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Old 01-25-2023, 09:53 AM
 
Location: NYC
5,204 posts, read 4,664,250 times
Reputation: 7960

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Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyHobkins View Post
Its just a reason to give more American taxpayer money into the globalist hands. Just about everything you know about the war in Ukraine from the American media is false.

Putin has won the war.
So the Russians have been telling us everyday. And yet the war continues and Russia continues to freak out over every move the West makes.
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Old 01-25-2023, 09:53 AM
 
30,118 posts, read 11,743,006 times
Reputation: 18628
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I don't view Ukraine that way but then that's not the only reason to support Ukraine.

Let me be cold-blooded logical.

1) It sends a message as to whose gear works and whose doesn't. That gives us clout and allows us to sell our stuff and the opposite for the Russians.

2) We get to test stuff out in live combat paid with someone elses blood.

3) It gives Russia pause after letting them just snatch the Crimea. This sends a message to other countries too. (See China)

In short, even if one gives zero poops about Ukraine it can be in our self interests to do what we're doing.

P.S. Tired of hearing about "Ukraine is racist"...eastern europe is racist, China is racist, Africa is racist....so what?
Good points. I do think it has given China pause in invading Taiwan.
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Old 01-25-2023, 10:00 AM
 
Location: NYC
5,204 posts, read 4,664,250 times
Reputation: 7960
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
Good points. I do think it has given China pause in invading Taiwan.
China has been preparing to invade Taiwan forever and it's no secret. However, that culture is extremely risk adverse. Ukraine war just added more reasons for them to delay. Russia is the opposite in terms of risk taking.
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Old 01-25-2023, 10:10 AM
 
947 posts, read 1,400,593 times
Reputation: 2332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Igor Blevin View Post
It is just not wise to escalate this war. Putin can't be expected to respond rationally.

The West's response to Putin's Ukraine war is just foolish.
OK, so let's say the West stands down, Russia takes over Ukraine and reintegrates it into "Greater Russia". Seeing that the West has stood by and done nothing (ring any bells from the 1930s with the Sudetenland and the anschluss with Austria?), Putin now sets his sights farther west. Specifically Estonia and Latvia, in each of which 20 to 25 percent of the population is ethnically Russian (ring any bells with the Donbas region?). Putin sends in his military to "protect the Russian-speaking population". Only difference this time is that both Baltic states are members of NATO, and under Article Five, an attack on one NATO member is an attack on all, so all 30 NATO members are now committed to fight Russia.

Better to stop Russia now rather than later (and also make Xi think twice about invading Taiwan).
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Old 01-25-2023, 10:12 AM
 
Location: NYC
5,204 posts, read 4,664,250 times
Reputation: 7960
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICS67 View Post
OK, so let's say the West stands down, Russia takes over Ukraine and reintegrates it into "Greater Russia". Seeing that the West has stood by and done nothing (ring any bells from the 1930s with the Sudetenland and the anschluss with Austria?), Putin now sets his sights farther west. Specifically Estonia and Latvia, in each of which 20 to 25 percent of the population is ethnically Russian (ring any bells with the Donbas region?). Putin sends in his military to "protect the Russian-speaking population". Only difference this time is that both Baltic states are members of NATO, and under Article Five, an attack on one NATO member is an attack on all, so all 30 NATO members are now committed to fight Russia.

Better to stop Russia now rather than later (and also make Xi think twice about invading Taiwan).
You should understand the majority of folks on this forum are Boomers and if the world goes back to the 1950s-80s, it would be the status quo they are comfortable with. So in their minds, the Soviets should own everything in Eastern Europe.
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Old 01-25-2023, 10:47 AM
 
30,118 posts, read 11,743,006 times
Reputation: 18628
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adhom View Post
China has been preparing to invade Taiwan forever and it's no secret. However, that culture is extremely risk adverse. Ukraine war just added more reasons for them to delay. Russia is the opposite in terms of risk taking.
I agree.
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Old 01-25-2023, 10:53 AM
 
30,118 posts, read 11,743,006 times
Reputation: 18628
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adhom View Post
You should understand the majority of folks on this forum are Boomers and if the world goes back to the 1950s-80s, it would be the status quo they are comfortable with. So in their minds, the Soviets should own everything in Eastern Europe.
I think it is more simple than that.

Trump likes Putin
Trump hates Biden
Putin hates Biden
Biden hates Putin

MAGA likes Trump
MAGA hates Biden

Biden says Putin is bad and Ukraine war is good so MAGA takes the knee jerk opposite point of view.

Its a very binary decision.
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Old 01-25-2023, 11:02 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
4,527 posts, read 3,732,644 times
Reputation: 5301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Igor Blevin View Post
It is just not wise to escalate this war. Putin can't be expected to respond rationally.

The West's response to Putin's Ukraine war is just foolish.
Ahh okay I see. So whenever I become a leader of a country, just act foolish and idiotic so people will bend over backwards for me.
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Old 01-25-2023, 11:03 AM
 
5,928 posts, read 3,693,478 times
Reputation: 16936
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I don't view Ukraine that way but then that's not the only reason to support Ukraine.

Let me be cold-blooded logical.

1) It sends a message as to whose gear works and whose doesn't. That gives us clout and allows us to sell our stuff and the opposite for the Russians.

2) We get to test stuff out in live combat paid with someone elses blood.

3) It gives Russia pause after letting them just snatch the Crimea. This sends a message to other countries too. (See China)

In short, even if one gives zero poops about Ukraine it can be in our self interests to do what we're doing.

P.S. Tired of hearing about "Ukraine is racist"...eastern europe is racist, China is racist, Africa is racist....so what?

DITTO. Good post. Can't rep you again... yet.
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Old 01-25-2023, 11:09 AM
 
5,928 posts, read 3,693,478 times
Reputation: 16936
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICS67 View Post
OK, so let's say the West stands down, Russia takes over Ukraine and reintegrates it into "Greater Russia". Seeing that the West has stood by and done nothing (ring any bells from the 1930s with the Sudetenland and the anschluss with Austria?), Putin now sets his sights farther west. Specifically Estonia and Latvia, in each of which 20 to 25 percent of the population is ethnically Russian (ring any bells with the Donbas region?). Putin sends in his military to "protect the Russian-speaking population". Only difference this time is that both Baltic states are members of NATO, and under Article Five, an attack on one NATO member is an attack on all, so all 30 NATO members are now committed to fight Russia.

Better to stop Russia now rather than later (and also make Xi think twice about invading Taiwan).
Good logic. Anyone who thinks that Putin would stop with annexing just part of Ukraine, or even ALL of Ukraine, doesn't understand Putin's goals.
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