-28-2022 at 02:24 PM..
No.
"I’m Pastor Jennings. I live across the street."
There is fault on the police's side for not asking for his first name or which house on the street. I assume Pastor Jennings is how he introduces himself to most people, and it wouldn't be odd or suspicious. If the system in a police car can't find every housed local based on just a name and address, one of the cops could have walked over to the house to confirm with the wife that he lives there.
You know that if you identify yourself as "office worker Jones, I live across the street" that it's a vague way to identify yourself to the police. He knew darn well that the police needed a first name, last name and a street address, and so he immediately decided he was going to **** with the police and refuse to cooperate.
This guy knew that he could have ended all of this with a simple “I’m Pastor John Jennings, I live at 501 Main street, in that blue house across the street." Instead he kept walking away from the police, evading any assistance, getting increasingly more belligerent and acting like a jerk to two guys just trying to keep his neighborhood safe.
I said front yard, not backyard. A visitor who isn't a gardener watering shrubs unsolicited but without indication not to would be weird and possibly engaging in criminal mischief, but at that point it wouldn't be trespassing.
I don't think the pastor's watering flowers constituted "reasonable suspicion." Yes, there was a call, but it was vague and officers know some calls turn out to be illegitimate. Get a full name and address, assume the story about being asked to do watering is true, and leave. At worst a criminal posing as somebody doing a favor probably would be spooked and soon drive off without breaking in or something. I wonder if it was the truck that raised an eyebrow. I don't think that was his.
He admitted that this was not his home,and that the owners were away. Even if he was given permission, he hadn't identified himself yet to prove he was the guy given permission to water the flowers.
Come on already. what if some burglar goes to your house and tries to break in. A neighbor calls the police. The thief says he has permission to water your grass while you are away. The police buy it, and leave him to finish robbing you blind.
It will be great for home burglars now, the police can catch them in your yard or even in your home. The thief can simply claim you said they could water the grass and dust the silverware while you were away.
If you are on your own property you don't need to show any ID. When you are on someone else's property and the owner is not there or available to vouch for you, you are trespassing until proven otherwise.
Not according to Alabama law, as has already been explained in this thread.
If a Jehovah's witness comes directly on to your front door and knocks on it and speaks to you, that is not trespassing. But if he wanders on to your backyard or starts watering your shrubs, that is trespassing.
Nope. That's your personal definition, but that's not Alabama law.
You know that if you identify yourself as "office worker Jones, I live across the street" that it's a vague way to identify yourself to the police. He knew darn well that the police needed a first name, last name and a street address, and so he immediately decided he was going to **** with the police and refuse to cooperate.
This guy knew that he could have ended all of this with a simple “I’m Pastor John Jennings, I live at 501 Main street, in that blue house across the street." Instead he kept walking away from the police, evading any assistance, getting increasingly more belligerent and acting like a jerk to two guys just trying to keep his neighborhood safe.
He introduced himself unsolicited with presumably the title he gives to most people, without knowing why police were there or if anything was needed from him. I do not assume he knew the law, but the police are supposed to and it's on them to solicit the necessary info. Period. Nobody did a great job in that situation.
Edit: I think I got the timeline wrong, but he did give his name without explicitly being asked, and then he wasn't asked for a lengthier answer. The cop just skipped ahead to a non-existent ID requirement.
Last edited by goodheathen; 08-28-2022 at 03:37 PM..
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I just now watched the entire thing, which happened back in May and it's made the news cycle now I guess because he's filed suit.
After the woman recognizes him, and they now have his name and address and his criminal history is clear, they should have let him go. It's not workable that during the time he's in handcuffs, if they clear up the misunderstanding, they can't just erase the arrest which is what the cop said.
If they clear up a misunderstanding while they're in the neighborhood, they need to back off without charges.
He DID give them his name. Pastor Jennings, and that right there is my house.
I will say, his wife showed absolutely remarkable restraint under the circumstances.
The charges of "obstructing government operations" were dropped against him in June.
I just now watched the entire thing, which happened back in May and it's made the news cycle now I guess because he's filed suit.
After the woman recognizes him, and they now have his name and address and his criminal history is clear, they should have let him go. It's not workable that during the time he's in handcuffs, if they clear up the misunderstanding, they can't just erase the arrest which is what the cop said.
If they clear up a misunderstanding while they're in the neighborhood, they need to back off without charges.
He DID give them his name. Pastor Jennings, and that right there is my house.
I will say, his wife showed absolutely remarkable restraint under the circumstances.
The charges of "obstructing government operations" were dropped against him in June.
Do you see the irony in this sentence you were trying to highlight? He DID NOT give them his name. As it’s been mentioned countless times on this thread, “Pastor” is not an identifiable first name. It’s akin to someone saying I’m “Officer Jones.”
The point was that most of us do not carry ID when going for a walk around our own neighborhood, or when going outside to tend the garden or mow the lawn, or a hundred other things. We do not live in a police state. We are not required to carry ID whenever we step out of the house. We are not a "papers please" country.
Sadly, this is the kind of ruse our government will use to start insisting on people having a bar code tattooed on them or an RFID chip implanted so they have their ID on them at all times, no questions asked. Of course, some people were warned this day would come. It's called Mark of the Beast.
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