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Old 12-11-2023, 12:16 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,620 posts, read 17,364,311 times
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Quote:
Who think China will Pearl Harbor us?
No one who actually knows anything.
China is a struggling fraud.
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Old 12-11-2023, 01:17 PM
 
Location: San Diego
5,767 posts, read 4,730,059 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
You have absolutely ZERO clue as to the strength of the US Navy.

Secondly, we have nukes.

You need to do a lot of reading and once you do, you'll be less worried because that's just not grounded in reality.
Yes we have nukes. But China has hyper-sonic missiles.

I really hope the US has hyper-sonic missiles, and that it's top secret and nobody knows about it. Otherwise, if China has them, and we don't... that's not good.

That said, I think the days of traditional warfare are pretty much over. The wars of the future will be fought with technology. All China needs to do is hack our electric grid or detonate an EMP. The US will fall within weeks without electricity.

Anybody ever read the book, "One Second After"?
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Old 12-11-2023, 01:25 PM
 
Location: Land of the Free
6,751 posts, read 6,757,970 times
Reputation: 7601
They're more likely to Temu us than Pearl Harbor us.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...hinas-temu-app
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Old 12-11-2023, 01:51 PM
 
25,858 posts, read 16,569,925 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dino1 View Post
I honestly believe that China senses we are a nation in decline, including our military, and as we speak are planning a sneak attack to end us as a world power. Our military is too small, our President is weak and senile, and the American people do not have the will to fight as they once did. I hope I am 100% wrong.
They don't have to do anything. Look at how politics is worming it's way into our military leadership. Promotions are being doled on based on diversity and gender equity and not so much on merit or ability.

All they have to do is sit back and wait for the thing to collapse under it's own weight.

I'm glad I was born at the peak of this country and grew up in a great time in a great place. It's sad to see it all fall apart but I have my memories.
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Old 12-11-2023, 02:14 PM
 
1,880 posts, read 657,255 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cw30000 View Post
Agreed except the 2 highlighted.

Capitalist society is NOT based on consumption. It is based on investment. Example is the 19th to mid 20th century USA. Savings, lead to investment, lead to real growth in purchasing power, and that drive the economy.
Investment falls under the general heading of 'consumption'. China's Country Garden and Evergrande are examples of excessive investment into one area -- real estate. China can no longer deny the existence of 'ghost cities' where literally there are empty apartment buildings, and not only that, the demand for this kind of investment resulted in questionable construction methods and procedures in those 'ghost cities'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cw30000 View Post
Yes, China's one child policy is an issue, but this one child policy really just an issue for people living in the city. People living in the village, as most people were when the policy was enforced, were not strictly enforced. Even if China's population is reduced by 50%, they still have more people than the US. It is true that China export their highest quality product, but this is due to China suppressed their currency. If they allow the RMB flow, the will consume more internally.
The issue is which demographic group which is the 20-50 yrs old.

Below 20 yrs old, you are dependent on your parents.

Between 20-50 yrs old is when you are getting your start in life, got your station in life, start a family, and sustain a family.

Older than 50 yrs old is when your consumption yrs begins to decline. Your children are mostly on their own. Whatever you consume is just to sustain your life.

There are two types of generation: physical and cultural.

The physical generation is between the age range of 16 - 30 yrs old. This is the child bearing and raising yrs and also the safest. This is when fertility and virility are at their highest.

The cultural generation is when you are retired but still participating in society. You can still vote, create arts, or run a business. This group's age range is 20 - 80 yrs old.

China's one-child policy affected the physical generation, as in keeping that quantity artificially low. As if that is not bad enough, China's cultural preference for boys resulted in today's estimated 30+ million men that will never be able find brides, further compounding the demographic problem. Going back ten yrs ago, there were reports of men only villages.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...e-of-bachelors
The normal human birth ratio is 106 males for every 100 females. In China, that has risen to 118 boys. That means 30 to 50 million men will fail to find wives over the next two decades, according to Prof Li Shuzhuo of the institute for population and development studies at Xi'an Jiaotong University.

It is equivalent to every male in the UK dying a bachelor.

Experts have warned that these unmarried "bare branches" pose a threat to social stability. Some suggest that excess men leads to more crime and sexual violence; officials have warned of increased women trafficking. Already, women are kidnapped and sold as wives, as villagers in Banzhushan acknowledge.
Thirty to fifty is a terrible statistical range but that underscored the enormity of China's demographic problems. Simply put, the Chinese know they have a bad problem but unable to agree on how much is worse before they can guess the worst.

You can kill a baby once conceived but you cannot force people to have sex. But then again, given the brutality of the one-child policy, it would not be beyond the imagination that the Chinese government would resort to institutionalized rapes in trying to solve the demographic decline.

So...Will China preemptively militarily attack US for any reason or for something like pre war JPN back in the 1930s? All we need to do is maintain the current deterrence capability for the next 10 yrs and the answer will be 'No'. But more like 'No can do'.
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Old 12-11-2023, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Western PA
10,946 posts, read 4,610,728 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Universe93B View Post
That's impossible - it is still extremely difficult for anyone to defeat America militarily. Yeah, you can bomb an important base or territory of the US or whatever, but they'll get flattened as a US military response.

The only way to probably defeat America is most likely what Osama bin Laden had said - through a network of terrorist attacks and other warfare (electronic, electricity, etc) that will bring down America's economy and "destroy it within." Attacking it with planes, bombs, tanks is just ridiculous due to our strength and geography.

Now that doesn't stop China from causing other shenanigans around the world by attacking Taiwan and other areas hoping the US doesn't get involved.

but this is like the aircraft carrier question.


they dont have to BEAT us. Its just as hard for us to get THERE, as it has always been for someone to get HERE.


Havent I written for decades that the US is protected by 2 'moats'? (hint: yes)


If someone gets the upper hand in the water, we are just as trapped as someone attacking us is handicapped.


And related sidebar...this is ALSO why the joints are NUTS for sending 2 of our carriers to the med to fight or threaten people that dont have navies OR air forces.


All those 'attacks' on our ships, were not ever attacks. The ruskies wanted to see how our new whiz band comm linked defensive net worked, so a proxy shot the equivalent of an estes rocket at the ships and LISTENED to what happened as we shot it down.


The end game? They do not need to sink a carrier today to remove it from our response capability. As I said many a time, they only need to SLOW it. If it cannot hit xxx knots (<----the way speed is measured on water) then they cannot launch jet aircraft, catapults be damned. The E2x's on deck, aint gonna fight.


THAT is the holy grail here, to remove our ability to project non-nucu-lah power. then, the pacific rim is theirs.
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Old 12-11-2023, 03:57 PM
 
1,676 posts, read 1,538,387 times
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Does OP even know why Pearl Harbor happened in the first place? Somehow I doubt it.
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Old 12-11-2023, 04:04 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,856 posts, read 24,975,730 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCMann2 View Post
Does OP even know why Pearl Harbor happened in the first place? Somehow I doubt it.

It happened largely in response to the USA placing an embargo/restrictions on commodities Japan needed to continue it's war of aggression against China.



https://history.state.gov/milestones...5/pearl-harbor
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Old 12-11-2023, 04:10 PM
 
18,863 posts, read 8,512,683 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
It happened largely in response to the USA placing an embargo/restrictions on commodities Japan needed to continue it's war of aggression against China.



https://history.state.gov/milestones...5/pearl-harbor
And there is no such threat today.
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Old 12-11-2023, 04:34 PM
 
1,676 posts, read 1,538,387 times
Reputation: 2381
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
It happened largely in response to the USA placing an embargo/restrictions on commodities Japan needed to continue it's war of aggression against China.



https://history.state.gov/milestones...5/pearl-harbor
Correct.


Questions OP should ask themself:


1. Is China engaging in aggressive expansionism?
2. Do the conditions in China exist that would prompt aggressive military expansionism?
3. Is China lacking in resources that can only be obtained via aggressive military expansionism?


Discovering the answers to these questions and more will tell OP that their paranoid thoughts of China planning to "Pearl Harbor us" are just that - paranoid thoughts.
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