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Old 10-18-2022, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Cali
14,228 posts, read 4,593,980 times
Reputation: 8320

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Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
You want numbers?

"Top 10 Countries Hosting the Highest Number of International Refugees (mid-2021 data):

Turkey — 3,696,831
Jordan — 3,027,729
Uganda — 1,475,311
Pakistan — 1,438,523
Lebanon — 1,338,197
Germany — 1,235,160
Sudan — 1,068,339
Bangladesh — 889,775
Iran — 800,025
Ethiopia — 782,896

Who determines the number of refugee admissions?

The President of the United States. The number of refugees accepted to the United States each year is set by the President in consultation with Congress that must occur before October 1 each year.

What is the refugee limit for fiscal year 2022?

125,000. Although historically the U.S. has resettled more refugees than any other country, its resettlement program has not kept up with increase of the global refugee population that has increased by about 50 percent over the past five years. In FY 2021, the number of refugees resettled was the lowest since the passage of the Refugee Act of 1980.

While there were approximately 26 million refugees worldwide as of fiscal year (FY) 2020, the U.S. currently resettles just a small fraction of them. Less than 1 percent of the total number of displaced people on the world has been resettled to one of 37 current resettlement countries each year."

https://immigrationforum.org/article...-resettlement/

I am not POTUS or able to consult with Congress about this, and for the most part I can go along with the number accepted by the U.S. rather than protest given all considered. This is not the big "hot button" for me as it is for lots of people who are always in a big twist about our immigration policies and/or failings. About this too, I think we can do better, but that's not saying much.
Why did you cherry pick only one year?

How about total numbers of the last 10 or 20 years combined? Country X could have 10 million refugees in 2010 and then 5000 refugees in 2011. Country Y could have 5000 refugees in 2010 and 100,000 in 2011. Does that mean country Y is accepting more refugees?

Also, did you include the numbers of illegal immigrants?
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Old 10-18-2022, 11:38 AM
 
29,551 posts, read 9,720,681 times
Reputation: 3472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
I, on the other hand, default to all politicians being thieves and murderers on their best day. ALL of them. Every last one. If they hold office, they rob, pillage and murder...and they do it for money. It's baked into the job description of holding a monopoly on force and violence, as well as sole control over the writing, enforcing and adjudicating of "the law."

The more people who take to whatever broadcast medium they choose to throw shade at the tyranny of any and all government, the better. America started as entirely distrustful to large central government. We have lost our way, and I for one welcome anyone who wants to criticize, lampoon, insult, protest, roast, etc any/all of the political class so that more citizens default to distrusting them at every turn.

Country runs better when the People rightly consider government their enemy.

If Tulsi adds to those voices that foment that distrust...GOOD FOR HER.
I am very familiar with your perspective and share much of the same skepticism given the influence of so much money that drives so much of what goes on in politics, and no doubt your default view is what feeds this "fake news" general acceptance these days. Especially if it paints all things politics and government in a bad way. I get it, but the alternative is what?

The answer to that question is in part where everyone needs to get specific about the truth of these matters, and I mean with specifics instead of these broad-brushed generalities. Specifics like falsely claiming the results of an election are not legitimate for example. How is making false claims or lying about such a thing good for anyone?

If it were true, that's one thing, but when it's falsehoods used as the means to justify the end? No thank you. This is what I mean about the importance of knowing the truth of these matters whether they suit our perspective or not. I don't have faith in more people following broadcast medium if more and more are simply wanting to promote more falsehoods. Seems there is too much of that going on now that more and more of these conspiracy types can make good money peddling their conspiracies.

Perhaps all to say, whether it be politics, the news, talking heads, the military, the police force, and all our institutions private and public, there is always "the good, bad and ugly." We're best served to promote the good while doing our best to mitigate the bad and ugly in my opinion. No easy trick, and we'll never achieve any real satisfaction, but belly aching about everything bad doesn't do the trick either. Here's to those who are in a better position to promote the good and weed out the bad in any case.

Here's to them as it's time for me to sign off now...
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Old 10-18-2022, 11:49 AM
 
29,551 posts, read 9,720,681 times
Reputation: 3472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Du Ma View Post
Why did you cherry pick only one year?

How about total numbers of the last 10 or 20 years combined? Country X could have 10 million refugees in 2010 and then 5000 refugees in 2011. Country Y could have 5000 refugees in 2010 and 100,000 in 2011. Does that mean country Y is accepting more refugees?

Also, did you include the numbers of illegal immigrants?
I've really got to sign off now, but before I do, I've got no real sense "exchanging notes" with you about any of this will be productive. I've read enough of your comments to know this, but please note I did not "cherry pick" anything. I tried to look up some data and history that would put your question and/or answer into perspective. Regardless the numbers, I gave you the best answer I could. The part you seem to have missed beyond the numbers.

If the data I pulled up is so skewed far as you are concerned, by all means provide the numbers that are giving you so much heartburn about this issue. Never mind just about all Americans are here as a result of immigration. Never mind the numbers as compared to other countries facing the same challenges. Go ahead and provide the data that demonstrates the number of immigrants accepted by the United States that is too much far as you are concerned. Legal and/or illegal. As a percentage of the total United States population. Never mind the number of refugees accepted by other countries with lower total populations and space compared to the U.S.

What are the actual numbers far as you are concerned over the total of say the last two decades? How much is too much far as you are concerned and why? Show me your data and where it comes from.

Finally the bottom-line question. Why are these people coming here in such numbers if not because Americans pay them to work here? Legal and illegal.
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Old 10-18-2022, 11:52 AM
 
13,961 posts, read 5,625,642 times
Reputation: 8615
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
I am very familiar with your perspective and share much of the same skepticism given the influence of so much money that drives so much of what goes on in politics, and no doubt your default view is what feeds this "fake news" general acceptance these days. Especially if it paints all things politics and government in a bad way. I get it, but the alternative is what?
Government having less power, the people having more. That's what. Prior to the 16th Amendment, the federal government cost 2-3% of the GDP annually. Since the Congress voted themselves the ability to vote themselves as much of your money as they please, fed.gov averages 19% of the GDP annually.

We have 150 years of history as a valid alternative. We have half way between now and then, something like just 9-10% of GDP as size of fed.gov as an alternative. We have any iota of diminishing their power over us as an alternative. Lots and lots of alternatives to Almighty Supreme Federal Government Behemoth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
The answer to that question is in part where everyone needs to get specific about the truth of these matters, and I mean with specifics instead of these broad-brushed generalities. Specifics like falsely claiming the results of an election are not legitimate for example. How is making false claims or lying about such a thing good for anyone?
Lying and misinformation STARTS with the government, proceeds from their media cohorts and then filters to us. We are consumers of false info, not suppliers. And THAT is what grinds the media-political complex's gears - they don't want any competition in the information CREATION market. All these new voices on all these new platforms are saying whatever they want, whenever they want, to whomever chooses to tune in. The government and media have lost control over PRODUCTION of the narrative, and they are hopping mad about it.

Good. Let them be. They lied first, most loudly and most often. Now we get to say we don't believe you, and we get tell others not to believe them. Is Tulsi's fake news any worse than Biden's? Politicians speak fake news as their native tongue, but you have these serious concerns about various media platforms doing the same thing? None of them have the nuclear launch codes or a monopoly on force and violence, but the guy who does...he can lie all day long because that's the way the system is supposed to work?
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
If it were true, that's one thing, but when it's falsehoods used as the means to justify the end? No thank you. This is what I mean about the importance of knowing the truth of these matters whether they suit our perspective or not. I don't have faith in more people following broadcast medium if more and more are simply wanting to promote more falsehoods. Seems there is too much of that going on now that more and more of these conspiracy types can make good money peddling their conspiracies.

Perhaps all to say, whether it be politics, the news, talking heads, the military, the police force, and all our institutions private and public, there is always "the good, bad and ugly." We're best served to promote the good while doing our best to mitigate the bad and ugly in my opinion. No easy trick, and we'll never achieve any real satisfaction, but belly aching about everything bad doesn't do the trick either. Here's to those who are in a better position to promote the good and weed out the bad in any case.

Here's to them as it's time for me to sign off now...
The "good" is the people as sovereign individuals with natural rights. The "bad" is anyone or anything dedicated to taking away or limiting those natural rights. Easy.
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Old 10-18-2022, 12:24 PM
 
Location: Florida
14,968 posts, read 9,810,543 times
Reputation: 12079
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
Government having less power, the people having more. That's what. Prior to the 16th Amendment, the federal government cost 2-3% of the GDP annually. Since the Congress voted themselves the ability to vote themselves as much of your money as they please, fed.gov averages 19% of the GDP annually.

We have 150 years of history as a valid alternative. We have half way between now and then, something like just 9-10% of GDP as size of fed.gov as an alternative. We have any iota of diminishing their power over us as an alternative. Lots and lots of alternatives to Almighty Supreme Federal Government Behemoth.

Lying and misinformation STARTS with the government, proceeds from their media cohorts and then filters to us. We are consumers of false info, not suppliers. And THAT is what grinds the media-political complex's gears - they don't want any competition in the information CREATION market. All these new voices on all these new platforms are saying whatever they want, whenever they want, to whomever chooses to tune in. The government and media have lost control over PRODUCTION of the narrative, and they are hopping mad about it.

Good. Let them be. They lied first, most loudly and most often. Now we get to say we don't believe you, and we get tell others not to believe them. Is Tulsi's fake news any worse than Biden's? Politicians speak fake news as their native tongue, but you have these serious concerns about various media platforms doing the same thing? None of them have the nuclear launch codes or a monopoly on force and violence, but the guy who does...he can lie all day long because that's the way the system is supposed to work?

The "good" is the people as sovereign individuals with natural rights. The "bad" is anyone or anything dedicated to taking away or limiting those natural rights. Easy.
Well done.
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Old 10-19-2022, 07:08 AM
 
Location: 49th parallel
4,608 posts, read 3,301,434 times
Reputation: 9593
The problem with painting all politicians with a black brush and saying they're all liars and out for their own gain, is that most people who do this don't offer constructive solutions.

We had a similar situation in our condo once: no one liked what the HOA Board was doing and everyone shrieked and moaned and groaned and said how awful these people were and how they did everything wrong and spent all our money and they should be taken out and shot, etc.etc. But when the annual meeting came around, no one wanted to run for the Board because all that ever came out of the populace was complaints. No one had any ideas or wanted to try to turn things around because it had gotten so toxic.

We can be thankful that some people truly want to serve in these offices and should do our research, find who they are, and support them instead of just saying everyone who is a public servant is a liar and a thief.
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Old 10-19-2022, 07:46 AM
 
29,551 posts, read 9,720,681 times
Reputation: 3472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
Government having less power, the people having more. That's what. Prior to the 16th Amendment, the federal government cost 2-3% of the GDP annually. Since the Congress voted themselves the ability to vote themselves as much of your money as they please, fed.gov averages 19% of the GDP annually.

We have 150 years of history as a valid alternative. We have half way between now and then, something like just 9-10% of GDP as size of fed.gov as an alternative. We have any iota of diminishing their power over us as an alternative. Lots and lots of alternatives to Almighty Supreme Federal Government Behemoth.

Lying and misinformation STARTS with the government, proceeds from their media cohorts and then filters to us. We are consumers of false info, not suppliers. And THAT is what grinds the media-political complex's gears - they don't want any competition in the information CREATION market. All these new voices on all these new platforms are saying whatever they want, whenever they want, to whomever chooses to tune in. The government and media have lost control over PRODUCTION of the narrative, and they are hopping mad about it.

Good. Let them be. They lied first, most loudly and most often. Now we get to say we don't believe you, and we get tell others not to believe them. Is Tulsi's fake news any worse than Biden's? Politicians speak fake news as their native tongue, but you have these serious concerns about various media platforms doing the same thing? None of them have the nuclear launch codes or a monopoly on force and violence, but the guy who does...he can lie all day long because that's the way the system is supposed to work?

The "good" is the people as sovereign individuals with natural rights. The "bad" is anyone or anything dedicated to taking away or limiting those natural rights. Easy.
In 1900, GDP was just under $300 billion. Today, we're looking at an estimated U.S. GDP of over $25 trillion. Just saying. Looking back at 150 years of history in this regard is something like considering the good old days of horse and carriage versus planes, trains and electric vehicles.

Again specifics please. Everyone would love a smaller, less expensive, more efficient government. Of course, but which expenses, programs, specifically should be eliminated or reduced and why? The military perhaps? Let's look at the military we had 150 years ago? All for it, and good luck with all that in today's world! Also please provide me specifics with respect to what power the government has over you and me. What sort of things do we want to do that we can't because of "Almighty Supreme Federal Government Behemoth?" Far as I can tell anyway, I'm enjoying all the natural rights I'd like to enjoy. I'm enjoying a life and life style far better than I deserve. In part thanks to government. In part having nothing to do with government.

Doesn't matter to me in the least where the lying and misinformation STARTS. My focus instead is on how to make it end, or at least be reduced. At a minimum countered with the truth. Two, three, four wrongs don't make a right sort of thing...
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Old 10-19-2022, 07:48 AM
 
29,551 posts, read 9,720,681 times
Reputation: 3472
Quote:
Originally Posted by ndcairngorm View Post
The problem with painting all politicians with a black brush and saying they're all liars and out for their own gain, is that most people who do this don't offer constructive solutions.

We had a similar situation in our condo once: no one liked what the HOA Board was doing and everyone shrieked and moaned and groaned and said how awful these people were and how they did everything wrong and spent all our money and they should be taken out and shot, etc.etc. But when the annual meeting came around, no one wanted to run for the Board because all that ever came out of the populace was complaints. No one had any ideas or wanted to try to turn things around because it had gotten so toxic.

We can be thankful that some people truly want to serve in these offices and should do our research, find who they are, and support them instead of just saying everyone who is a public servant is a liar and a thief.
Well done.
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Old 10-19-2022, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Western PA
10,854 posts, read 4,534,722 times
Reputation: 6708
but aside from all that, did anybody watch her speak last night? since she is apparently capable of generating 39 pages of content with a whisk of her hand...
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Old 10-22-2022, 06:18 PM
 
Location: Milky Way Galaxy
1,855 posts, read 796,679 times
Reputation: 2351
I actually think Gabbard as VP and Mike Pompeo for president would be a republican win


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRyOHXt49WI
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