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Old 06-06-2008, 10:11 PM
 
20,329 posts, read 19,918,958 times
Reputation: 13440

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If neighbors spying on neighbors ala Castro's Cuba is what the Venezuelans want so be it.

They're free to vote out their leaders aren't they?

If not, too bad. They put Hugo in, they can live with their decision.

Not our problema.
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Old 06-07-2008, 01:31 AM
 
Location: North Carolina
799 posts, read 1,444,986 times
Reputation: 230
Chavez is actually hated in his home country. The military threatened to take power from Chavez not too long ago. I don't think it will take long for a revolt to spread across Venezuela.
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Old 06-07-2008, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Sacramento
14,044 posts, read 27,214,577 times
Reputation: 7373
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majordomo View Post
Chavez is actually hated in his home country. The military threatened to take power from Chavez not too long ago. I don't think it will take long for a revolt to spread across Venezuela.
Hopefully you are correct, we could use more leaders such as Columbia's Alvaro Uribe in the region.
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Old 06-09-2008, 06:22 PM
 
Location: Sacramento
14,044 posts, read 27,214,577 times
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Looks like Chavez has had a change of heart about this, due to international pressure:


Venezuela's Hugo Chavez to revoke spying law - Los Angeles Times (broken link)
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Old 06-09-2008, 07:35 PM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,190,876 times
Reputation: 3696
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewToCA View Post
The "wonderful" leader of Venezuela, Hugo Chavez, issued a new decree providing for four years of jail for those not willing to inform on their neighbors:
Before you know it, Chavez will be in bed with the telecoms spying on his own people. Wonder if he calls his the "El Patriota Actamundo"



Quote:
Originally Posted by Majordomo View Post
Chavez is actually hated in his home country. The military threatened to take power from Chavez not too long ago. I don't think it will take long for a revolt to spread across Venezuela.
True, the military supported by many people with business interests and ties with their former leader who was very much pro-US government attempted a coup and failed. The coup failed because the poor of Caracas, Venezuela took to the streets in the thousands and the citizens stormed the government and physically released Chavez. He is not hated by "his people", they were in fact the ones that have elected and reelected him not once, not twice, but thrice.

I understand Americans hate Chavez for his pontifications and anti-Bush rhetoric, but to suggest that he doesn't have the support of his people is simply wholly inaccurate.

I guess maybe the people of Venezuela keep a copy of the "Requirement" as a reminder of their past, who knows...

I implore you to recognize the Church as a lady and in the name of the Pope take the King as lord of this land and obey his mandates. If you do not do it, I tell you that with the help of God I will enter powerfully against you all. I will make war everywhere and every way that I can. I will take your women and children and make them slaves....The deaths and injuries you will receive from here on will be your own fault and not that of his majesty nor of the gentlemen that accompany me. -"The Requirement", read by Spaniards (in Latin) to native tribes they encountered in the New World
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Old 06-09-2008, 07:55 PM
 
Location: Southern New Jersey
1,725 posts, read 3,114,683 times
Reputation: 348
But isn't this the wonderful government of socialism? I thought socialism was a utopia!

How unfortunate for us that the government spies on us without our knowledge; at least if we knew our neighbors were spying we'd know what to watch out for.

This place is about 10 miles from my house:

Fusion Center (http://www.fcw.com/specials/fusioncenter/ - broken link)

Quote:
Team America describes the culture Kelly and his deputies want to create at the center, which houses local and federal law enforcement officials from various New Jersey state agencies; the Philadelphia Police Department; the Homeland Security Department; the Justice Department’s Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives; and the FBI.

Although counterterrorism was once the primary rationale for creating fusion centers, most of them now accept responsibility for responding to all threats. The centers play an increasingly prominent role in local law enforcement and are communication hubs for federal, state and local authorities.

At the center of the situation room is a 32-foot-by-12-foot multisource TV screen, which authorities can configure to receive dozens of feeds, including maps, cable and satellite TV broadcasts, and streaming video from fixed traffic cameras statewide or state police and National Guard helicopters.
EPIC Spotlight on Surveillance

Quote:
The federal Fusion Center Guidelines recommend that state fusion centers collect information on myriad issues: “Agriculture, Food, Water and the Environment, Banking and Finance, Chemical Industry and Hazardous Materials, Criminal Justice, Retail, Real Estate, Education, Emergency Services (Non-Law Enforcement), Energy, Government, Health and Public Health Services, Hospitality and Lodging, Information & Telecommunications, Military Facilities and Defense Industrial Base, Postal and Shipping, Private Security, Public Works, Social Services, [and] Transportation”[22] State fusion centers can find this data by accessing a variety of systems, such as:

1. “Driver’s license,

2. Motor vehicle registration,

3. Location information (411, addresses, and phone numbers),

4. Law enforcement databases,

5. National Crime Information Center (NCIC),

6. Nlets -- The International Justice and Public Safety Information Sharing Network, and the Terrorist Screening Center (TSC),

7. Criminal justice agencies,

8. Public and private sources (Security Industry databases, Identity Theft databases, Gaming Industry databases),

9. Regional Information Sharing Systems (RISS)/Law Enforcement Online (LEO), U.S. Department of Homeland Security’s (DHS) Homeland Security Information Network (HSIN), including the United States Private-Public Partnership (USP3) – formerly HSIN-CI. (Note: RISS, LEO, and DHS’s HSIN are currently collaborating on a network capability.),

10. Organizational and association resources (InfraGard, The Infrastructure Security Partnership),

11. Corrections,

12. Sex offender registries,

13. Violent Criminal Apprehension Program (VICAP),

14. Health- and Public Health-Related Databases (Public Health Information Network, Health Alert Network).”
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Old 06-09-2008, 08:23 PM
 
Location: Sacramento
14,044 posts, read 27,214,577 times
Reputation: 7373
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
I understand Americans hate Chavez for his pontifications and anti-Bush rhetoric, but to suggest that he doesn't have the support of his people is simply wholly inaccurate.
Actually, my dislike of Chavez focuses on his enthusiasm for nationalizing industries established in Venezuela, without being willing to have the value established by an independent (certified) third party. Being willing to take over a business for $.40 on the dollar of business value seems a bit unfair to me, especially when others have taken so much effort and risk to establish the industry in the first place.

Goes a bit beyond a tax policy.
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Old 06-11-2008, 04:30 PM
 
994 posts, read 1,544,475 times
Reputation: 148
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewToCA View Post
Actually, my dislike of Chavez focuses on his enthusiasm for nationalizing industries established in Venezuela, without being willing to have the value established by an independent (certified) third party. Being willing to take over a business for $.40 on the dollar of business value seems a bit unfair to me, especially when others have taken so much effort and risk to establish the industry in the first place.

Goes a bit beyond a tax policy.
Yes, he's a bit outrageous, but most of his people love him (not the rich though). He bashes Bush and quotes Noam Chomsky. He has a good idea of what the American Empire has done and continues to do in his region. Forty cents on the dollar might be a good return on stolen property.
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