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Old 12-27-2023, 11:52 AM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,025 posts, read 14,201,797 times
Reputation: 16747

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Quote:
Originally Posted by scorpio516 View Post
Voter and elector are different things.
Technically, perhaps. But one could not be an elector without being a citizen. So it's moot.
And the OP was about VOTING.

If you're assuming elector = one in the electoral college, that's not the intent.
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Old 12-27-2023, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Florida
14,968 posts, read 9,807,317 times
Reputation: 12079
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisC View Post
1) Any election fraud or attempted election fraud is punishable by immediate execution.
2) Any attempt to curtail election process observation by multiple parties is punishable by immediate execution.
3) Any ballot harvesting schemes or attempts to cast votes for the deceased, cats, dogs, 57 Chevys is punishable by immediate execution.
4) Any attempt at "counting" ballots at 2 AM behind locked doors is punishable by immediate execution.

That's a good start.
I prefer punishment or revoke their citizenship therefore their right to vote.
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Old 12-27-2023, 11:58 AM
 
Location: Florida
14,968 posts, read 9,807,317 times
Reputation: 12079
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinytrump View Post
Thank you. Can’t be a subject of a free Government, if you don’t have a say so.
What about children? or those on work visa's? They're subjects without voting rights.
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Old 12-27-2023, 12:00 PM
 
Location: Kansas
25,962 posts, read 22,113,827 times
Reputation: 26695
Photo ID required (as we do in KS), at least 18 years old prior to the election, no voting while serving time in jail (convicted) or prison - voting restored after the time is served, voting in person is dicey as there would be exceptions, actually many. We voted a couple of times by mail, had to sign on the outside of the envelop and swear we were signing it, and signatures were verified, but I don't think they verify the signature anymore which is troubling.

Good idea about the 2 years, as I often think that people not entitled to vote steal the identities of dead people. Another thing I saw was a business man in town really wanting the tax increase, campaigning hard for it. I came to realize that he managed a large nursing home on the other side of town that sat pretty much alone in that area. They had almost 100% of the people in that area vote for the tax increase, while the rest of the town was very against it. So, that is a growing issue. I suspect the same could apply to anyone that is not mentally competent in an institutional setting.

I counted paper ballots in the first election I voted in, and it would have been so easy for them to cheat, and modern technology would tend to make it even easier. I think paper ballots are a better bet.

I don't know the answer for fair elections in the USA, but with freedoms disappearing, it may not make a difference much longer.
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Old 12-27-2023, 12:01 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,025 posts, read 14,201,797 times
Reputation: 16747
Geo.Wash. Sums it up nicely in 1783 - long before the constitution
. . .
“It may be laid down, as a primary position, and the basis of our system, that every citizen who enjoys the protection of a free government, owes not only a proportion of his property, but even of his personal services to the defence of it, and consequently that the Citizens of America (with a few legal and official exceptions) from 18 to 50 Years of Age should be borne on the Militia Rolls, provided with uniform Arms, and so far accustomed to the use of them, that the Total strength of the Country might be called forth at Short Notice on any very interesting Emergency.”
- - - George Washington; "Sentiments on a Peace Establishment" in a letter to Alexander Hamilton (2 May 1783); published in The Writings of George Washington (1938), edited by John C. Fitzpatrick, Vol. 26, p. 289.
ORIGINAL RULES :

Every CITIZEN (consenting to be governed) owed a portion of his property (taken via taxes), owed services to defend it, and was obligated to perform military duty from age 18 to 50. Since voting age was 21, every prospective voter had to have done at least 3 years of militia duty (18, 19, 20, 21).

This was derived from the end of the Declaration wherein the Founders (and subsequent citizens) pledged their lives, their fortunes and their sacred honor to establish and serve the governments instituted to secure endowed rights.

Modern Americans are unaware that citizenship must be voluntary, lest the duties become involuntary servitude. And no, they're not the first to make this mistake.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War
“The great draft riot in New York City in July 1863 involved Irish immigrants who had been signed up as citizens to swell the vote of the city's Democratic political machine, not realizing it made them liable for the draft.
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Old 12-27-2023, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Florida
14,968 posts, read 9,807,317 times
Reputation: 12079
Quote:
Originally Posted by webster View Post
How are 150,000,000 people going to vote on one day?

Regarding owning real estate, do we then not allow renters to vote?
They can be renters if they also own real property... like land or a building. Property owners have 'skin' in the game.
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Old 12-27-2023, 12:12 PM
 
Location: Kansas
25,962 posts, read 22,113,827 times
Reputation: 26695
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
What you're basically trying to do, is tilt the playing field to the right.

You would allow someone to vote who owns a tiny lot with an old trailer on it, vs. someone who pays high rent in a city. You eliminate the young. You eliminate the infirm.

I believe some of your criteria already exists.

I agree with #5, which already exists in Texas, and #10 would be a good record/bookkeeping devise.
Well, I agree with ClaraC about 10% of the time, and we agree on this one. Those that rent do pay taxes through their rental payment, purchases, etc., and have a vested interest in inflation and illegal immigration, pretty much our two top issues going into the next election.

I think 18 is fine. I was capable of making an informed choice, and probably looked at it with more thought than those older that just voted "party".
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Old 12-27-2023, 12:14 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,025 posts, read 14,201,797 times
Reputation: 16747
Quote:
Originally Posted by webster View Post
Regarding owning real estate, do we then not allow renters to vote?
Some states did allow renters who paid taxes to vote.

Pre-1820 Obligations
. . .
Massachusetts
Constitution of 1780, Section III. House of Representatives
IV. Every male person, being twenty-one years of age, and resident in any particular town in this Commonwealth for the space of one year having a freehold estate within the same town, of the annual income of three pounds, or any estate of the value of sixty pounds, shall have a right to vote....

New York
Constitution of 1777
VII. That every male inhabitant of full age, who shall have personally resided within one of the counties of this State for six months immediately preceding the day of election, shall be entitled to vote for representatives; if, during the time aforesaid, he shall have been a freeholder, possessing a freehold of the value of twenty pounds, within the said county, or have rented a tenement therein of the yearly value of forty shillings, and been rated and actually paid taxes to this State shall be entitled to vote.

New Jersey
Constitution of 1776
All inhabitants of this colony of full age, who are worth fifty pounds and have resided within the county in which they claim to vote for twelve months immediately preceding the election, shall be entitled to vote.

An inhabitant had a permanent, legal home, to wit, a domicile.

"INHABITANT - One who resides actually and permanently in a given place, and has his domicile there."
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p.782

"DOMICILE - A person's legal home. That place where a man has his true, fixed, and permanent home and principal establishment, and to which whenever he is absent he has the intention of returning."
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p.484

in CONTRAST

"RESIDENCE - Place where one actually lives ... Residence implies something more than physical presence and something less than domicile. The terms 'resident' and 'residence' have no precise legal meaning... [One can have many residences but only one domicile]
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p.1308, 1309

"RESIDENT - ...when used as a noun, means a dweller, habitant, or occupant; one who resides or dwells in a place for a period of more, or less duration...
Resident has many meanings in law, largely determined by statutory context in which it is used."
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p.1309

{Inhabitants have a permanent and legal home. Residents have something less than a permanent and legal home - and may be redefined.}

FREEHOLD. An estate for life or in fee.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, P. 665
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Old 12-27-2023, 12:20 PM
 
4,190 posts, read 2,508,104 times
Reputation: 6571
All those laws changed over time. What many don't realize is that many states permitted non-citizens to vote well into the 20th century.
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Old 12-27-2023, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Florida
4,545 posts, read 2,269,608 times
Reputation: 5877
Must vote in person on Election Day only. If you must have an absentee ballot, you must apply for it and be approved. You must show ID. No exceptions. Must be US citizen.
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